Click, Click , Bloody Click . . .

[frog]

Riding home on Thursday on my Raven Tour and even above the howling wind I could hear this click from around the cranks.  Every revolution just as the cranks went vertical.

I've tightened the bolts which hold the cassette in place (adjusted 2 weeks ago),  bolts which hold the chain ring on, pedals, and crank bolts.  The chain is well libricated and the chain guage says it's still in life. Libricated the pedals as well,

Anything else I should be looking at as well please?

[kwkirby01]

quote:Originally posted by frog

Riding home on Thursday on my Raven Tour and even above the howling wind I could hear this click from around the cranks.  Every revolution just as the cranks went vertical.

I've tightened the bolts which hold the cassette in place (adjusted 2 weeks ago),  bolts which hold the chain ring on, pedals, and crank bolts.  The chain is well libricated and the chain guage says it's still in life. Libricated the pedals as well,

Anything else I should be looking at as well please?

When you say cassette, do you mean eccentric? I had a similar problem a few months ago and it was the eccentric that needed tightening.
Kevin

[frog]

That's right the two bolts under the bottom bracket.  Sorry for the misdirection  []

[PH]

You’re not the only one, have a look here;
http://www.sjscycles.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=790&SearchTerms=chain,,

For more information on possibilities, have a look at this Sheldon Brown article;
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/creaks.html

[frog]

quote: You’re not the only one, have a look here;
http://www.sjscycles.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=790&SearchTerms=chain,,

For more information on possibilities, have a look at this Sheldon Brown article;
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/creaks.html

Flippin' 'eck!  What a nightmare!  At least the derailleur stuff isn't applicable.  I've got a gentle 20 mile ride planned for tomorrow morning.  I'd better take some ear plugs to stop myself getting paranoid.    

Thanks for the replies folks!!

[freddered]

I had a similar thing after I refitted chain.  I refitted it again and the click disappeared.  I suspect it was seated 1 tooth differently (I read somewhere, that link/tooth can wear togetether on a single sprocket setup, putting the chain back can fit non-matched links to non-matched teeth so you need to move the chain along by 1 tooth).

This could be total and utter nonesense but re-fitting the chain fixed mine.

[frog]

Went for the ride this morning.  Not much wind so I could hear almost everything without trying.  First few miles went fine but at the first hill, when I had to put some pressure on the drive train, back it came.  Bugger.

Was more than a bit concerned with removing the chain because this meant undoing the bottom bracket adjusting bolts and I didn't want to be in the postion where I'm trying to tighten up the bolts into holes whose side would collapse because they were too close to their adjacent ones.

Was a bit confused by trying to get it set in my mind which way the chain had come off it's circuit so I could be sure I actually turnbed it around rather than just putting it back on the same way it came off.  In the end I broke the chain at the top of its run,  Unwrapped it from the cogs and then changed left hand with right hand.

I'm used to all the malarky which goes with chain tensioners on rear mechs and remembering to feed the chain through the front changer so this was much easier than I expected.  Coupling the links back together was pretty easy too.

It was about now I started to kick myself.  I'd made no note of where the EBB was mounted in relation to it's side to side motion.  I decided that centrally with equal amounts of EBB recessed into the shell would have to do for the time being.  There's about 1mm recess on each side.

I used a 15mm ring/OJ spanner to tighten up the EBB adjusting bolts.  It's about 8 inches long so I just used fingers at the end of the spanner to finally tighten them up.  I was more afraid of stripping the thread on the shell or bolts rather than damaging the BB casing.  The latter can be replaced much easier than the former.

Now for a flash of inspiration.  I know someone's thought of this before but it deserves repeating.  You can make small adjustments in chain tension without the risk, well reduced risk, without making elongated holes in the BB.  The EBB only adjusts for half a revolution.  So,  If I want to adjust my chain the first time I adjust it clockwise.  The second time I adjust it anti-clockwise.  This way the holes are miles away from the first set.  On the third adjustment I rotate it back clockwise again.  The holes I'll make in the BB are the correct distance from the first set and I've had my chain correctly tensioned for the whole time.

There is probably no good engineering reason for doing it other than a taunt chain loks a lot better than a slack one.

So, job done and I'll find out just how I was at it at 06:10 tomorrow morning  []

[julk]

Frog,
If I understand your clockwise and anticlockwise method, one way you will be rotating the bottom bracket cups to the physically lowest position. Thorn warn that this can lead to the fastening bolts penetrating the thin part of the eccentric and damaging the bottom bracket cups....

[frog]

Interesting!  Does this mean the spikes on the end of the bolts penetrate the eccentric carrier or the bottom bracket?  

Just to clarify.  This means that all adjustment of the EBB should be done by rotating the unit FORWARD (in the direction of bike travel) so the meatier part of the EBB is presented towards the retaining bolts.

I'll just have a small panic and go and see whar havoc I've just wreaked on my pride and joy [:0]

[julk]

Frog,
The bolts are meant to make dents in the eccentric, but not go right through.
This thread makes interesting reading and looks relevant.
www.sjscycles.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=973

[frog]

Many thanks for that julk!!

as you can guess my EBB was in the wrong position.  Just spent half an hour putting it right by torchlight.  I'd be surprised if anything works in the morning  []

TVM!!!

[frog]

Glad to report an uneventful, quite, ride into work this morning!  Very many thanks for the advice chaps.  It's greatly appreciated.

For me this raises a second question.  Given the hammering the EBB shell takes by grace of the locking bolts deforming it's shape on each adjustment does this mean that when you buy a new chain should you also buy a EBB shell as well?

Price wise I'd have no real objection to that because previoiusly my chains were worn at 1000 miles and at £15 a pop that was five of them a year totalling £75 per annum on chains alone.  As the current chain is now over 3000 miles old and still has wear to spare I'd still be in pocket at the end of the year.

In fact, this is the SRAM chain which came with the bike. I suppose if I invested in a Rohloff one at £35 that would work out even cheaper given the longer life expentancy of it

[stutho]

quote:does this mean that when you buy a new chain should you also buy a EBB shell as well?

No the EBB should outlast several chains - probably will never need to be changed during the life of the bicycle.

[PH]

Glad you sorted it frog, when you consider the number of moving parts a chain has it's hardly surprising how often it's the cause.  I changed my SRAM chain after 12,000 miles, I've replaced it with a specific single speed one that should last longer!
Some of your questions about the chain adjustment and EBB come from your instinct that there’s an optimum tightness.  I used to be of the same opinion, you'll soon realise that it isn't necessary to make small adjustments, the hub feels and works the same as long as the chain doesn’t restrict it and isn't going to fall off, that's quite a range.
As for needing to replace the EBB, here's Andy Blance's response to a similar comment in a review;
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/cyclebiketestcomments.html
I've seen an EBB from a tandem that had the indents pre drilled, a good idea as you'd then have them as close as possible, if I ever need a new one I'll do that before fitting.

[frog]

The Click Returns!!!!

Not as loud as before but still in the same place (when the cranks are vertical).

I'm getting a priest in to exorcise it [}:)]  

I'm going to have to wait for the weekend on this because searching for this isn't going to do my sanity any good if I've got to got to keep a torch aimed at the pertanant bit while I'm trying hard not to overtighten something.

As I've got it on each rotation I think I need to have a closer look at the pedals, crank and chainring bolts.  I was impressed with the reduction of the click by reversing the chain.  That's as near to witchcraft as I've seen with bike maintenance  []

Point taken PH with the reference to 'instinct'.  This is one Skywalker who should RTFM a bit more  [:I]

In the car for the next two days so only 30 or so miles riding before I can get to grips with it.  It's a pity I can't recreate the problem while working on it in the shed []