Author Topic: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster  (Read 12104 times)

jimmer

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F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« on: January 25, 2013, 10:29:30 PM »
Dear All,

I post in the full expectation of nothing but pity, for no other purpose than to spread the pain and to solicit more soothing words than I'm getting from the family who just stare at me with concern for my sanity rather than bike.

I tried to reverse the 'hoff sprocket this evening, thinking that, given the generally cheerful nature of the posts in the reversing sprocket problems thread, I could look forward to a half hour of gentle shed time.

In the two hours that I have been en shed I have sheared the pin of Park Tool's stoutest chain whip, ripped the lugs off the sprocket removal tool and gouged out the rebates on the hub into which the removal tool fits.

Apart from proving I still got it butch wise, I've acheived very little today. Glad as I am to be a latter day Hercules, I'd rather be Croesus; then trashing £800 hubs wouldn't ache so.

It's back together well enough to ride at Cannock tomorrow.

I'll ring SJS on Monday and see if they have any suggestions.

Yours, proper narked, James
 

Danneaux

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2013, 10:33:28 PM »
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, James... I am so very, very sorry to hear of your dilemma. Truly, I ache for your pain and misery at the moment and would not wish it on an enemy, let alone a nice fellow like yourself (that last statement made regardless of your demonstrably great strength).

Don't lose heart. You're not the first person who has had this happen.

It is even possible to make a remover that will work in lieu of the chain whip (fits in the sprocket holes). As for the retaining bosses for the remover...there are solutions there as well.

Yours in empathy,

Dan. (...who has a proud history of pulling similar stunts and can feel your pain directly)

JimK

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2013, 11:12:24 PM »
Ouch, what a mess! Having heard a few similar stories... though really nothing quite so nasty... I did a trial removal a year ago, with just maybe 1500 miles on the hub, and was careful to put some copper grease on the threads.

How many miles would you say you have on your hub, or since you last pulled off the sprocket if this wasn't the first time?

What can I do to avoid the kind of experience you just went through?! That sort of thought runs through my head quite regularly. So sorry you got stuck running right into such a dreadful obstacle.

jags

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2013, 12:14:24 AM »
copper grease should  keep things from seizing .
sounds like a trip to the rohloff doctor. :-[

Danneaux

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2013, 12:55:48 AM »
Quote
...What can I do to avoid the kind of experience you just went through?!
Jim, I have this concern as well. Though nearly all the procedures I've read (even Rohloff's own, shown here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqpgkyQ5tkI ) involve standing the wheel on edge and removing the cog with a chain whip while using a stout wrench to hold the remover (secured with a q/r)...Andy Blance details a different procedure in the Thorn Cycles FAQ: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/reversingarohloffsprocket.html
It involves use of a large bench vise and cautions the direction of removal will appear reversed because you'll be viewing the hub from the opposite side.

Poor Jimmer! I really feel for him.

I do know one thing that is supposed to make removal easier is "the sudden shock action" Rohloff describe in their video. When I was repairing cars for money, I know the sudden application of sharp torque would remove seemingly unremovable fasteners when titanic force applied steadily would not do anything but round the corners off the fastener heads. Don't ask how I learned this or how expensive it was the first time. There are things even more expensive than Rohloff hubs. Things like, oh, the bolts holding harmonic balancers on crank shafts. I wonder if Jimmer applied a steady titanic force /or/ a "sudden shock action" the first go-'round.

I have also found from my days of 12" low derailleur gearing when the screw-on freewheels were practically galvanized to the hub and I used a q/r to hold the remover in place...it pays to use a spare q/r rather than your nice titanium-shafted one 'cos when the freewheel finally does break free, it is a bit hard to avoid a full-on follow-through that can strip the nut clean off the q/r and bend the shaft in one fluid motion. Don't ask how I know this, either. It also pays to watch your teeth as they approach the rim, 'cos...well, you know....

All the best,

Dan. (...who's been there, done that in slightly different contexts)

Danneaux

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2013, 01:01:27 AM »
This may prove helpful for those who follow...
http://forums.mtbr.com/internal-gear-hubs/speedhub-cog-removal-bloody-knuckles-250041.html
I really like the fender washer part of the idea described above if one does not have access to a suitably stout vise (I do, fortunately).

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2013, 01:05:55 AM by Danneaux »

JimK

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2013, 01:23:44 AM »
standing the wheel on edge and removing the cog with a chain whip while using a stout wrench to hold the remover (secured with a q/r)...

That's how I did it. I don't have a vise anyway (though plenty of vices, trust me!) and yeah maybe it is a vice but for sure I would be 50/50 at best on getting the direction right. I didn't have any trouble getting the sprocket off. I did buy a monster Crescent wrench and a stout Park chain whip so I wasn't leaving much to chance anyway!

 

travelling

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2013, 02:59:06 AM »
You forgot the cardinal rule...Don't mess with the Hoff  :D

Danneaux

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2013, 03:29:20 AM »
 ;D ;D ;D
I hope Jimmer can get to where this brings as big a smile to him as it did to me. Brilliant!

Best,

Dan.

JimK

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2013, 03:37:42 AM »
FWIW, here are the tools I used a year ago to remove my sprocket:


Danneaux

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2013, 03:37:56 AM »
Some encouraging news; it appears SJSC has been known to fix such things...
http://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=oqb6c5ikipphic1g0caje2phm3&topic=58714.0

Encouragingly,

Dan. (...who sees a light a the end of the tunnel that *isn't* an oncoming train)

ZeroBike

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2013, 10:05:59 AM »
Do these unscrew the opposite way to normal?

I dont have one myself but think that I have read this somewhere before.


geocycle

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2013, 12:15:47 PM »
Do these unscrew the opposite way to normal?

I dont have one myself but think that I have read this somewhere before.



They come off anticlockwise, ie like a normal thread but opposite to many cassettes. Sympathy for jimmer. I destroyed my chain whip on my first go but found a neighbour with an industrial size one and all went smoothly. About another year to the next time it needs to one off...
 

Matt2matt2002

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2013, 04:44:56 PM »
They come off anticlockwise, ie like a normal thread but opposite to many cassettes. Sympathy for jimmer. I destroyed my chain whip on my first go but found a neighbour with an industrial size one and all went smoothly. About another year to the next time it needs to one off...

You take it off every year? May I ask why?
Honest question - not trying to be a smarty pants
Never drink and drive. You may hit a bump  and spill your drink

jags

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Re: F***ity b*****ks, a 'hoffin' disaster
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2013, 04:57:32 PM »
i reckon a much longer handle on the chain whip Law of the Leaver and all that. ;)