New to me Raven Tour

[Andyb1]

A couple of days ago I did what I normally would never do: I bought a bike unseen on ebay.  A Raven Tour.  Not the Sport Tour and I don’t think it is a ‘New’ Raven Tour either.
Why?   Well I am planning a trip to Sri Lanka this winter and while my Sherpa is all set up and ready I would prefer to take a rohloff geared bike, maybe with a chainglider, as I am expecting that there will be some wet and gritty riding conditions.

The Raven had been advertised by a cycle dealer at £1000, then £900.  I offered £700 including delivery (it was of course on the other side of UK) and it arrives in a few days time.   There is a 30 day return period so if it is a total pup with a bent frame or anything silly it will go back, but the seller has told me the frame has no dents, the rohloff gears all work, and the wheels are true.  It looks like it might have scratches on the frame, or it may be dirt, and it generally looks ok from the photos.  The chain sits properly on the chainwheel, tyres (Marathon plus 1.75”) appear crack free, but photos can be deceptive.  It has a 537L frame and at 5ft 8” I should be in the middle of the size range.

I expect to spend some time and money on it.  And I need to try and keep it light.  Emirates have reduced their inclusive luggage allowance from 30kg to 25kg.  My Sherpa packed up in a cardboard box with panniers, tools etc was 27kg and I think the Raven with Rohloff will be heavier.  I can buy an additional 5kg luggage allowance for about US$75 each way, so 30kg is my absolute packed bike limit, but lighter will be easier when I take it on my train journey to Heathrow.

The Raven comes with mudguards, low rider racks and a sturdy rear rack.   The low riders (and probably the mudguards) will go and a lighter rear rack will be fitted.   But after that I am not sure how I can easily reduce weight.

The first mechanical things I will do when I get the bike are:
- check EBB and seatpost are not seized
- replace gearbox oil
- check all bearings
- check brakes / steering / chain
Anything else?

Then ride it a bit and see what else is needed.
I have not had a rohloff geared bike with internal changer before, and I will check or renew the cable.  Otherwise if it all works OK and does not leak I will leave well alone!

Photos will follow of the bike when it arrives.

[martinf]

I offered £700 including delivery (it was of course on the other side of UK).

Rohloff hubs seem to keep their value fairly well, so £700 seems a good price.

Depending on the roads in Sri Lanka it might be worth fitting lighter and wider tyres.

My own favourite for touring is the discontinued Marathon Supreme in the 50x559 width.

This tyre is light and free-running compared to Marathon Plus. Despite the light construction I have had very few punctures and done over 35,000 kms with Supremes. I've scrapped two of them with carcass failures, at 12,000 and 8,000 kms respectively, not too bad IMO for a lightweight tyre, especially considering that I quite often ride on tracks and paths with luggage.

A modern equivalent would be the Continental Contact Urban Plus.

If the roads are really bad, Marathon Mondial should be nearly as puncture proof as the Marathon Plus and better adapted for bad road surfaces. I have used the kevlar bead version in 55x559 (discontinued) and 50x559 (still available last time I looked). Mondial aren't so free running as Marathon Supreme but have tougher sidewalls that should resist impacts with rocks. Weightwise these are in between Supreme and Marathon Plus.     

[RonS]

I think the Raven with Rohloff will be heavier. 

I wouldn't be so sure about that. The Rohloff hub is of course heavier than a derailleur hub, but the difference between it and a derailleur plus a cassette plus a front derailer plus 2 extra chain rings really isn't all that much.

The Raven comes with mudguards, low rider racks and a sturdy rear rack.   The low riders (and probably the mudguards) will go and a lighter rear rack will be fitted.   But after that I am not sure how I can easily reduce weight.

Try to find a lighter box. Not trying to be funny. Of the 4 boxes I've gotten from my local shop for my trips, there's been over 1kg difference between the lightest and heaviest. Sometimes that's all you need. The airlines I've used have a 23kg limit, so I've got to be even more careful.

I have not had a rohloff geared bike with internal changer before, and I will check or renew the cable.  Otherwise if it all works OK and does not leak I will leave well alone!

You have to remove the internal gear change mechanism to inspect the cable for fraying anyway, so you may as well just change it while it's open.
To replace the inner gear cable, you can either buy just the cable and concertina tubes (part 8271), or you can buy what called an "easy set"  (Part 8573 - only for S/N above 25300) which has everything you need  preassembled to just drop in place.
Being the thrifty person that I am, I chose the £6.99 8271 as opposed to the £44.99 easy set. If you're reasonably proficient at working on the bike it really isn't that hard to replace the cable yourself. A bit fiddly perhaps but not that difficult.

I'm currently running the Marathon Mondial folding 50X559 that Martin mentioned and I'm really happy with them. I find them to be smoother rolling than the Continental Top Contacts that they replaced, although I switched to TPU tubes at the same time, so that may have had an effect on the rolling resistance.

Looking forward to seeing pics of the new bike. I hope it turns out to be all that it appears to be.

[Matt2matt2002]

Congratulations.
I took my Raven to Sri Lanka a few years ago.
Lovely country, food and folks.
https://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/welcometothejungle

I returned the following year without the bike but with my wife.

I have used a chain glider for many years.

Let me know if you need any tips for your trip.

Best
Matt

[Andyb1]

Thanks for the replies
- Tyres.  Matt kindly sold me a NOS 2.0 Dureme earlier in the year.  I have been using that on the front end of the Sherpa and that will be moved across.  Rear end I will sort out later and look at what martinf has suggested.
- Bike box.  I used a cut down double walled cardboard ebike box for my trip to India last year and I just weighed it.  6.0kg!!   The bike box which I used the previous year was about 3kg.  So a big potential weight saving there.
- Gear cable.  My hub is before 25300 so the Easy Set will not fit.  SJS could do with mentioning that on their web site.  Rohloff give good instructions on line so it will be the £6.99 8271 kit.  Thanks Ron.
- Thanks for the link Matt, I have read your trip report before and will read it again.

[mickeg]

When I fly with a bike, I have a 50 pound or 23 kg limit per checked bag.  I bring two checked bags, the bike is one of them.  I often move a few parts, like saddle and pedals and rear rack to my second checked bag to make the weight limit.  I am using an S&S case, not a cardboard box.  But the same concept applies, move some weight from one to the other to make your weight limit.

If the bike box is your only checked item, everything else in a carry on bag, then I have no suggestion.

When you are used to derailleurs, you are used to time shift cables and shifters that are indexed to a specific position.  Rohloff, you need to keep the cables loose.  On my Nomad Mk II, I have enough play in my cables so that if I am in gear 10, my shifter could be anywhere from 9.5 to 10.5.  Too tight and it might not shift right.

Keep the Sherpa too.  I still have my Sherpa and for some tours have used it instead of my Rohloff bike.  For some tours I prefer derailleur gearing over the Rohloff.


Is this it?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/326616701130

If so:

That hub is quite old to have the decal on it.  The decal has the original serial number, so do not remove it.  But it looks like the flange support rings have been installed, which is good.

A five arm 110mm chainring is easy to change if you want to use higher or lower gearing than it currently has.

If the sprocket is threaded, I do not see the sprocket removal tool in the photos.  Photo includes an S&S wrench, not sure why since it has no couplers.

I know a lot of people on this forum really push a chain glider, but I am quite content to use a naked chain.  But I like a bash guard on the crankset on my Rohloff bike.

I am not sure what kind of rear rack that is, I am quite content with a Tubus Logo EVO on my Nomad Mk II.

Looks like it has a dropper seatpost, not sure why you would need one.  I would be temped to use a regular one.

Great that it came with a dynohub.

[Andyb1]

That is not my bike Mick, the one I have bought looks a little older and dirtier!  I will post photos when it arrives.
It also has the rohloff sticker for the serial number, and no flange rings…..which means I need to check the hub for cracks.

Reading through earlier posts here and on the Rohloff web site it sounds like the rings are advised when carrying heavy loads.  Of course I don’t know the history of the bike but my useage will be quite light (71kg rider, 10 - 15kg luggage max) so hopefully if no cracks yet it will be OK.

I imagine the sprocket is threaded, another detail to check!

My luggage on the aircraft is just one box with the bike in it and 7k carry on.  Hopefully I can keep the bike box under 25kg.

I have a chainglider on my other more modern rohloff bike and value the protection it gives.  I expect there will be rain and wet roads at times in Sri Lanka and keeping the chain grit free would be good.
 

[PH]

That sounds like a bargain, hubs in their own rarely go for less than £500, and some of those look a bit dodgy, both in the physical sense and their provenance.
Along with the other checks, I'd replace the EBB insert if it's chewed up.  They're often abused by people who think the chain needs to be micro adjusted,  the insert needs to have indents, but they shouldn't be so close together there's a risk of them merging.
If it's a silver shell of that age, it'll be polished aluminium rather than anodised.  If you're that way inclined a bit of Silvo and elbow grease can restore dull hubs to the original polished finish.
Good decision to swap the shifter cable, it's a fiddley job and not something you'd want to do anywhere on tour. It's worth jigging something up to measure the cables, I have a bit of gear outer cable, you don't get much of a second chance. If you're used to an external mech, you'll find the feel is a bit different, crisper and a bit stiffer. I prefer it.
I think my Raven Tour, in the largest size, weighed in at about 17.5kg, with a Tubus rack and dynamo lighting.  I'd find it possible but challenging to get it under your weight limit.

[Andyb1]

Good idea about using a bowden outer to get the gear inner cable length right, and checking the EBB is on the list.  I plan to go to Sri Lanka in February so I have time to get these jobs done.
As well as reducing airline costs the other reason to keep the bike light is that last year when riding in India I frequently had to lift the loaded bike - over streams, up steps and into hotel rooms.  I want to be able to do that with the Raven, and as I get older I am not getting stronger!
My Medium sized Sherpa weighed in at 14kg with ridgeback rear rack, flat bars and egon bar ends, klick lock, toe clips, bell and 2 x water bottle holders.  I will reweigh it (it now has Thorn touring bars) against the Raven in similar spec.

I do like my Carradice handlebar bag but it is extremely heavy for what it carries.  My ancient Karrimore panniers by comparison carry much more and are lighter.

[Matt2matt2002]

Great info from other folks here.
What a great form this is.

Did you mention ring and sprocket size?

I'm running 38 front 17 rear.
I find it suits my overall riding. It's always a balance/ trade off.

I found the roads pretty smooth in Sri Lanka. There were only a couple of times when I went through rough patches. Usually around road works.

Weather? Quite a contrast between the dry arid north around Jaffna and the central Highlands. And east and west coasts when the wet weather drifts in from India.

Humm, all this reflection is making me think of searching out a bike box!!

Cheers

Matt

[in4]

Which tyres have you been using for these exotic escapades, Matt?

[mickeg]

That is not my bike Mick, the one I have bought looks a little older and dirtier!  I will post photos when it arrives.
It also has the rohloff sticker for the serial number, and no flange rings…..which means I need to check the hub for cracks.

Reading through earlier posts here and on the Rohloff web site it sounds like the rings are advised when carrying heavy loads.  Of course I don’t know the history of the bike but my useage will be quite light (71kg rider, 10 - 15kg luggage max) so hopefully if no cracks yet it will be OK.

I imagine the sprocket is threaded, another detail to check!

My luggage on the aircraft is just one box with the bike in it and 7k carry on.  Hopefully I can keep the bike box under 25kg.

I have a chainglider on my other more modern rohloff bike and value the protection it gives.  I expect there will be rain and wet roads at times in Sri Lanka and keeping the chain grit free would be good.

I have never flown with a bike and only one checked bag.  I met two people in Iceland, both had Ritchey Break Away bikes (the frame could be split, similar to S&S Couplers) that managed one carry on bag, one personal item, and only one checked bag.  They were traveling together so I suspect that for some things they could bring a single item to share, such as a spare tire to reduce the load further.  The checked one bag was the Ritchey case with bike and some of their gear, but they were light weight bikes.  I can't imagine being on a bike tour that light, but I suppose if you are always sleeping indoors, do not need tent or sleeping gear, that it is much easier to do.  And warm climate makes that easier too.

Photo of one of their bikes attached.  He had lost his water bottle, was in a hurry to replace it.

Flange rings, Dave W, formerly with SJS said that you should not rebuild a wheel solely to add the flange rings.  By odd coincidence, he said that one day after I added my flange rings.  But I have loaded up my bike quite heavily and likely will in the future too.  I do my own work, so in my case the only cost was my time and the cost of the rings.
https://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=11802.0

If you do not plan to carry a lot of gear, you may be best off not messing with the wheel.

I have not flown on the airline you will be on, so I can't comment on fees, how stringent they are on carry on size and weight, etc.  But I can say that more than once I have gotten onto a plane wearing a jacket that I could not fit inside my luggage.  I wear my helmet onto the plane and put it in the overhead bin, I do not want any luggage handlers to have a chance to break it.

[Matt2matt2002]

Which tyres have you been using for these exotic escapades, Matt?

Oooo. I must avoid this minefield!
But Schwalbe Marathon 1.75"
Used on all tours apart from the Pamir Highway when I used 2.25" I still have them in the loft. Just used for that tour. Excellent and no punctures but I always felt I had the brakes on permanently. Lots of drag.

So, that's what suits me. 1.75" If it ain't broke, don't change....

After my last tour ( second time to Thailand ) I thought I'd treat myself to a new set and in error ordered 1.50".
I think I'll be happy with these since I don't plan any expedition tours again.

My tours have always been, fly in and fly out. None from the front door apart form my Scottish end 2 end.

Bike boxes from my local shop. I get 2 since once I had to cobble them together for the Raven to fit. didn't look pretty but it worked.

My first few days in the new country are spent at a hotel near the airport. I've never been refused storage there since I know when my return flight is and book another couple of nights. Pays to tip the porter a few $ before setting off to ensure the box is there on my return. I take a picture of the box with the porter!
Keep all the bubble wrap inside the box. I also fly out with a fresh reel of gorilla tape.
Only issue I ever had was in Sri Lanka where is was so humid, the tape didn't stick to the cardboard box. As fast as I put it on, it peeled off! But on that occasion I hadn't taken gorilla tape, just a cheapie. So I had to run around town for a quality tape.

Airlines; Turkish and KLM since they both fly out of Aberdeen. I can get to Amsterdam with KLM and then onwards; rather than start from London.
With Turkish, their hub is Istanbul so onwards to Ethiopia or Sri Lanka.
I avoid cheap flights with different airlines . To me that's a lost luggage recipe.

Best airports; Bangkok so smooth. I always fly economy but it was first class service.
Worst; Marrakesh. Maybe I hit a holiday but it was total mayhem.

Excess baggage fees; I've been lucky and never stung for over-weight charges.
Best experience was coming home from Ethiopia - the lady took a look at the scales, said Oh Dear! And then waved me through with a wink!!
Worst experience; flying out of Bishkek where a jobs-worth took a great interest in my bike, almost unpacking it, and sent it through to the airplane with the top of the box wide open despite my protests.
I had visions of everything falling out/apart but as I took my seat I saw a baggage handler sealing it all up with a roll of tape. Phew!

Hope this helps. I'm no expert. More an enthusiastic amateur.
I think I've got it down to a fine art, flying with my bike. Plenty of bubble wrap. Photograph everything in case things go missing or damaged. Same for passport, wallet etc.

No firm plans for another tour. At 71+ insurance gets pretty £££! But fingers crossed

Best
Matt

[in4]

That was a great share Matt, many thanks. I’m running Marathon Mondials 26 x 2.00 and whilst excellent over rough surfaces for the majority of my riding they’re perhaps a bit overkill. In the back of my mind I’m sure I’m reminiscing about my old MK1 Nomad that I had Supremes on. Complete joy to ride on tarmac or similar surfaces.

Bet you’ll be heading back to Try Thai 3 later this year!