Rohloff factory tour in photos and text

[Danneaux]

Hi All!

There is a nice writeup on Bikepacking.com, showing some of the Rohloff production process in photos and text...
https://bikepacking.com/plog/inside-rohloff/?fbclid=IwAR1plZoTIrGo-Px-bALhkQIfGrPRKP5nGlu3OYyIVS1hhbRe0nuTrGXCRX0

Similar "tours" include...
Schmidt (SON) dynamo hubs...
https://bikepacking.com/plog/inside-son-dynamo-hubs/
...and...
Ortlieb bags...
https://bikepacking.com/plog/inside-ortlieb/

There are more, similar stories at Bikepacking.com, but these are the ones most likely to be of broadest interest here. 

Best, Dan.

[mickeg]

Thanks for posting.

A few months ago I posted this, link is to an eight year old video but a really good one on seeing how they build up a Rohloff in the factory.

Ahhh, one more video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHiBcXukmOM

At about 2:34 he starts describing (in German) the shifting mechanism.

And at about 4:29 he turns the shifter with a wrench and ... you have to watch it.

I started laughing as the parts went flying.

I just watched that part at about four and a half minutes again where the parts went flying, and I started laughing again.

Since I have no clue how to install a pawl spring, that convinced me that if I tried to take mine apart, I would probably never be able to use it again.

[Danneaux]

Since I have no clue how to install a pawl spring...

As it probably would be for most of us, George.

My only past experience with pawl spring replacement was on the old Regina (Extra, Oro) freewheels. They seemed to eat pawl springs and could leave one stranded roadside. Owners soon learned they could get home by cobbling up a fixed-gear of sorts by using a toe strap robbed from a clip to secure the freewheel to the spokes and riding ever so gently the rest of the way, hoping there would be no hills. Pawl springs were in short supply, so I wound my own using first guitar strings, then piano wire. I always took a couple in my tool bag, along with a small centerpunch. The drill (usually done in the rain and with darkness falling -- these things never failed at a good time) was to use a roadside rock as a hammer on the center punch to spin off the cover plate, then catch the outer set of fine 1/8in ball bearings, being careful not to release the set in the second race at the rear. Dental floss came in handy to hold the pawls closed. At that point, the old springs could be swapped for newer ones, the process reversed and hopefully one could be on their way again. That is assuming one of the vital small parts did not get lost in the grass.

It is no surprise I embraced SunTour 3.3.3 freewheels as soon as they appeared. I never had trouble with them or the later Pro-Compe and Ultra-series SunTour freewheels.

Almost as much fun was removing a punctured sew-up tubular tire from where it was glued on the rim, dousing the tires in water from a bidon to find the leak, then cutting the stitching to patch the tube. Of course the casing had to be resewn without nicking the tube and the lot wrestled back onto the rim where one hoped the old glue might still hold (having discovered your tube of Tubast had dried out since last use and would be no help at all) before riding gingerly onward.

Good times.  Clincher rims/tires and removable innertubes made cycling life a whole lot simpler and easier, especially for the touring cyclist, though I do remember the nice ride from my Clément Criterium Seta Extras.

Best, Dan.

[mickeg]

I never had that experience with freewheels.  Interesting.  I usually used Suntour freewheels, it was easy to switch sprockets to make a custom freewheel.

The clincher tires available in the 1970s in 27X1 1/4 were not very good, I got lucky and got an early 1960s Italian bike used that had tubular tires in the late 1970s.  That italian bike was my first Regina cluster experience.  I did make a custom Regina, but every sprocket was threaded on and that was harder to make a custom cluster.

I never went far with my tubular tires, was always nervous about a flat and when I got a flat I walked it home.  One exception, I signed up for a group century, rode that bike and fortunately did not have a flat.  Carried a spare tire on that ride.  That was in the early 1980s, weather forecasts back then were poor, and had about 3 inches of unexpected snow during the last part of the century.  I managed to get lucky and got a ride in a pickup truck during the last 15 miles, did not ride the last of the century.  The headwind in blowing snow was a real pain in the rear.

That group century was before triathalons existed.  It was called the Minnesota Ironman, only cycling, no running, no swimming.  I was surprised later to hear that some other organizations took the Ironman name for their competitions, I was surprised that they could steal a copyrighted name.  Was curious, Minnesota Ironman still exists.
https://ironmanbikeride.org/

[JohnR]

Thanks for posting. It's interesting that Rohloff has doubled the output in recent years due to demand from e-bike manufacturers. That also says a lot for the underlying robustness given that other hubs offering fewer gears are much less expensive. I wasn't aware that Rohloff only does the assembly any sub-contracts the component manufacture subject to strict quality control.

I've yet to figure out the excitement surrounding pinion gearboxes given that the frames have to be specially made but I've not yet noticed the impact on the ride quality caused by the weight of a Rohloff hub being at the back (where is also most of the weight of the rider and baggage). Kindernay introduced their Rohloff clone which has some useful improvements but, when I checked a few days ago, prices were higher than Rohloff and there was no stock.

[PH]

Hi All!

There is a nice writeup on Bikepacking.com,

Thanks Dan, not read them yet, but bookmarked for another time.

[PH]

Thanks for posting. It's interesting that Rohloff has doubled the output in recent years due to demand from e-bike manufacturers.

That doesn't surprise me, I also think it's what's broken the US market for them, some major E-bike brands have taken them up.  Bosch also thought it a big enough market to partner with Rohloff for, electronic shifter works with the motor and hub 
Who knows what's next, I think the future of E-bikes is combined motor and gearing, I know there's already steps in that direction, if nothing else it'll offer huge production savings.   

[Andre Jute]

There is a nice writeup on Bikepacking.com,

Thanks Dan, not read them yet, but bookmarked for another time.

+1
Always grateful to have something interesting to read on my treadmill at times when it is impossible to cycle.

[WorldTourer]

I've yet to figure out the excitement surrounding pinion gearboxes given that the frames have to be specially made but I've not yet noticed the impact on the ride quality caused by the weight of a Rohloff hub being at the back (where is also most of the weight of the rider and baggage).

For more and more bicycle travelers, the weight is no longer around the back wheel but around the seatpost (seatpost pack), middle triangle (frame pack), handlebars (handlebar roll) and fork (fork bags or panniers). There are good reasons for this – a lot of popular routes these days involve long hike-a-bike uphill and even lifting the bike over obstacles, and that is much more comfortable if the weight is towards the front. That is the demographic that is especially excited about Pinion. I personally don’t see much of a difference in weight distribution between Rohloff vs Pinion, but other people claim to.

[mickeg]

...
I've yet to figure out the excitement surrounding pinion gearboxes given that the frames have to be specially made but I've not yet noticed the impact on the ride quality caused by the weight of a Rohloff hub being at the back (where is also most of the weight of the rider and baggage). ...

If I was building up a bike today with internal gearing, I would have to think hard about the difference in gearing, Pinion 18 has a wider range and slightly closer gear spacing than Rohloff.  There were times on a tour when I spun out on a long shallow downhill and I wished I had one more higher gear.  But I value my lower gears enough that I won't change the gearing to get a higher one.

But I have the bike with internal gears now, so not shopping for more.

[JohnR]

I would be happy with slightly wider gear steps. If Herr Rohloff had chosen 15% then the overall range by my calculation, would be over 600%.

[Andre Jute]

I would be happy with slightly wider gear steps. If Herr Rohloff had chosen 15% then the overall range by my calculation, would be over 600%.

>
There's always a trade-off in whatever you design, whatever you buy. There was a time when the roadies complained that the 13.6% steps between gears on the Rohloff were too large. Not having been a roadie, and having hated derailleur transmissions fervently for their malicious propensity to fold up every time I passed a bike shop, I just didn't see it. I valued the Rohloff for its sturdiness and ability to change gear at any time, even at standstill. When the time came to build an electric bike, that unbreakability became in my eyes the premier virtue of the Rohloff, even above Herr Rohloff's liberal warranty interpretation. (Think about it: if the thing doesn't break whatever you ask of it, you don't need a liberal warranty interpretation; it becomes a security blanket, nice to have and to mention to cyclists considering a Rohloff, but not essential.) It wouldn't surprise me at all if there were other sincerely held views within the universe of experienced Rohloff riders.

I looked into the Pinion* when it was new, and decided that a dedicated frame was too much of a risk for me: after all, I thrice changed the configuration of my favourite bike, the Utopia-velo Kranich, once to electrify it, replacing the generator hub with a front wheel motor, once more to fit a central motor. That the Kranich, 14 years old this year, has become my bike with the longest use and the most miles, is in a large measure due to the Rohloff, which works well with everything on the bike, and all its purposes. Believe me, regardless of what it cost, if the Rohloff proved unsatisfactory in any respect, I would have thrown it off right smartly, and recovered the cost with an article in an appropriate medium trashing it for cause.

* I was in fact favourably predisposed towards the Pinion because it was designed by Porsche and I have long experience with Porsche from the 356B through the 911 to the 928 (the last-named being the best grand tourer ever built). But that doesn't in my opinion justify a premium over the Rohloff until it is proven to last as long. Nor do I consider the extra gears much of a benefit: quite the opposite, they are just more complication and chances to go wrong and not endure as long as the Rohloff. The Rohloff is evidently extremely tough competition to overcome, so I'm not surprised that the Pinion, according to a report in this thread, has spotty availability. Maybe that bike-packing niche market World Tourer mentions will grow into a new fad like riding gravel, and save Pinion yet. Or it could turn into a fashion, a "bike-packer profile bike" requiring a Pinion to look like "the real thing". Don't sneer -- it is all grist to the mill; those of us on Big Apple and other fat tyres that don't cost the earth are the beneficiaries of the 29er fad a few years ago.

[WorldTourer]

But that doesn't in my opinion justify a premium over the Rohloff until it is proven to last as long.

The Pinion tour that Tristan Bogaard filmed showed the internals of the Pinion, and they look very simple indeed. The company obviously studied Rohloff and designed something that, I expect, would last as long as a Rohloff if not longer. Multiple Alaska–Ushuaia and Trans-African expeditions have now been done on Pinions, so the technology is as about tested as the Rohloff was when I decided to order one from Thorn long ago.

The Rohloff is evidently extremely tough competition to overcome, so I'm not surprised that the Pinion, according to a report in this thread, has spotty availability.

I initially interpreted JohnR’s post as saying that Pinion was out of stock, but now I see he meant the Kindernay hub? But even if Pinions are out of stock, sales to end consumers aren’t a big part of their business. Generally one is supposed to get a Pinion as part of a complete build from builders like Tout Terrain or VSF Fahrradmanufaktur.

[PH]

I would be happy with slightly wider gear steps.

Can't please everyone!  One of the big advantages of derailleurs is the ability to fine tune your gearing to match your preferences.  I understand why Rohloff gears are evenly spaced, but my preference would be for some wider gaps in the low range and closer in the high*. Dropping down from 2nd to bottom doesn't always feel much of a difference, but sometimes going 13 to 14 feels a huge gap.  Not having the perfect higher ratios doesn't really matter riding solo, it can make it harder staying in a group.

* My preferred 11-28 9 speed cassette (When I used such things) had over 16% gaps at the bottom and under 9% at the top.

[PH]

I looked into the Pinion* when it was new, and decided that a dedicated frame was too much of a risk for me:

I've also been tempted and then rejected for similar reasons, I don't mind that my average frame stays with me for 5 - 10 years, before I either break them or change on a whim, but my Rohloffs are for life!  The oldest one is in it's 4th frame and two of the predecessors have gone on to be used with other gearing by the new owners. A Pinion frame isn't much use for anything else.
The same can be said of purpose built E-bikes, I'm not sure how I feel about that, I think their utility leads me to think of them as a unit, rather than a collection of components.