Author Topic: Tandem tyre pressure  (Read 22904 times)

stevew

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Tandem tyre pressure
« on: August 21, 2006, 08:17:37 am »
What pressure max. would you recon for the 584 X 32 Wolber tyres on an old tandem I recently bought.  These are the first bike tyres I have seen that do not have this info on the sidewall.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2006, 08:18:10 am by stevew »
 

CPeachey

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Re: Tandem tyre pressure
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2007, 06:27:17 pm »
You need close on 100psi to prevent pinch punctures on a tandem rear wheel but "cheap" tyres cannot take such high pressures. Have a real close look on the tyre as sometime it is in very small letters. If no info I would assume a "low" pressure tyre which may not be man enough for the job.
Chris
 

vik

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Re: Tandem tyre pressure
« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2011, 03:35:39 pm »
What pressure max. would you recon for the 584 X 32 Wolber tyres on an old tandem I recently bought.  These are the first bike tyres I have seen that do not have this info on the sidewall.

Your tires need to support the weight of your team, their gear and the bike. 

http://thelazyrando.wordpress.com/2009/10/06/tire-pressure/

You want ~15% of the measured width in vertical drop when you are on your bike sitting still.  You can estimate the weight on each wheel and use the chart in the above link to get you in the ballpark or get a third person to measure as you sit on the bike.

If the needed pressure to get the 15% is higher than the max pressure on the sidewall you need a wider tire run at lower pressure.
Safe riding,

Vik
www.thelazyrando.com

Danneaux

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Re: Tandem tyre pressure
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2011, 07:56:29 am »
Agreed, Vik; this method has worked well for me since I first read it in an article by Frank Berto in _Bicycling_ magazine years ago.  I employ the same method to determine tire pressures on my singles, too.

On my tandem -- and with my weight and that of my stoker and our usual day-ride load -- that pressure works out to 85psi on 26x1.5 Trek Road Warrior slicks (actual cross section, 1.5" exactly on Sun Metal CR18 rims).

No noticeable losses due to greater rolling resistance and the ride is wonderful.  Fast, too; we've had it up beyond 63mph/101kph downhill with no problems and probably could have easily exceeded that if it had not been for the Arai drag brake and some judicious use of the Pedersen/SE self-energizing cantilevers and Kool-Stop salmon brake pads.

Best,

Dan.

Mike Ayling

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Re: Tandem tyre pressure
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2012, 10:29:41 am »
Agreed, Vik; this method has worked well for me since I first read it in an article by Frank Berto in _Bicycling_ magazine years ago.  I employ the same method to determine tire pressures on my singles, too.

On my tandem -- and with my weight and that of my stoker and our usual day-ride load -- that pressure works out to 85psi on 26x1.5 Trek Road Warrior slicks (actual cross section, 1.5" exactly on Sun Metal CR18 rims).

No noticeable losses due to greater rolling resistance and the ride is wonderful.  Fast, too; we've had it up beyond 63mph/101kph downhill with no problems and probably could have easily exceeded that if it had not been for the Arai drag brake and some judicious use of the Pedersen/SE self-energizing cantilevers and Kool-Stop salmon brake pads.

Best,


Dan.

I am considering the purchase of a Thorn tandem and I notice in the advertising brochure there is a table of recommended tyre pressures which are lower than most people tell you they are running. There may be an element of "we don't want to get sued by people who over inflate tyres and experience rim damage" by Thorn  but I was a little surprised at the numbers in the table.

Mike

Danneaux

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Re: Tandem tyre pressure
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2012, 05:34:47 pm »
Hi Mike, and welcome to the Forum!

Like you, I was initially surprised at some of the figures shown for recommended maximum tire pressures by Andy Blance in the Thorn brochure. They seemed especially low in my eyes, coming new to the world of 26" rims and tires. As a roadie (and someone who toured on 700x32C tires) I was especially surprised.

Doing the math, however, it is easy to see the reasons for the recommendations. Equations aside, here's the reasons --

First, the 26" tires have a lot more air volume -- up to 6 times that of a 700C tire, depending on width comparisons.

Second, while most 26" rims are pretty close in width to those used on 700C touring wheels, the tires are proportionately wider. If filled with the same pressures as ther narrower cousins, these wider tires exert much greater leverage against the rim sidewalls, placing them under greater stress. The sad result is a greater incidence of sidewall cracking...and the appearance of something almost never seen with narrow tires on narrow rims: Rims splitting right down the middle, from spoke well to spoke well.

Third -- at least with trekking tires like the 26x2.0" ones commonly used for touring -- these wheels see a lot of weight compared to the average sport-touring or racing bike with 700C wheels. This loads the rims further, and if tires pressures are already high...well, problems are more likely.

By its very nature, a tandem carries the weight of two people -- even more if you tour with one. When I took my tandem touring with my visiting Duch pal and I hauled a trailer, I was shocked to find the lot (riders, bike, and trailer) weighed 600lb/272kg. I was equally shocked to find we did alright with "only" 85psi/5.9bar of pressure in the 26x1.5 tires. Based on my experience with narrower 700Cs, I would have bet on at least a couple pinch flats, but we rode the bike extensively on poor gravel roads and didn't experience a single problem. In fact, I think tire pressure was likely a bit high, and if I had been running 26x2.0 tires, would likely have gone with a maximum of 51psi/3.5bar as Andy recommended.  Going further, I would consider that a maximum under heavy touring loads, and would use even less air pressure for riding with small day loads or just myself on the bicycle. This was borne home to me on a recent day ride on the Nomad where I used the same pressure as I had the day before when trialing different packing schemes for loaded touring. The bike rode like a jackhammer; using 5-10psi less in the tires made a world of difference. The fault was mine, I simply forgot to adjust pressures downward for my solo ride.

By way of illustration, these folks had a perfect storm of rim failures: http://www.goingslowly.com/gear/, detailed here:
http://journal.goingslowly.com/search/rims/2009/08/velocity-rims/
http://journal.goingslowly.com/2009/12/velocity-rims-part-2.html

There problems were largely isolated to the rear rims, and likely due to the *very* heavy loads they carried and -- I suspect -- pressures that may have been a bit high, though pressures were not mentioned in their reports. The manufacturer really stood behind their product with continued support and repacement, but their failures were identical to those produced in other brands as well. A quick GoogleImage search for "Bicycle Rim Failure" ( https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=kFe&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&channel=fflb&q=bicycle+rim+failure&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&biw=1173&bih=610&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=5NBlUNKQJcSX1AXhgoG4Ag ) shows some spectacular results sometimes due to factors other than wear.

I'm not trying to defend Thorn, but looking at the factors above, I've come on my own to think their pressure recommendations are well-intended to prevent the possibility of harm or failure in touring use. Legal implications aside, that's surely not a bad thing!

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2012, 08:39:41 pm by Danneaux »

il padrone

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Re: Tandem tyre pressure
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2012, 08:26:29 am »
You need close on 100psi to prevent pinch punctures on a tandem rear wheel but "cheap" tyres cannot take such high pressures.

It really all depends on your bicycle load weight and the tyre size. However I have toured quite a lot on our tandem with two riders (50-60kgs each) and full camping kit (>35kgs), using Vittoria Randonneur 700Cx35mm tyres with no flats and no concerns about pinch flats. We were running about 80 psi.

Most enthusiast cyclists over-inflate their tyres anyway.


26x2.15 Mondials on the Nomad were running at sub-20 psi in the sands of Finke to Andado. 30 psi was about the hardest we ran the tyres for over a week of desert sand/gravel/corrugations  :o
« Last Edit: October 05, 2012, 08:31:59 am by il padrone »