CSS rims - has anyone worn one out yet?

[onmybike]

I've just completed a 16,000km tour and my Nomad did 5000km of commuting duty before that yet wear on the rims is still negligible.  Still on the original set of brake pads too and neither wheel has ever needed truing!

Has anyone on this forum yet managed to wear out a CSS rim?

Syd

[geocycle]

No, I've only done 6000 miles or so on mine with no wear noticeable.  Also still the first set of pads.  I do wonder if the wet weather braking is quite as good as it was when new but otherwise a great buy.

[PH]

I do wonder if the wet weather braking is quite as good as it was when new but otherwise a great buy.

have you cleaned they?  I get a slight layer of brake pad rubber after a few thousand miles which affects wet weather braking.  A quick scrub with some scotchbright removes it.
If I put a straight edge (metal ruler) against the rim I can just about see the wear after 6,000 miles.

[geocycle]

have you cleaned they?  I get a slight layer of brake pad rubber after a few thousand miles which affects wet weather braking.  A quick scrub with some scotchbright removes it.

Good point, no I've not touched them.  Next time I get near the bike I will have a go.

[ThousandYardStare]

Interesting thread. I've only recently become aware of CSS rims and had been wondering by how much the life was extended. My current Mavic EX321 rims have done around 20,000kms, but are quite noticably concaved and very close to the end of their lifespan. And I've been through perhaps half a dozen sets of budget v-brake blocks in that time. Presumably you're all using those Swisstop pads...? Mind you, at £25 a set I've still spent less on braking than you ;-).

Which model rims are you all using?

I'm certainly interested in having some rough idea of how much life to expect from a CSS rim, to calculate whether they're worth the extra (more than double) cost. The OP may have got 26,000kms+ out of his with minimal wear, but could it be that the rate of degradation speeds up much more rapidly past a certain point...? It would be good to hear from any hardcore users and be able to make an informed decision. It might be interesting to discuss the estimated lifespan of other rims-of-choice (Rhyno/Rhyno Lite/etc), too. But perhaps that's another thread...;-)

[Hamish]

They do seem to be very good.  Mine are new but I like them already.

Ben Rowlands used them on his tour -

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/page/?o=RrzKj&page_id=143297&v=ET

Comment on this photo:

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/page/pic/?o=RrzKj&pic_id=639768&v=5&size=large

In fact his whole journal is fantastic.  All on a Raven Tour too.

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/?o=RrzKj&doc_id=5221&v=1ZE

[ThousandYardStare]

That's a really nice blog Hamish, cheers for the link. The kind of photos that make you want to dive right in.

So he's another fella who's managed to get 20,000k's out of his CSS's without noticing much wear...

[onmybike]

Close up photo of the braking surface on my Rigida Andra 30 CSS rim after 17,000km is here: http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/reviews/board/message/?o=RrzKj&message_id=183714&v=3&term=rigida&context=all

Given how thick the rim section is I'm pretty sure that even once the carbide is worn out the rim will still have the life expectancy of any equally thick walled touring rim... and the only one I know that's this beefy is a Sun Rhyno.

[ThousandYardStare]

I'm struggling to get much info on the CSS process, but according to Thorn brochures the tungsten carbide fuses with the metal on the rim. So that would suggest you wouldn't be getting absolutely the FULL normal rim wear once the top surface has worn away. But all evidence so far points to VERY long rim life.

Does anyone have any knowledge of the non-CSS life-expectancy of the most heavy-duty rims (Sun Rhyno, etc) ? It'd be interesting for anyone setting out on a very long ride to have an idea of whether they'd benefit long-term from CSS rims or not.

Approx distances of some of the more 'common' long distance rides would be:

UK - Cape Town: 20,000-25,000kms
Alaska - Patagonia: somewhere in the region of 25,000kms
RTW: Obviously massively variable, but anything but the most direct Russian-North American route is likely to be 30,000kms+

My (unconfirmed) suspicion- based on my own experience of moderately tough rims- is that the toughest non-CSS rims would get you through the first two of the above, but for multi-year trips (or a lifetime of medium-length touring) CSS would be the way to go.

I'd like to point out to anyone new to touring (and in danger of getting scared away by the silly prices of the gear being talked about!) that you don't NEED to spend hundreds of pounds on wheels to get into touring. Particularly on the front, which is under much less stress. But for a seriously long ride- particularly through developing countries- a high quality wheel will probably eventually save you money, and certainly peace of mind.

[Magnus]

I have been using Rigida Andra CSS rims here in Iceland for the last 2 years here in Iceland.  I estimate that I'm well over 20.000 km and there is no visible wear yet.  I use them on my commuter/touring bike and as a comparison, the Bontrager rims on my old bike barely lasted a year, with all the salt, grit and wet we get here during the winter.  I am, however, on the second pair of brake pads at the rear - still using the original at the front. 
I used to have a pair of Mavic Ceramic coated rims.   Those lasted 4 years, then started cracking around the eyelets.  They were also quite alarming in the wet - to the point of where I was really scared at times.  The CSS rims do suffer reduced braking power in the wet, but not to an alarming degree.

I'll definitely be getting another set of those CSS rims whenever these wear out...

Magnus Thor
Iceland

[mateusz]

I guess the actual abrasion life expectancy of any rim depends on the area where and how you cycle. I did a one day 400km ride touching the brakes ten times maybe. Mileage also depends on mud, crud, granite dust present on the road. I'm on 25k kms on old campagnolo Atlanta, mostly on-road, but in the Andes and High Atlas also.

[fofo]

to make an informed decision. It might be interesting to discuss the estimated lifespan of other rims-of-choice (Rhyno/Rhyno Lite/etc), too. But perhaps that's another thread...;-)



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moncler skijacke

[pdamm]

I got 22,000 km out of a set of Sun Ryhno's before the ware indicator wore away.  At which point I replaced them with a set of CSS rims.  That was 19,000km ago and mine look much the same as the link in onmybike's post.  I am still on my first set of pads too.

Peter

[Hamish]

My first Raven was a Catalyst that came with Rhynos (the Catalyst was a fantastic bike BTW!).  They lasted about a year of commuting.  I replaced the rear with an Andra.  That lasted about a year of commuting before I replaced it with a second Andra before selling the bike.  The front was replaced with a Mavic then a Sunn.

When I bought my Raven Tour I upgraded to CCS in the hope of avoiding my annual re-rim!  They also brake better and stay clean. It's early days yet but the rims seem very good!

I guess I do about 5K miles a year of fairly hill all weather commuting.

I also had Rhynos on my triplet - they appeared to be bomb proof and hardly wore at all.  But then the triplet did far fewer miles and most of the touring was in better conditions than my winter commute.

[onmybike]

As an update to my original post - the brake blocks have just been replaced for the first time at about 24,000km. The rims are still true and without noticable wear.