Author Topic: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight  (Read 9193 times)

tressell69

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Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« on: March 23, 2013, 08:00:13 pm »
Does anybody on the forum run a Edelux front and Supernova E3 rear taillight from a Son 28 hub.
If so, how is it wired up and was it difficult


Cheers Raymy

Matt2matt2002

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2013, 11:15:23 pm »
Looks a nice set up.
I have the same hub dynamo.
May I ask how much the lights cost?

,
Matt
Never drink and drive. You may hit a bump  and spill your drink

julk

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2013, 08:39:57 am »
Raymy,
I run a Supernova E3 Pro on the handlebars and that tiny rack mounted rear from a Son28 hub.

Near enough?

The rear light wires into the front light, got to get the wiring correct here as it is a 6V DC feed as far a I know.

I use 4 of the gold plugs to make the front light removable.
Julian.

il padrone

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2013, 09:19:47 am »
Raymy,
I run a Supernova E3 Pro on the handlebars and that tiny rack mounted rear from a Son28 hub.

Near enough?

The difference here is the Supernova E3 headlight has the stand-light capacitor to control the tail-light. I believe other headlights (including the Edelux ) do not have this control, and the E3 tail-light will not have a built-in stand-light. I think the overload voltage protection should all come from the dynohub, if it is a SON hub. Not so for Shimano dynohubs.



The rear light wires into the front light, got to get the wiring correct here as it is a 6V DC feed as far a I know.

I believe these lighting systems are all AC - the polarity should not be an issue as far as I know....... and I have wired up plenty of such bike light systems. There are DC dynhubs but they are rarer, and why make it more complex?


I use 4 of the gold plugs to make the front light removable.
Julian.

You love that BLING, julk  ;D
« Last Edit: March 24, 2013, 11:06:09 am by il padrone »

JimK

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2013, 12:19:27 pm »
I have an Edelux headlight and a B&M Toplight rear light. The rear light is DC. The rectifier is in the Edelux headlight. The rear light wiring comes out of the headlight. Polarity is definitely something demanding attention!

il padrone

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2013, 01:09:54 pm »
I have an Edelux headlight and a B&M Toplight rear light. The rear light is DC. The rectifier is in the Edelux headlight. The rear light wiring comes out of the headlight. Polarity is definitely something demanding attention!


Uhuh ??!

I have B&M Seculites on several bikes, wired straight from the SON28 dynohub or several other dynamos. Also the E3 tail-light on two bikes, wired from the E3 head-light. Doesn't make sense to me - I was under the belief that all regular dynamo/dynahub lights were AC systems. Wouldn't a rectifier lose efficiency in the system?

How do my independently wired tail-lights work OK?

 ???

julk

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2013, 03:00:18 pm »
Sorry I have not been able to answer the original posters question.

Supernova are quite insistent that their rear light is DC and must be wired the correct way round to take the DC feed from their front light.
They even colour the wire inner insulation to make it easier to get this right.

The front light takes AC from the dynohub.

I have those gold plugs fitted such that they only allow the wiring to be connected the right way!
Julian.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2013, 03:06:35 pm by julk »

Danneaux

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2013, 04:31:25 pm »
Hi Ramy!

• The Schmidt Edelux headlight wires conventionally to the SON dynohub. It uses an internal AC-DC rectifier, so you do not have to observe lead/lug polarity when attaching the headlight to the SON dynohub, even though one of the wires is marked in white (the headlight sorts things out internally). Nothing special is required for wiring the headlight; two 4.8mm lugs on the wire to the two matching lugs on the dynohub.

•The Supernova taillight is definitively DC only, and depends on the attachment to the headlight having the correct polarity. Here is the word on it from Peter White:
Quote
The Supernova E3 Pro headlight converts AC (alternating current) from the hub dynamo into DC (direct current) for the LEDs. The output from the E3 Pro headlight to the taillight (red & blue wires) is also DC. The taillight cannot use the AC from the hub dynamo, it must receive only DC. The electronics that convert AC to DC are only in the headlight, not in the taillight. So, you must never attach the 161-T taillight directly to a dynamo. It can only be used when attached to the red & blue output wires from the E3 Pro headlight, or the E3 Triple.
per http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/supernova.asp

• The Edelux headlight uses 2.8mm metric connectors for the taillight, and they are polarized, thanks to the headlight's internal rectifier. The headlight has a standlight, and the headlight powers the taillight, however, Schmidt recommend connecting a diode rear light with its own stand light. I believe they are saying the headlight's built-in standlight capacitor lacks capacity for double standlight operation. This is essentially the same as, say a B&M IQ Cyo-series headlight with standlight (same basic internals as the Edelux), which also requires the taillight have standlight capacity of its own. When used with the Supernova E3 front light, I have confirmed the taillight has standlight capability.

• As for running an LED taillight, Schmidt say...
Quote
Important when connecting the rear light transmission to the E delux:
a) the rear light terminal of the E delux must match the phase connection (usually with a bolt in to be connected) of the rear light - not with the ground connection.
So, yes, you do have to observe correct polarity when wiring the Supernova taillight to the Schmidt headlight. Get it wrong and it won't work. Reverse the connections and all should be fine.

Hope this helps. To recap: Edelux headlight wire to dynamo polarity doesn't matter. LED Supernova taillight to Edelux headlight requires correct polarity. Get it wrong, won't work but no damage; reverse and all will be well.

Be sure to insulate the spade connector that connects the taillight wire to the Edelux or it can short against the headlight's aluminum body. Julian's (as shown in his photo above) is a very nicely done example, complete with offset connections so polarity is observed automatically when re-connecting.

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2013, 05:10:09 pm by Danneaux »

il padrone

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2013, 08:41:09 pm »
OK, seems that Supernova do it different  :-\

Quote from: Peter White
All 6 volt B&M taillights are compatible with all 6 volt B&M headlights, all Schmidt headlights, the Spanninga Luceo XS, and all Inoled headlights (using the Inoguard). B&M taillights are not compatible with Supernova headlights, and Supernova taillights are compatible only with Supernova headlights. Please do not mix Supernova lights with other brands of lights.

I  am running a Supernova E3 head-light with a B&M Seculite tail-light and it operates well.

Normally dynamo lights are AC. I can confirm that B&M Seculite tail-lights can be wired direct from the dynamo. My Supernova E3 lights have been wired up following the Supernova instructions. Evidently DC does not harm the Seculite, but it works with AC as well. On a couple of bikes the tail-lights are wired from the B&M iQ Cyo..... I doubt this involves a conversion to DC though.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2013, 09:13:13 pm by il padrone »

tressell69

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2013, 12:55:16 pm »
Great, its all becoming clear, I can see some light at the end of the tunnel.
No pun intended.
£130 for the Edelux, £39.99 for Supernova E3 tailight and £218 for a SON28 on Rigida Sputnik, was the cost.
As im commuting every day it more than pays for itself.
Its the old adage , you get what you pay for!
Where did JULK pick up the connectors in his photograph?

Thanks All
Raymy

JimK

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2013, 01:12:58 pm »
Where did JULK pick up the connectors in his photograph?

Peter White carries them - scroll down near the bottom of this page:

http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/supernova.asp

Probably you will find them closer to you but maybe that's a starting point for searching.

il padrone

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2013, 01:54:29 pm »
You can get those plugs (Supernova gold connectors) from SJS Cycles, and I think bike24 and other German stores would carry them as well.

julk

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Re: Son28 hub, Edelux front & supernova E3 taillight
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2013, 02:09:24 pm »

Where did JULK pick up the connectors in his photograph?

Raymy,
I bought mine direct from Supernova at a time when they were hard to get and not in stock in the UK.
I bought the Supernova rear light from SJS.
I needed 2 sets for the connections in the photo.

I had them on my previous Thorn which was an S&S Rohloff exp.
I needed 3 sets for that bike as the rear light lead also needed to split near the rear brake for the frame splitting capability.
A small benefit of having a removeable front light was that I still had it after that bike was stolen off a campsite overnight.
The Supernova frontlight was bought direct from Supernova before SJS were stocking them.
Julian.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2013, 02:10:57 pm by julk »