Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?

[Danneaux]

...the nuisance of buying special biking shoes... for each season!

Hi Jim!

I have decided to approach this issue in the same way as AndyBG -- by having a go at using one pair of shoes with various covers and different socks for cold or wet weather.

For warm weather, I plan to use my usual thin CoolMax quarter-socks, the ones that come low on the ankle. These do for socks while having no shaft makes them pack in about half the space for touring.

For cooler weather or misting conditions, I think I'll get those toe covers mickeg mentioned.

For wet and/or cold weather, I plan to wear my Louis Garneau 3mm neoprene bootie-overshoes with brushed nylon lining to make installation/removal easier. I picked up two (pairs) on sale late last summer for the meager sum of USD$14 and while they work nicely with my Dettos, they are tailor made for the new Garneau SPD shoes -- yeah!

For really cold weather, I'll probably switch to thinnish wool-content socks and put a plastic bag over my toes inside the shoes and booties for extra warmth (wind-blocking, though it may not even be necessary with the neoprene overshoes).

The neoprene overshoes-booties add the most warmth by blocking the wind, but there is insulative value as well, and they are waterproof so are also an essential part of my rain gear. Being waterproof, they're likely to sweat inside, but at least my feet will be in warm water, and if I'm wearing wool socks, it won't matter so much. They foldover flat, so take minimal space with the rest of my rain gear which together weighs an astonishingly heavy 2.5lb/1.13kg! That includes my REI high-viz waterproof riding jacket (hoodless), my Sugoi stretch lycra waterproof helmet cover, my lightweight DWR Stearns rain pants, the Garneau neoprene booties, my Early Winters 30+ year-old Gore-Tex lobster claw gloves, and some spring-coil reflective trouser bands to keep the pants legs out of the chain -- oh! and a light stuff sack to store it all. The lot fits under the top-cap of one of my rear Ortlieb BikePacker panniers, where it is handy yet outside the bag itself so wet gear won't wet the inner contents. I still can't figure why it weighs so much, but I guess it all adds up.

That's the idea. It will be interesting to see how the clipless shoes work when it is colder using this scheme, but something similar worked pretty nicely with the Dettos in temps as low as -12F°/-24°C, so I'm hopeful it will do as well with the new shoes.

Best,

Dan. (...who can at last see the wisdom of SPD sandals; they always looked like one big Ouch with toe clips!)

[Relayer]

it was just the nuisance of buying special biking shoes... for each season!

I didn't find that a nuisance.  The Shimano MT series of shoes are so consistently sized and shaped that after I got the MT-41 (in Brown), I then went on to get the MT-61 (gore tex for winter - no need for overshoes down to -5C), and then MT-43 (in black) ... all online because I know the size and fit will be just fine and dandy, no hassle at all.   

[JimK]

I forget my exact history with this. I think my first shoes were a bit narrow but they worked well for a long time, on my Trek 520. I got some neoprene covers which fit them well and were really toasty. But the shoes started to wear out and the next shoes I got were a bit too big for the neoprene covers - thicker soles, as I recall. Someday maybe I will switch back but for the the platforms are fine.

[il padrone]

Your Shimano pedals will have very good bearings, but they are not sealed. The bearing is a cartridge that is screwed in/out with a plastic 'key' that you should have got with the pedal.




Once you have the pedal out you just fill the bearing slot in the pedal with grease then re-insert and fasten the bearing. As you tighten it up the new grease gets forced into the bearings and the old grease gets squeezed out through the axle ports until the clean grease appears. Wipe clean and refit your pedal. So easy that there's no excuse for a bearing failure.

http://ftp.cyclingnews.com/tech/fix/?id=shimano_pedals

[Danneaux]

The bearing is a cartridge that is screwed in/out with a plastic 'key' that you should have got with the pedal....So easy that there's no excuse for a bearing failure.

Except! if there was no little plastic "key" included in the box with the pedals. I gave the folks at REI and Performance a call asking and they all declare the boxes innocent of plastic service "keys". A call to two local mechanics reveals the disturbing news they use vise-grips (mole-grips) or Channel-Loc pliers instead and consider defacement 'n' parcel of the "service" procedure -- if they don't consider the pedals to be disposable. They apparently don't follow Shimano's "no torque" recommendation, 'cos they said the plastic collar frequently splits. Well, with pliers, that's to be expected. This is why I do my own work.

The boxes for the two pedals I have here from two different stores included pedals, cleats, and insurrections (those are what follow when the buyer finds there's no little plastic "key").

Sigh.

Just placed an order for one on eBay. Bst price was USD$4.35 delivered. Good to have on-hand and light enough to tour with if required.

Best,

Dan. (...who is very grateful you mentioned this, and thinks its absence probably explains the occasional pedal bearing failures I've seen mentioned in online reviews)

[il padrone]

Dan, maybe I'm mistaken and I had to buy mine. It was a long time ago. I never bothered tightening it with vice-grips, always found that just a good hard hand-tightening with the tool was enough and the bearing never came loose. I would not bother tightening it to the point that the plastic tool split 

You probably don't need to take the tool on tour, but nice to have it in the toolbox for maintenance sessions.

[macspud]

Being waterproof, they're likely to sweat inside

Well Dan, if they don't sweat inside the neoprene they definitely will sweat a lot inside a plastic bag, when ever I've gone this route I've wished I hadn't as it has always had the opposite of the desired effect. I'd forget about the plastic bags!

[il padrone]

Always found these to be good, and not too sweaty.

http://www.showerspass.com/catalog/accessories/club-shoe-covers




BTW neoprene is not really waterproof. Ask a scuba diver.

[NZPeterG]

Hi Dan,
1st off I have not read all 5 pages   Sorry!

So I have been riding and cycle touring for a long time (1st toured with Look Clipless pedals in 1988) and got the 1st pair of SPD that came into New Zealand in 1990    
I was also MTBing with original Dura-Ace 7401 pedals (basically a LOOK pedals) in the late 1989 with Road shoes (there was No MTB/Look shoes in NZ or maybe the world?).
So to the point SPD shoes for cycle touring I would love to get a pair of Specialized TAHOE SPORT shoes but we do not get them into NZ and they are going to be dropped in 2014  
I'm going to go with Specialized RIME MTB (http://www.specialized.com/us/en/ftr/shoes/mtb-shoes/rime-mtb)
So for your maybe a pair of Specialized WOMEN'S TAHOE SPORT (http://www.specialized.com/us/en/ftr/shoes/womens-mtb-shoes/womens-tahoe-sport)
So why? Because Specialized do not just make shoes with there name on! But design there shoes for your foot and to be used to cycle with! here is the low down.

SHOE TECHNOLOGY
Developed with Dr. Andy Pruitt of the Boulder Center for Sports Medicine, Specialized shoes combined with Body Geometry high performance footbeds help athletes ride farther, faster, in greater comfort, and with reduced chance of injury.

Farther: Built-in varus angulation improves pedaling alignment for greater power and endurance. Also prevents knee pressure and strain. Faster: Built-in arch support and metatarsal button eliminate hot spots and numbness and helps maximize your power transfer with proper arch support. Comfort: Three distinct levels of arch and metatarsal support help you customize your fit.

How I got the low down on a pair of great Cycle Touring shoes that people are using in hotter parts of the world and in the rain and that is SPD Sandal's  
I have got a pair after a friend (who has cycle about Asia) said that he is only cycle touring with one pair of shoes and that is Shimano SH-SD66 SPD Sandal's (http://bike.shimano.com/publish/content/global_cycle/en/us/index/products/shoe_test.html#mens/mtb/6/SH-SD66L) they would be good for you too. I will have too custom my ones (because I have very high arch's)

How Pedals   Shimano make some have good pedals with good bearing on most But! I like to have a little float so I 1st run Time ATAC pedals for years (10+) and now run Look Quartz pedals (how longer made but still for sale in some parts of the world)
I'm looking to change to Speedplay FROG Stainless MTB Pedals or the new just about to come out Speedplay Syzr  

Why? because I need to use some shims to help out my varus!

Please do not all start to shoot me down I how what I like and this is my point of view!
Also note I do work (Part time) at a Specialized Cycle Shop BUT I started using Specialized cycle shoes and part back in 1988.

I hope this is of help

Pete  

[Danneaux]

Please do not all start to shoot me down I how what I like and this is my point of view!
Also note I do work (Part time) at a Specialized Cycle Shop BUT I started using Specialized cycle shoes and part back in 1988.

I hope this is of help

Actually, this is all a great help, Pete. Here's the thing: I've got such weird feet, I have limited choice in what will work, so any additional data points offer the hope of something that might work even better. I also realize my new shoes are plastic, and can't be expected to last as long as my old leather Dettos, so I'll likely have to replace the Garneaus sooner.

With something as subjective as shoe fit, personal experience is sometimes the best indicator of what works, so I thank you for voting Specialized! Those Tahoes look like a nice shoe. The women's model seems to top out around a size 43, but one never knows; one company's 43 might be another's 44 or 45; sizes do seem to vary that much between brands. The Rime looks like a nice shoe as well, and I see it is one of the few available in a size 50 for those who need big ones. A friend's son went to work for Nike, in part because he wore size 16 US shoes (that works out to a size 49).

I've surely learned a lot from this effort to find clipless shoes and pedals. Right now (late July) seems a terrific time to buy cycling shoes here in the US. Nearly every model is deeply discounted at present. Second, a pretty nice if somewhat basic MTB shoe can be found at the USD$100 suggested price point and are on sale at present for USD$70-$90. For that, one can get a stiff, isolating nylon shoe sole, reasonable ventilation, and three velcro latches instead of two (better fit). Weight isn't as light as the higher-end models, but it isn't terrible either. Going up a notch in price (USD$150-$200) gets a ratchet-latch top closure, lighter stiffness in the form of different sole materials (fiberglass), and more upscale materials, maybe even the premium synthetic leather called Lorica at the upper end of the range. On sale, a surprising number of these drop near or to the USD$100 price-point. The shoes costing above USD$200 seem to include all the bells and whistles and often seem to include weather-treated leather and use carbon fiber for lightweight sole stiffness.

Always good to hear about alternatives, Pete; thanks!

Best,

Dan.

[JWestland]

Exustar does some nice shoes not sure if they're available in UK.

Your feet aren't "wierd" Dan, they're special

[Danneaux]

Exustar does some nice shoes not sure if they're available in UK.

They sure do! After seeing the UK website, I made a short-list of favorites to check out, but was disappointed to find only a few models are available from the US distributor. They do carry a really nice, really traditional-looking touring shoe: http://exustarusa.com/cycling-shoes/srt707-touring-shoes I was mighty tempted by these, but with no ready opportunity to try them on, it would be pretty chancy to get a good fit on the first try by mail. I don't know how stiff the soles would be, either. They look more on the "walkable" end of the spectrum, but do a terrific job of impersonating my Dettos!

Nashbar (now the closeout and discount arm of Performance Bikes here in the US) occasionally gets a few Exustars from time to time at good prices. This model looks very much like my Garneaus: http://cycling.exustar.com/index.php/en/products/2011-11-17-16-33-43/shoes/mtb/e-sm324-detail A high-value, entry-level show that is intended more for cycling and only secondarily for walking.

Your feet aren't "wierd" Dan, they're special

Jawine, you made my day and week with that; many thanks!  

All the best,

Dan.

[Danneaux]

Hi All!

"Oh, ow; knees and nephews!"

Still learning with the clipless pedals/shoes. I haven't slept more than a few hours each of the last several nights (not unusual for me) 'cos of some pretty severe knee pain (*very* unusual for me). Lots of icing, not so much riding, skeert to death I was going to stir-up the old knee injuries from the car wreck when I was 16 and used them to remove a window crank, bend a shift lever, and crack a steering column cover.

I usually do best with the foot's inner metatarsal heads (balls of feet) centered right over the pedal spindle, so I took care to do this and it *should* have been right...but wasn't. My knee pain felt like when my foot was too far rearward.

Then this morning, a revelation!

It wasn't the cleat placement doing me in, it was the release tension whose default was set too high for my needs! Twisting my heels outward to release just made the ol' knees twang like guitar strings.

I backed the cleat tension off nearly all the way and the cleats supplied with the pedals still hold me firmly in place for everything but the heel-out lateral release (I returned the multi-release cleats to REI unused still in the package, along with the other unopened pedals and the Giro Carbide shoes I'd tried only on the carpet and found could not be made to fit). Now, I can "click-in" at the top of my pedal stroke, midway, or at the bottom (to start, it took my body weight to click-in at the bottom) and I can click-out anytime with what feels like reasonable force for my knees. Rotating my leg in from the hip to release helps a lot too, leaving the knee fairly straight.

Three aspirin, some more ice, and I should be good to go tomorrow.

Release tension. Huh.

Best,

Dan. (...who enjoys newbie learning opportunities and hopes the knees feel better soonest)

[jags]

i found the look pedals a bit hard to get on with especially with black cleats ,once you click in that's it no movement unlike there red cleats which has a bit of float.the time pedals and cleats are great,but those pedal systems are only good for roadies,the mountainbike shoes and cleats are fantastic easy to click in and out and plenty of movement and still your feet are well secure in the pedals.

hope your knee pain disappears Dan thank god i never suffered it

[IanW]

Hi Dan,

Sorry to hear about the knee-pain

For reference, on the recumbent trike I have the pedal retention set to the maximum, 'cos releasing (both pedals) is a one-off at the end of a journey as I do *not* want to accidentally unclip.

In fact on the trike, I would probably happily use the single-mode-of-release cleats.

But I share 2 pairs of SPD shoes (actually 1 pair trainer-type shoes and one pair of sandals)
across both trike and bike, so I use the multi-release SPD cleats.

However on the bike I have the pedal retention set to a more medium / "middle" setting on the RHS pedal
and one (or two) "clicks" lower on the LHS as this is the side that I routinely unclip in traffic.
'cos both sides of the bike do *not* have to be set to the same retention.

Just my 2-cents worth
Ian