Narrower tyres for Club Tour

[peter jenkins]

I have a Club Tour which I am thinking of fitting with 25mm tyres instead of the present 28mm rubber in an attempt to make it more Audax friendly.
The Thorn blurb states: 'We would strongly advise against using tyres much narrower than (an actual) 28mm because the Club Tour
has been designed to be an all-round touring frame and narrow tyres will ride too harshly for most people.'

Has anyone out there in Thornland fitted their Club Tour with 25mm rubber, and did bad things happen as a result? I am never sure how literally to interpret Thorn's brochures as they sometimes appear to present opinion as immutable fact. e.g. 'all titanium frames we have known have broken'.

Cheers,

pj

[john28july]

I have a Club Tour which I am thinking of fitting with 25mm tyres instead of the present 28mm rubber in an attempt to make it more Audax friendly.
The Thorn blurb states: 'We would strongly advise against using tyres much narrower than (an actual) 28mm because the Club Tour
has been designed to be an all-round touring frame and narrow tyres will ride too harshly for most people.'

Has anyone out there in Thornland fitted their Club Tour with 25mm rubber, and did bad things happen as a result? I am never sure how literally to interpret Thorn's brochures as they sometimes appear to present opinion as immutable fact. e.g. 'all titanium frames we have known have broken'.

Cheers,

pj

Hello,
It depends obviously on your wheel rim width. Assuming you have a fairly narrow rim you can. But I when I got my Club Tour frameset, before I got the touring wheels, fitted a pair of Audax wheels with 25 mm tyres. OOOPS!
The bike felt simply off. No better explanation. I fitted the new wheels with 28 mm and the bike is great. I do not know why, but with narrow tyres its not so good.
You could of course use the Conti Ultra Gatorskin tyres in a 28 mm as they are used by many Audaxers and I use them on my Audax 853. They are very good and hardly notice the difference from 25 mm other than more comfort on the bumpy roads.
John.
www.pbase.com/john28july

[peter jenkins]

Thanks John,

The rims are a Sun CR18 (rear, came with the bike) and a Velocity Synergy (front purchased later) because Sun CR18's were not available when I invested in a hub dynamo. They are both supposed to be compatible with tyres 23mm or greater.
I'm a bit of a fan of the Conti Ultra Gator skin and have them (23mm) on my Bianchi. (It's Aluminium, so don't let anyone at SJSC know.) If I fit 25mm tyres, those would be the preferred option. I'm not sure if the 28mm size is available here in Oz; I've not seen any but I expect I could order them. I may try that option before downsizng to 25mm.

Whle we are at it, assuming you have cantilever brakes on your Club Tour, are they the Suntour SE's? Those are on mine and I am having a lot of trouble adjusting the rear one to get some reasonable stopping power. They are particularly ineffective in the wet. Although the current set of brake blocks have plenty left, I am thinking of replacing them with something a bit more upmarket such as Kool stops or similar. Have you any suggestions?

Cheers,

pj

[blair]

g'day Peter,
28mm Ultra Gatorskins are definitely available in oz, I've used them quite a bit on my Club Tour.
Lately I've been using Panaracer T-Servs. These are a folding tyre, allegedly aimed at the bike messenger market. They seem to be a bit tougher than the UltraGators, particularly against sidewall damage, and seem to weigh about the same. 
I think you will have to suck it and see, with the 25mm tyres. I'm not sure you will see much improvement, but  the only way to know is to try. They may work better on the wider rims than John's experience with Audax wheels. The investment is a lot less than new rims, anyway. If your Audax rides include any dirt road segments, the 28mm tyres may be faster.  The 25mm tyres may work better on the wider rims than John's experience with Audax wheels. The investment is a lot less than new rims, anyway.

I changed the Tekro cantilevers for Shimano BR-R550 brakes with Koolstop pads, and they work pretty well. Still squeal ferociously at times. I'd change the pads on your brakes for Koolstops (salmon or multi compound) and see if that helps. My experience is that the adjustment of pad alignment is fairly critical, and the Shimano setup works fairly well.

How do you find the Velocity rim? Is it less prone to shuddering under brakes than the Sun rim? My CR18s are all a bit misaligned at the pinned joint, and tend to shudder as the joint goes through the brakes.

   Blair

[john28july]

Thanks John,

The rims are a Sun CR18 (rear, came with the bike) and a Velocity Synergy (front purchased later) because Sun CR18's were not available when I invested in a hub dynamo. They are both supposed to be compatible with tyres 23mm or greater.
I'm a bit of a fan of the Conti Ultra Gator skin and have them (23mm) on my Bianchi. (It's Aluminium, so don't let anyone at SJSC know.) If I fit 25mm tyres, those would be the preferred option. I'm not sure if the 28mm size is available here in Oz; I've not seen any but I expect I could order them. I may try that option before downsizng to 25mm.

Whle we are at it, assuming you have cantilever brakes on your Club Tour, are they the Suntour SE's? Those are on mine and I am having a lot of trouble adjusting the rear one to get some reasonable stopping power. They are particularly ineffective in the wet. Although the current set of brake blocks have plenty left, I am thinking of replacing them with something a bit more upmarket such as Kool stops or similar. Have you any suggestions?

Cheers,

pj

Hello,
Regarding the brakes. Yes I do have the Suntour SEs on the Club Tour. The rear worked/works great with no problems. The fron squealed very very badly. I filed the pads, I rubbed Alchohol spirit on the rims, I roughed up the pads with Emery paper and finally toed them in more. Result? Still real noisy. I changed the pads for Aztecs. Result-perfection!
John.
PS I never have any problem with Ultra Gatorskin sidewalls or indeed the tread as reported by orhers.I think the tyres are great...

[peter jenkins]

g'day Peter,
28mm Ultra Gatorskins are definitely available in oz, I've used them quite a bit on my Club Tour.
Lately I've been using Panaracer T-Servs. These are a folding tyre, allegedly aimed at the bike messenger market. They seem to be a bit tougher than the UltraGators, particularly against sidewall damage, and seem to weigh about the same. 
I think you will have to suck it and see, with the 25mm tyres. I'm not sure you will see much improvement, but  the only way to know is to try. They may work better on the wider rims than John's experience with Audax wheels. The investment is a lot less than new rims, anyway. If your Audax rides include any dirt road segments, the 28mm tyres may be faster.  The 25mm tyres may work better on the wider rims than John's experience with Audax wheels. The investment is a lot less than new rims, anyway.

I changed the Tekro cantilevers for Shimano BR-R550 brakes with Koolstop pads, and they work pretty well. Still squeal ferociously at times. I'd change the pads on your brakes for Koolstops (salmon or multi compound) and see if that helps. My experience is that the adjustment of pad alignment is fairly critical, and the Shimano setup works fairly well.

How do you find the Velocity rim? Is it less prone to shuddering under brakes than the Sun rim? My CR18s are all a bit misaligned at the pinned joint, and tend to shudder as the joint goes through the brakes.

   Blair

Hi Blair,

Sounds like you live here??  We could start an Australian Chapter of the Thorn Owners Society. (or is there one already?) Thanks for the tip on the 28mm Gators, I will pester the guys at Epic Cycles here in Brisbane to order a pair. I have had no trouble with the Velocity rim. (I have had none with the Sun either, so perhaps I am just lucky?) Thanks also for the advice re Koolstops. I will give them a whirl and see how they go.
Happy 2008,

pj

[peter jenkins]

Hello,
Regarding the brakes. Yes I do have the Suntour SEs on the Club Tour. The rear worked/works great with no problems. The fron squealed very very badly. I filed the pads, I rubbed Alchohol spirit on the rims, I roughed up the pads with Emery paper and finally toed them in more. Result? Still real noisy. I changed the pads for Aztecs. Result-perfection!
John.
PS I never have any problem with Ultra Gatorskin sidewalls or indeed the tread as reported by orhers.I think the tyres are great...

Thanks again John,

I will try different pads and then pray for an end to the drought to see if the wet weather performance has improved.

Happy New Year,

pj

[PH]

My Audax tyre of choice is another from Continental, the 28mm GP4000 4 season;
http://www.conti-tyres.co.uk/conticycle/ti%20grand%20prix%204%20season.shtml

These are the comfiest tyres with the best wet weather grip I've tried, though I haven't used the Gatorskins for a comparison.
The puncture protection seems OK until they're worn and then it doesn’t take much to pierce them.  They're not the longest lasting tyre, nor the cheapest, but for the bike I ride purely for fun I wouldn't consider changing.

[vik]

I have a Club Tour which I am thinking of fitting with 25mm tyres instead of the present 28mm rubber in an attempt to make it more Audax friendly.
The Thorn blurb states: 'We would strongly advise against using tyres much narrower than (an actual) 28mm because the Club Tour
has been designed to be an all-round touring frame and narrow tyres will ride too harshly for most people.'

Peter the Grand Bois Cypres 30-700 tire has been proven to be both a fast and comfortable Audax tire.

http://www.vintagebicyclepress.com/tireoffer.html

If they fit your frame they may be the best of both world's.