Author Topic: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings  (Read 12675 times)

sireatalot

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 7
Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« on: May 14, 2010, 11:28:22 pm »
I am saving my penies for a decent Rolhoff bike. But cycling with my partner could be much more enjoyable if she could keep up, so a Tandem is appealing too.
At the same time the thought came to me that I could buy both and save money by swapping the Rolhoff between the two bikes.
Does anyone have any experience of this?

I have limited storage space and a small car, so the ability to split the twin into three would be advantageous, is this an option?

julk

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 973
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2010, 07:54:04 am »
Sounds like a good idea.

I would consider having the external gear change box model as whipping the wheel out is made very easy.

jp06

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 29
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2010, 10:17:20 pm »
I have this arrangement with a single Rohloff wheel (Andra CSS) 32 spoke which I swap between my Sterling and Thorn tandem.  I have an EX changer so simply switch the wheel between the two frames.

On the tandem, I have it set up with XTR rim brakes and also an Avid BB7 cable disc brake.  I think the XTR brake would be fine alone but prefer the extra reassurance.

It would be worth first hiring/borrowing a tandem to check that you and your partner get on with it.  They are not everyones taste.

Kind regards

John
 

m88bsy

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2011, 02:08:18 pm »

Thorn tandems only have one set of S+S couplings. What size of car have you got as I would have thought 'breaking' the tandem at the S+S couplings, removing the back wheel, turning the handlebars would have got the tandem small enough to fit in your car.

Sharing a rohloff between frames is possible, the tandem uses an EX box which is then also compatible with the Nomad II. I am not sure whether it would be compatible with the raven tour as this uses a different method of running the gear cabling.

My wife had 'played' on a bike before she met me, but liked the idea of a tandem to avoid (in her view) getting left behind. We hired a tandem for a day to test ride it and she loved it. The biggest annoyance were the comfort of the saddle and the problems with being in the wrong gear which clearly can be overcome on your own bike and with a rohloff. (The Rohloff is brilliant on any bike but particularly on a tandem).

We ended up buying a brand new rohloff equiped tandem, cycled in Europe on our honeymoon and I have just purchased a nomad II for some solo adventures.




Etienne

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2011, 09:24:00 pm »
Amazed by your experience.  Let me share mine.  Solo biking since 5 years - and suddenly with a tandem (20" UK Circe) since 2 months -

A real pleasure - no audax but still 20 50 Km on a regular basis.   Would love indeed to have a mix with a 26"tandem together with my Raven RST S&S  - but this is a matter of penny and place - Enjoying very much to share my sightseeing with my wife and kids - and thus really tandeming is a real different experience.

jim

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2011, 11:06:02 pm »
 :-\....Undecided...that would be me and my wife.  We are 65 yoa and transitioning from long distance treking (in the UK) on holiday to longer distance tandem bicycling (also in the UK and Europe as well).  She has bad knees and my feet no longer enjoy the last few days of a long hike. 
    So here's our question.  We have a cannondale (Al) tandem that we ride in the US.  We want to buy a S&S breakdown tandem for travel use.  Not only for the air travel but perhaps most importantly so that if we get "stuck" somewhere in bad weather or illness or bad traffic...we can just disassemble the bike and jump on a bus or train.  We feel this would add a great deal of flexibility. 
    I like everything I read about the Thorn tandems...particularly the amount of thought and planning that has gone into the design and assembly of the bikes.  The opinionated explanations are very interesting.  They bring up and offer resolution on questions and issues that had not even occurred to me.  The only thing that is keeping me from ordering a Thorn tandem right now is that the limited S&S coupler system they use won't allow the bike to be broken down enough to fit into a suitcase size bike box/bag.  Most USA tandems with S&S couplers will break way down so that the bike and wheels can be packed into a very compact box/bag that then could easily be carried onto a train as normal luggage, or easily fit in the cargo bay under a bus.  Specifically, we have looked at Co Motion and Santana 26" tandems that could easily be carried on trains or buses.
    Does anyone have any suggestions  to share r/t transporting a S&S thorn tandem on trains or buses?  We will appreciate any experiences you may have had transporting Thorn or other SS bikes on surface transportation...thanks!
Jim and Judy Boyle....near Yosemite NP, California, USA

sg37409

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 166
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2011, 09:41:12 pm »
I think you understand the difference in purpose of the S&S from Thorn to (for example) Santana.  Thorns are not intended to break down to flight-friendly-sized cases. They dont seem interested in offering this as an option.  The Thorn tandem S&S design does work well for car-transport, and possibly train too (not sure you can get it into a bag though)   I've appreciated not having to mess around with chains when using my S&S's and although I'm not likely to fly with it, if I did, I'd take my chances with no disassembly.
I've not used the S&S as much as I thought we would though, and I (still) find them quite tricky to reassemble.

macspud

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 730
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2011, 09:45:24 am »
Hello Jim,
If you go to www.sandsmachine.com there are a long list of tandems that break down in three pieces for air travel etc.
Regards,
Iain.

percussionken

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2011, 08:44:19 pm »
Hi
We have a R Twin Discovery size L/S with S&S couplings and we use the S&S soft bag for the front and for the two wheels. The rest goes into a bag from Groundeffects
http://www.groundeffect.co.nz/product-detail-BOD-BAG.htm .
There is no padding in the Body Bag so you have line it up with card boards etc.
We have used this for a couple of flights which has been fine.


Etienne

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2012, 12:18:28 pm »
I am building my RST with S&S Couplings.... but i am struggling with the cabling ...on the top tube

I would very much appreciate a picture of this top tube and link to the Rear break ?
Seems that the 3 plastic cable should end at the level of the saddle.   Any help/picture would be appreciated !

marvellous day to you,

julk

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 973
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2012, 01:17:54 pm »
Etienne,
The rear brake cable is easy. You put a bare wire connector between the v-brake arms and as near the cable end as possible to allow for brake block wear and adjusting the cable in a bit.
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/thorn-cable-connector-short-for-v-brake-black-prod15571/
Once disconnected, lift the noodle out of the brake arm as you split the frame.

The gear cables are an unknown to me, my S&S bike had an ex box.
I would suggest,
1. Fitting the gear cables fully to the brake boss gear cable mount. On splitting the frame, disconnecting the cables at the bayonet connectors, unscrew the adjusters out of and then removing the brake boss mount. I just tried this on my bike and I think you would need a long 4mm allen key with a handle to get enough torque for the mount retaining bolt - not too easy, but it makes the gear cabling easy.
2. Alternatively split the gear cables between the 2 gear cable guides under the top tube. Use (stepped?) gear cable ferrules at the cable guides and leave bare wire between so that the cable splitters can be fitted.
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/page/find/?name=ferrule&page=1
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/thorn-cable-connector-for-bare-inner-wire-gear-black-each-prod8560/
This is much simpler to split but you will need two inner cables cut shorter for each run and makes getting the cables the right length at the start more complex.

Probably best to e-mail SJSC and ask them for advice/guidance on this.
Julian.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 01:55:11 pm by julk »

JimK

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1652
    • Interdependent Science
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2012, 02:02:42 pm »
I have a Nomad, so like Julian I don't know how the Rohloff gear cables should be managed. But I took a couple pictures of my bike just in case they might be useful.

The rear brake cable is encased in housing all the way from lever to brake. The housing runs through brazed-on fitting along the top tube, the last one right before the S&S coupler. From there the housing runs right to the brake noodle:



The nifty thing is this coupler on the brake cable between the brake arms. This thing screws apart so the cable can be broken and the halves of the bike separated.



On the Nomad the external shifter box comes right off so all the shifter cabling stays with the front half of the bike. With internal shifting, maybe you could add some couplers this this to the shifting cables? Still you'd have to disconnect the remaining front part of the cables from the seat stays somehow. The rear brake noodle easily comes free from the brake arm. You'd want some similar ability to disconnect. It's the brake arm tension than keeps the noodle seated under normal riding conditions. The Rohloff cables don't really have tension normally, do they?

Etienne

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Twin & Raven Sport & S&S Couplings
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2012, 10:17:06 pm »
 : many  thanks to both of you.   Very clear for the brake.  And for the Rohloff I think I will go for the EX coming from the top.  (separate message possible) .

One day or another but soon with this beloved bike  (too busy at the moment with the tandem and keeping the familly busy with it)

Cheers