Mirrors

[janeh]

Hello,

Can anyone recommend a suitable mirror for use when cycling with a tagalong? I have drop handlebars and have just bought a blackburn one but the mirror seems to wobble a lot. The shop also had a small Zefal one that fixes round the drops but think it might have been too small and too low. Not sure if a helmet one would work..

Jane

[Danneaux]

Hi Jane,

I've found over the years I prefer helmet- or eyeglass-mounted mirrors because the are always in the same place relative to my eyes, and I can "sweep" a broad field of view by turning my head.  And, since I always wear a helmet or glasses, these sorts of mirrors go with me from bike to bike, which is convenient.  I get about the same field of view as a 9in/23cm hand mirror held at arm's length, and once a person's brain is "trained", it is possible to switch from the dominant to non-dominant eye and see "in" the mirror or "through" it as desired.

For years, I preferred helmet-mounted mirrors, but found them more prone to damage (and loosening on their mounts due to strikes when off my head) so I have switched to mirrors that mount on my cycling glasses.  The key is to get one that sits far enough out so you don't have to cock your eyes strongly to one side. It also pays to get a plastic instead of glass and that will come off readily in the event of a crash, to prevent injury. Two I have liked are:

1) "Heads up" ( http://www.cycleaware.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=2&zenid=v6ejbs3vau0mrdj0lekge9h267 ) by CycleAware ( http://www.cycleaware.com/ ). CycleAware make a variety of mirrors that are nicely constructed and well executed and they are a nice company to deal with. This mirror is made of very lightweight plastic with synthetic rubber "grippers" for your glasses, is oval vertically, and has a nice little ball joint for adjustment without bending. Replacement parts are available. Over a long time (and very high-speed downhills), the ball-joint can wear, and I found the mirror arm a little flexy and vibration-prone, and cured the problem with an overlay of heat-shrink tubing. Still, these deficits were enough to cause me to switch to my new favorite, the...

2) Bike Peddler Take A Look Mirror. I don't believe the company sells direct or has a website, but their products are widely available. You can read about the mirror here: http://www.rei.com/product/752285/bike-peddler-take-a-look-mirror . These things are little handmade works of art, with soldered brass sleeve joints that can be user-tightened on stainless-steel wire supports. They are reach- and angle-adjustable, too. The mirrors are available in a standard and wide width (my favorite) and are unusually clear. They are also a tad heavy if you also wear cycling glasses with RX inserts as I do, but I can't/won't ride without it.

I can honestly say one of these mirrors likely saved my life a couple years ago. I was riding along on the shoulder of a rural road when I saw a large SUV closing behind me. It kept straying over the white-painted line marking the shoulder, and as it approached, it went farther, so I dove off the road into a shallow ditch, unhurt. Just as the truck passed me, its tires went completely to the edge of the dirt; there's no way I wouldn't have been struck if I had remained on the paved shoulder. The driver was engrossed in texting on her phone, and there were little kids in car seats in the back. Yikes.

As a data point, I always put retro-reflective tape on the front of my head-mounted mirrors to reflect car headlights back to the source. It may do nothing, but it might driver's attention at eye-level across an intersection.

Head-mounted mirrors are an acquired taste, and not everyone likes them or can adapt, preferring instead to use a bike-mounted mirror or what a friend of mine calls a "St. Louis Turn Signal", after the city in Missouri -- glance over a shoulder and dart to the next lane in one continuous action.  So long as one looks before darting, all methods work.  The one advantage of a head-mounted mirror I have found when pulling a cargo trailer is I can look up (thus tilting the mirror down) and see where the trailer is tracking behind me. A nice check when riding between bollards (posts that block entry of cars to bike paths) and such.

Hope this helps,

Dan.

[Andre Jute]

Jane, your question arrives just as I'm considering mirrors anew.

Let me first of all give you the good news. The mirror I like best is cheap and available everywhere. http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/cateye-bm-300g-race-mirror-left-or-right-fitting-prod13904/ This is the Cateye 300 G, which has a good field of view without misleading you that cars are far away when in fact they're chomping on your rear tyre. What it lacks in adjustability it makes up in survivability.



It fits either upright or hanging down under your handlebars or sticking straight out, depending on where your hands need to go, and is exceedingly useful. When you park the bike, your just twist the mirror on its ball to align parallel with the bike.

Recently I got new handlebars with the n'lock stem I've described elsewhere on this board and they have a shorter straight section so that with my Rohloff gears I had to shorten the grip on one side, and consequently my hand interfered with the mirror.

To replace it I got this M-Wave 270020-3-D Mirror, bought on an impulse.
http://www.google.com/products/catalog?client=safari&rls=en&q=M+wave+mirror&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=4216499524569876610&sa=X&ei=ttDTT5KcF9CxhAem0LHwAw&ved=0CF8Q8wIwAg#ps-sellers It is, not to put to fine a point on it, lethal. It is so 3-D that it shows cars as half a mile back, at least, when in fact they're already nosing up next to your rear wheel. You really don't want to look in this mirror and think you have plenty of space to turn across the the traffic...



Definitely not recommended.

Meanwhile, until I can find another mirror, or decide the 300-G, upside down, is the best I can do, and fit up my spare (I gave the one I took off to a pedal pal who turned up to help me wrench), I'm using the helmet mirror on my Bell Citi.
http://www.google.com/products/catalog?client=safari&rls=en&q=Bell+citi+mirror&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=6794793850010023785&sa=X&ei=QtjTT-jrBIa5hAeEg-TCAw&ved=0CHgQ8wIwAQ#ps-sellers



Unlike several other helmet mirrors I tried, the Bell has enough adjustability to give me a comfortable glance at the road behind me, but unlike Dan I don't like using it much. However, it is amazingly sturdy, the one on my helmet as an emergency measure (in case my handlebar mirror gets knocked off) has outlived two Citi helmets (one crashed and disposed of, one given to someone who admired it). Recommended but unfortunately it is proprietary to the Bell Citi/Metro helmets (also recommended as smart, cool in the physical sense, and very, very ergonomic), though now apparently extended to the Muni and Arella, about which I know nothing.

If I find no other mirror that works for my new handlebar configuration, I might be forced to return to that versatile old standby, the Zefal Dooback. http://www.zefal.com/fr/retroviseurs/79-dooback.html



This is a truly great mirror, and I used it for years. If it is so great, why did I stop? It's expensive to buy and the design, while at first glance sturdy enough (there's no shake in it, once properly mounted) deals with knocks by popping out the mirror, which is glued onto some pins. There's no way of repairing it. I got fed up with going through three or four of those a year. There's a footbridge where I arrive between the stone pillars anchoring it at speed -- losing three mirrors in three weeks was the final straw. But it works, in being infinitely adjustable, and giving you an excellent view of traffic behind and beside you, with no possibility of confusing the lanes. A brilliant mirror for heavy traffic but overkill for my quiet lanes.

the Zefal Dooback is handed, so order by the side you need. http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/page/find/?name=zefal%20mirror&page=1

Notice that none of the mirrors I recommend strap onto the handlebars. A permanently installed mirror should bolt into the end of the bar, or onto the bar.

Finally, for years on my mountain bike I used a truck mirror on a long bent arm, sold by my LBS with bicycle-suitable fittings. I suspect you're a roadie, and thus by definition a weight weenie, but if weight doesn't matter to you, and cost and getting a really safe view of the car behind you does matter, a truck mirror works superbly well. I stopped using those because even the local blacksmith aka bike mechanic, never before suspected of taste, pointed out that they looked cheap on my German/Dutch custom bike.

Maybe I'll try the Zefal Spin. http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/zefal-zefal-spin-mirror-prod20623/



Andre Jute

[il padrone]

I can make a few comments on various mirrors:

The Cateye 300G is OK but it broke at the stem quite easily on my wifes bike when the bike fell over.

The Zefal Dooback - a nice large view with a neat fold-away facility, but the mirror is not glass, rather a plastic surface that gets crazed and marked in time.

I have never taken to helmet/glasses mirrors. I think it is partly because of the loss of depth of view from the monocular vision you get using just one eye.

I've also never used the Zefal Spin, but I think it seems too smalll and narrow for a good field of view.

I use the B&M Cyclestar and find it very satisfactory in traffic and on rural roads. I've used it for about the last 4-5 years. I use the short stem model on my Thorn Nomad with flat bars - it's clamped to the bar-end of the Ergon GC3






On my road bike I have the same mirror on the 'no-stem' version, fitted into the end of the drop bars.




It is quite steady in most conditions, but can get knocked out of line over very rough road surfaces (usually gravel corrugations). It is very easy to realign but this is a fairly rare event. The field of view is very good and it has a convex surface. I must admit I have been using convex mirrors of one sort or another ever since the 1980 Blackburn Mirrycle so I think I have adjusted my distance judgement to their use.

We currently have the B&M Cyclestar mirror, in various forms, on five of our bikes.



 

[Andre Jute]

The Cateye 300G is OK but it broke at the stem quite easily on my wifes bike when the bike fell over.

The Zefal Dooback - a nice large view with a neat fold-away facility, but the mirror is not glass, rather a plastic surface that gets crazed and marked in time.

I have never taken to helmet/glasses mirrors. I think it is partly because of the loss of depth of view from the monocular vision you get using just one eye.

I've also never used the Zefal Spin, but I think it seems too smalll and narrow for a good field of view.

I use the B&M Cyclestar and find it very satisfactory in traffic and on rural roads. I've used it for about the last 4-5 years. I use the short stem model on my Thorn Nomad with flat bars - it's clamped to the bar-end of the Ergon GC3

[snip only for bandwidth -- original immediately above]

We currently have the B&M Cyclestar mirror, in various forms, on five of our bikes.

Thanks for starting this, Jane. You have an excellent sense of timing!

Il Padrone, I use the mirror precisely as a sacrificial element on my bike, so I'm keen it shouldn't cost too much, which is why I like the Cateye 300G -- of which I have never lost one to a terminal breakage, though some had the nub sticking out of the handlebar abraded all round its circumference. By contrast, the expensive Zefal Dooback has never lasted long enough in service with me for me to experience the crazing you mention.... I forgot to say that using a helmet mirror soon gives me a headache from refocusing my eyes to such a short distance. This is getting to be a very rich thread; only cyclists can appreciate how important a mirror can become to those of us who use one.

Thanks for the opinion on the Zefal Spin; I was wondering, from the illustration, about its vertical curvature, in other words, how far along the road behind you it can display rather than mere width. A lack of vertical curvature is what for me rules out the Topeak Bar'n'mirror, a mirror that folds out from a bar-end.

I'll look into the BUMM lights again.

Andre Jute

[richie thornger]

I'll second the excellent timing Jane. I've only used one mirror, the Cateye 300G as others have mentioned.
I'm amazed at it's longevity. I would constantly forget to fold it in when leaning the bike against a wall, but it never snapped or broke in any way.
 When I had Ergon GP1s it was mounted upwards but when I changed to the GP2s I mounted it upside down.
This took a bit of getting used to but I survived most of Europe with it mounted this way. I am now trying GP5s and was wondering what to do as the GP5s do not have bar end plugs to allow mounting of this mirror.
Il Padrone you have clearly come up with a solution...does the B&M mirror come with this mounting solution or is it something you have created yourself? I couldn't quite make it out in the photo?
I have never tried eyeglass mounts but as I do ride with optical glasses all the time perhaps I should give them a try. They do make you look a bit special though:)
It's only now not having my mirror, I realise quite how much I use it. My attitude to safety is perhaps not the best example, I don't wear a helmet and I do listen to music so a mirror is a must for me.

[il padrone]

Il Padrone you have clearly come up with a solution...does the B&M mirror come with this mounting solution or is it something you have created yourself? I couldn't quite make it out in the photo?

Yes, the B&M mirrors (all except the no-stem version) come with two mounts - a wedge bar-plug and a screw-tightened strap. The latter is what holds mine on the bar-end, and I have to say it is very secure once done up tight.

Closer view



The mirror stem is held in position by a clamp on the ball-end - tighten it nicely and it stays put very well even over rough stuff. The mirror itself is socketed onto another ball-end - mine did once get knocked bad enough to pop off. Just picked it up and popped it back on - no further trouble.

[richie thornger]

Il Padrone, thank you. Another problem solved thanks to the Thorn forum.
I shall be ordering one or maybe two 

[richie thornger]

I have just taken delivery of my BUMM mirror (short stem). I ordered it from cyclesense as it was about 20% cheaper than SJS inc pnp. Whilst I agree that customer service is worth paying for and Thorn bikes are superb, SJSC's attitude to postage leaves me a bit cold. I spent £300 last week on bits that arrived in a shoe size box and didn't weigh much and I still got stung for a fiver postage. It has to be the only mail order/online firm that charges postage over £100??
What's more when I opened my parcel from this northern shop I found a Yorkshire teabag included with a little message:) I've had free Haribo from online bike shops but never tea.
Anyways I digress......
First thing I noticed was the size of the mirror, it's tiny. What size is yours Il Padrone. Mine is 6cm in diameter. It looks bigger in the pictures.
I put it on my GC3 grips much the same as yours with the rather delicate jubilee clip. I don't think the plastic quality of the screw will take too many on and offs. My Cateye plastic jubilee clip for a front light is a similar design but a much better quality plastic.
I whizzed up my road, now 15% resurfaced . Still rates as 3rd worst sealed main road I've cycled on and I've been to Bulgaria. I gave the mirror a chance to bump about a bit and find it's correct position. Once found I gave the clip and ball joint an extra tighten to make sure it would hold steady.
I weaved in and out of some traffic and over some bumps and first impressions are a fairly steady mirror with not much judder but the smaller size than the Cateye makes the position critical. The bigger lens gave a bit more room for knocking it out of position slightly.
So I tried replacing the BUMM lens with the Cateye. The ball socket is slightly larger but not much and the arm is slightly thicker. However not too much to fit in the BUMM socket and tighten enough to be sturdy. Because the socket tightens partly on the arm it means you don't have as much postioning available. This is overcome though by the extra ball and socket on the clip itself. The Cateye lens is definitely more juddery on the bumps.
First thoughts are that I can put up with that for the extra 2cm of the 8cm Cateye lens. Only a few days riding will give me a chance to give them both a fair trial.  You can actually buy just the fitting kit on its own. If anyone else happens to need this solution you don't need to buy the whole mirror set.

[cycling4chapatis]

Quick question: so I take it that the BUMM cyclestar short stem version works fine with Nomad/ flat track bar/ GP5L grips? Which part of the GP5 do you mount it to?

Also came by this link: http://pedalpowertouring.com/gear/bicycle-touring-with-straight-aka-mtb-handlebars/ (scroll down to second picture, drilled the GP5 end to access the bar end for the cyclestar)

[il padrone]

Yes, it will.  The GP5 are just the same as my GC3 grips. Mount it out on the elbow, allowing enough room  for your hand to hold the fore & aft section.

My bike in Corsica




By the way, for anyone interested B&M now do this mirror (short stem) in a larger 80mm mirror

[cycling4chapatis]

Padrone - thanks so much!

[peter jenkins]

I had never used a mirror until about 12 months ago when Dan suggested I should consider one as I am profoundly deaf.

Thinking "what the hell..." I purchased a bike peddler mirror, which I have attached to my cycling glasses. It does take a bit of getting used to, but now I really won't leave the driveway without it. I took the bike away in the car for a weekend a couple of months ago and forgot to pack the mirror, with the result that I spent the weekend on the bike feeling most insecure.

The Bike Peddler gets my vote but it really is a case of what you're comfortable with.

One advantage is that you only need one, regardless of how many bikes you have.

Cheers,

pj

[Danneaux]

...Dan suggested I should consider one as I am profoundly deaf.

But not a requirement! I use one too, and find myself missing it while driving and walking.   I really won't get on the bike without it. I figure it is as essentiall to my safety as my helmet and likely moreso as it keeps me from getting into trouble, while the helmet only helps once I'm there.

So glad it worked out well for you, Peter, but I did warn you about its addictive properties!

All the best,

Dan.

[mickeg]

I like a helmet mirror, I do not have to move my head to look in it, a quick glance with my eye and I can see behind me.  The only disadvantage is that if the sun is low in the sky and behind me, I find that I have to tilt my head a bit to avoid the sun shining in my eye.

My favorite mirror is a Third Eye mirror that clamps on my helmet visor.  Because of the design, it only clamps on the left side, so might not work well where people drive on the left side of the road.  And, because it needs a visor to clamp onto, most road helmets without a visor would not work.  It is removable (the shaft is threaded onto the clamp), when I have traveled by airline and packed my helmet in my luggage, I could completely remove the mirror from the helmet and reattach later.
http://www.3rd-eye.com/%2803%29.htm

On my winter helmet which has no visor, I use a cheap SunLite brand helmet mirror, part of which is attached to helmet with adhesive tape.  Most of the mirror is removable for when I travel and do not want to damage the mirror, I pack the mirror and the long support part with my cycling glasses.  This one could be attached to the helmet on right or left sides.  The version I bought also had a eyeglass mount, but I have not used that so I can't comment on how good it works.
http://www.sunlitecycling.com/product_detail.php?short_code=Sport+Helmet+Mirror&cl1=MIRRORS