will I notice a lighter bike?

[strictnaturist]

Hi folks,
Been on my Mercury Mk 3 for 5 years now. Loving it. Front a rear Thorn racks, plus a seat bag. As I only use the racks for loaded touring and most of my cycling is weekend runs etc, would it make a noticeable difference to my cycling if I took the racks off when not in use? Would I notice the weight difference of not having the racks on and zoom along faster? Or is it more of a hassle than the ease / speed I would gain?
Thanks all
Hope you're getting the fab weather too?
Eddie

[Danneaux]

It has been awhile since we've seen you here, Eddie; welcome back! 

You asked...

Would I notice the weight difference of not having the racks on and zoom along faster?

As it happens, I've done just that from the same motivations and can share what I found.

Removing weight does make the bike lighter by the amount removed (of course it does), but besides making the bike lighter to lift and carry and to pedal uphill, I didn't really notice much difference in my day-to-day riding once the bike was up to speed. Any difference in acceleration (say, across intersections and between traffic signals) was pretty much nil compared to, say, a lighter wheelset I swapped-in. The bike frame (and weight like racks attached to it) was static weight whereas the wheels were dynamic weight I had to accelerate every time I started up from a stop.

Apart from having a tube of medium thread-locking compound ready at hand to prevent the rack bolts from loosening in the future, it is a pretty straightforward operation to remove the rear rack to give it a try. However, If your rear mudguard stays are attached to the rear rack (either to bosses or to P-clips), then you'd need to replace the 'guard stays with unbent ones attaching directly to the dropout eyelets or conduct your trials on dry days with no mudguards as those would need to come off as well. That would be the biggest hassle to conducting an A-B trial...swapping stays or removing the rear 'guards along with the rear rack.

For me, the value of having a rear rack proves itself more often than a front rack when riding without a touring load, as I can strap things atop the rear rack with a bungee or straps, use it as a perch for my Carradice saddle bag or a rack-top pack, or to carry front panniers on the rear for small loads. In contrast, my front lowriders are good only for hauling panniers. A front platform rack would be more versatile than the lowrider but would also weigh more (George/mckeg here uses a very small platform rack in addition to his lowriders and finds it handy). The largest gain I've noticed from removing the front lowrider is less wheel flop and steering that feels a bit quicker than with the rack. That made a noticeable difference to feel but was no faster than before in my tests.

So, take these as my data points offered in good heart and see what others have to say as well.

Oh! As to weather, it was gorgeous here in the US PNW (Pacific Northwest) yesterday with blue skies, sunshine, and 23.3°C for the high. Today is grey, rainy, and cold in contrast at "only" 12.7C but the promise of a return to nicer is in the cards for Thursday.

Best, Dan.

[John Saxby]

Eddie, I keep a lightweight rear rack (Tubus) on my Mercury Mk 3 -- it's very handy, as Dan says.

I do use Tubus low-riders for touring, along with the rear rack.

I also use a Revelate medium frame bag for day trips and as a place to keep my pump, etc.

Not sure where you're writing from, but here in eastern Ontario we have rumours of spring, but not yet the Real Thing.

[martinf]

Similar experience to Dan. As well as reducing weight, taking the racks off ought to add a slight gain in reduced wind resistance, but this should only make a (small) difference when riding fast.

I have one bike (my old 700C lightweight) set up with no racks and just a saddlebag.

I eventually fitted a rear rack to my Raven Sport Tour (Mercury equivalent), as this makes the bike more useful. It made very little difference to riding speed.

For me, fitting tyres with low rolling resistance makes much more difference than reducing weight on the bike. A few years ago I fitted Continental Grand Prix 5000 in 32 mm width to my old 700C lightweight, these tyes made the bike slightly faster than my Raven Sport Tour, but they also mean that the old 700C lightweight is only really suitable for riding on decent roads, rather than towpaths and the occasional track, which I quite often use  with my Raven Sport Tour. The latter has Schwalbe Marathon Supreme 42x559 tyres, mainly for more comfort on not so good road surfaces.

The only bikes where reducing weight does make a big difference to me are the family Bromptons, I find it is much easier to carry 10 kg of bike in one hand than 12 kg.

[mickeg]

Dan mentioned my small front platform rack, I have that on my Sherpa.  Photo attached.  That photo also shows my Tubus Logo EVO in back and a Tubus Ergo (discontinued) up front.  That photo now is 13 years old, for touring on that bike I still use those racks. 

I should mention that I built up most of my bikes from parts.  I bought my Sherpa frame used, and bought my Nomad Mk II frame new.  But I built up the bikes, not purchased as complete bikes.  I have never owned any Thorn racks, so I can't compare those racks to what I use.

I take the front low riders off after a tour.  I keep a photo record, or a written one of where I had spacers between the rack and fork mounts, etc., so it is easier to replicate that when I put the rack on again.  I find the low riders on front are inconvenient on some bike racks at some places I lock up a bike.

Most of my bikes have a rear rack when not touring, but I usually use a different rack for home use.  Touring, I prioritize a lower pannier mounting like on the Tubus Logo EVO or Racktime Addit racks.  But for home use, I am more likely to prioritize a wider platform for a rack top bag.  Thus, I often have a different rack on back when not touring than when touring.  The Tubus Logo EVO has a very narrow platform, too narrow in my opinion for a bag strapped on top, but I really like it as a pannier hauler for touring.  That said, when riding around near home, in back I often have a grocery pannier or my gym bag (also a pannier), but those are occasional and smaller panniers than I use for touring.

I sometimes have a rear rack on my rando bike for home use, a Racktime Addit that works great for lower mounting of panniers but also has a wide enough platform for in town use.  I use the same model rack on my titanium touring bike when touring.  It has a lighter weight rating than the Tubus Logo EVO, if I am not in remote places, I do not need the super high weight rating.

[PH]

Yes it will make a difference, though you might not notice it.  However, if you keep thinking that little thing makes no difference, the accumulation of little things can become significant.  There's also the placebo effect, if you believe you're on a faster bike, you will ride it faster.
I like my Mercury, it was originally marketed as a Sports Tourer and although it's been offered in all sorts of configurations, I still think that's it's best purpose.  It is the most agile and engaging tourer I've ridden, though it is still a tourer.  If you want to improve the speed, or maximise it's agility, first consider tyres, if you're not already on the ideal ones for your use, it could be a big win.  Also consider tubes, Schwalbe XLight will save a bit over standard tubes and I haven't noticed any disadvantage. Or the even lighter plastic tubes, or tubeless, if not already, I haven't been there. Then when it comes to weight, the easy win is removing what you don't need, then if you want to spend, you can look at replacing components with lighter options.  You do get into diminishing returns, how much so depends on your starting point.  I've seen differences of 5kg quoted on here and that is something I would notice. If your bike is at the top end on that, there might be some easy gains, but if you're already towards to lower end, you might be looking at a lot of £'s for a few grams.
Of course, for most of us, the biggest improvement in speed is available from the rider, fitness, weight, aerodynamics, technique... But that's a different story.

[in4]

Coincidentally, I took the front racks off my Nomad. I've found the steering a little lighter. I've never ridden my Nomad without both rear and front racks on. I'm not sure if its a bit of a muscle memory sensation but with the front rack off I feel my steering is more sensitive and I adjust my riding to suit.

[strictnaturist]

Thanks for all you advice and support ( as ever)
Thanks for the welcome back too!
I'm currently running on Panaracer GravelKings Super Slicks at 50mm with tubes. Haven't ventured into tubeless or clip in pedals yet. Might just be a bit old for these new tricks now?
Yes, with the rear rack currently supporting the mud guard, I would have to replace the stays. I do like the look of the Thorn Expedition rack too. Goes really well with the overall look of the Mercury and notice Thorn now do a lightweight version? Not that its that much lighter, I reckon.
We all get older and , I suppose do slow down, are not as strong, but maybe it might be the red paint on the Mercury that's needing a buffing to get the speed back up? :-)
Beautiful weather here in Scotland. Hope its lasts to next weekend. Off to the Isle of Bute with the cycling club.
Thanks again
enjoy every moment
Eddie

[JohnR]

A couple of kg less to be pedalled up any hill will be welcomed by your legs.

[Andyb1]

If the OP wants to save a little weight then the easiest way is not to eat breakfast and ride without water bottles.

[PH]

I do like the look of the Thorn Expedition rack too. Goes really well with the overall look of the Mercury and notice Thorn now do a lightweight version? Not that its that much lighter, I reckon.

Had to have a look, check that the lightweight expedition rack wasn't a one day offer from the start of the month!  Seems not, maybe just the designers sense of humour, I can't imagine anyone buying an expedition rack and considering the 70g saving worthwhile.  Equally, I can't imagine anyone choosing a rack with a higher rating than the bike they're attaching it to, and paying 400g to do so.  My idea of what a Mercury is, deserves a titanium rack, though thankfully when I bought mine it was a third of the current price. 230g as you didn't ask! (Though I think Tubus cheekily weigh them without the fittings.)

I'm currently running on Panaracer GravelKings Super Slicks at 50mm with tubes. Haven't ventured into tubeless or clip in pedals yet. Might just be a bit old for these new tricks now?

From what I know of those tyres (Haven't used them) there isn't much to be gained there, though those with greater 650B experience might know better. 
Due to an ankle injury I temporarily stopped using clipless about 7 years ago, after 15 years of not riding anywhere without.  For me it made no difference, I have no intention of changing back.

maybe it might be the red paint on the Mercury that's needing a buffing to get the speed back up? :-)
Beautiful weather here in Scotland. Hope its lasts to next weekend. Off to the Isle of Bute with the cycling club.

Yes, shiny bikes are faster.  Have a good trip.

[mickeg]

I was unaware that Thorn had two Expedition racks.  I checked, the heavy one is 860 grams, the light weight one is 790 grams.
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/carriers-racks/thorn-expedition-steel-rear-cycle-pannier-rack-black-powdercoat/
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/carriers-racks/thorn-lightweight-expedition-steel-rear-cycle-pannier-rack-black-powdercoat/

So, that would be an expensive way to reduce 70 grams of weight if you have the heavy version.