Author Topic: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount  (Read 6260 times)

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2022, 02:38:39 am »
Not a failed rack-mount. Yes, a cracked fork-blade  :'(

REALLY pissed-off with Thorn right now. Lousy response to my reasonable questions, and quite wrongly accusing me of overloading the fork.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2022, 03:18:07 am by il padrone »

Robin Thorn

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2022, 08:43:18 am »
I really don't have the time to constantly monitor forum threads, thanks Dan for pointing this one out to me.
I have had a quick look through my emails but I'm afraid I can't find my replies without more time than I have currently.
Feel free to publish my replies to your emails.
What I would just explain is the extended guarantee we offered on frame and fork was only if purchased as part of a complete bike, not as in this case. I also didn't mention that this type of failure can be caused as a result of crash damage.
My personal feeling was that the fork blade was ripped not the weld failed but that was just from the photos.
 

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2022, 10:54:00 pm »
I was NOT seeking any warranty cover, just information and opinion about repair, via email. What I got instead was a false accusation of “overloading” by use of rear panniers on the front rack, a thing that I never do. Upon asking further about the rack-mount fastening medium there was no reply. We deduced that it was silver solder. A bit of customer-service would go a long way.

Upon comparing the old fork with the 2018 disc-fork it is clear that the rack mounts which have been changed to 5mm instead of 6mm, have a narrower solder-solder join. The crack went through the weld and into the fork. My framebuilder’s comment was that a fork should never crack in that location. It is clear that my use of the Tubus Duo with this now-narrowed mount has caused the failure. As I wish to continue using disc brakes, I plan to get the fork repaired (both sides) with a patch-plate and widened band of silver-solder for the rack-mount.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2022, 10:59:46 pm by il padrone »

mickeg

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2022, 12:57:00 pm »
...
 It is clear that my use of the Tubus Duo with this now-narrowed mount has caused the failure. As I wish to continue using disc brakes, I plan to get the fork repaired (both sides) with a patch-plate and widened band of silver-solder for the rack-mount.

Is it practical to use a hoop type rack where the hoop over the wheel is used to add some structural integrity to the rack unlike a rack like the Duo (or the Thorn front low rider rack) that will put twisting stress on the fork blade and rack mount if you crash?

If you are having a frame builder work on the fork, any adjustment to the mounts to enable a hoop type fork could be made at that time too.

When I look at sales brochure from when I ordered my Nomad Mk II frame and fork (rim brake) in early 2013, the sales brochure listed the bike weight capacity with this statement:  Max Load using Front panniers with 20Kg and Rear panniers, 3Kg bar bag + 3 cages.

I doubt that I have ever loaded the front panniers (25 liter Frontloaders) with my rain gear strapped on top anywhere near 20 kg, and that rating would have been based on a Thorn Rack that is mounted the same way as a Duo.

I have only once weighed my individual panniers during a tour, I did that from curiosity.  My front panniers summed to about 10 kg.

I initially tried a Tara on my rim brake fork, but did not like how far the horizontal bar deviated from horizontal.  I ended up using a rack without a hoop that is attached similar to a Duo, but now I wonder if that is a bad idea.  My fork is now nine years old, warranty ended long ago.

In your case with a fork that is only two years old, I would have assumed it was covered under warranty.

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #19 on: September 27, 2022, 09:56:32 am »
I could readily get a Tara rack to fit, but as the Thorn fork was designed to suit a Duo, and because I preferred its cleaner look I fitted the Duo. It has run very well for over 9 years of all sorts of rough stuff. There are no different fittings needed for a Tara hoop-style rack; I just would prefer to use the excellent Duo racks that I have bought. They have often carried up to 14kg in total (6-7kg per side).

Thorn give no warranty upon separately purchased frames nor on forks, only on whole bikes.

mickeg

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #20 on: September 28, 2022, 11:18:47 pm »
...
Thorn give no warranty upon separately purchased frames nor on forks, only on whole bikes.

I built my Nomad Mk II in early 2013.  At that time the sales brochure Issue 20 was what I relied on for my information when I bought my frame on or about 9 Apr 2013.  I made the attached graphic from page 23 in their sales brochure.

I have had no reason to file a warranty claim and have no expectation of doing so, but if they would have said to me that I was buying a frame and fork with no warranty, that is a sale that would not have occurred.

JohnR

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #21 on: September 29, 2022, 08:47:02 am »
I would have expected a frame to have a warranty even if only bought as a frame. Spa Cycles provide 10 years warranty to the original owner eg https://spacycles.co.uk/m11b0s143p3698/SPA-CYCLES-Titanium-Elan-Mk1-Frameset although there's no corresponding statement for the forks. 

PH

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #22 on: September 29, 2022, 11:53:42 am »
It isn't true that you had no warranty, what RT clearly says is that the extended warranty doesn't apply on framesets, I'd never assumed it did. 
For everything purchased in the UK, and the EU,  there's a minimum requirement - Any fault appearing in the first six months is considered to have been there from the start.  A fault appearing after that, is covered for a reasonable time up to 6 years, depending on the goods, their use and expectation..  It's debatable how long that reasonable time should be on a cycle frameset, but it's usually accepted that any consumer goods not considered disposable should be covered for a minimum of two years.
All warranties rely on a fair amount of goodwill.  If the fault is disputed, it's the retailers responsibility to prove it was caused by the consumer if it occurs in the first six months.  Any time after that, whether the warranty is statutory or contractual, the position is reversed, it's the consumers responsibility to demonstrate either the fault was there from the outset, or is the result of faulty materials or workmanship.  Good luck to anyone who thinks they can do that!
Basically, after six months, unless you have something that formed part of the sales agreement that says otherwise (like unconditional) you're suggesting to the retailer that the fault shouldn't have occurred and hoping they agree with you.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2022, 12:12:22 pm by PH »

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #23 on: September 30, 2022, 12:04:29 pm »
...
Thorn give no warranty upon separately purchased frames nor on forks, only on whole bikes.

I built my Nomad Mk II in early 2013.  At that time the sales brochure Issue 20 was what I relied on for my information when I bought my frame on or about 9 Apr 2013.  I made the attached graphic from page 23 in their sales brochure.

Grrr….  Clearly the fork is not part of that, but it does still leave a bad taste.

PH

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2022, 12:26:30 pm »
Here's a screenshot from the current brochure, maybe if it wasn't 80 pages long more people would read it properly.

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2022, 04:45:16 am »
Finally, after a stint with the old rim-brake Nomad fork (steerer too short, fork crown headlight bolt out-of-line) I have the repaired disc-fork back. All TIG-welded on. It ain't pretty but it sure ain't going to be moving any time soon.

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2022, 04:46:03 am »
Brutal but tough.

mickeg

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2022, 10:42:52 am »
That fork should work well for you now.

Finally, after a stint with the old rim-brake Nomad fork (steerer too short, fork crown headlight bolt out-of-line) ...

My headlight mounting hole at the fork crown was also aimed to one side, and with a plastic headlamp mount I could not bend the mount to accommodate it.

But I recalled that a friend had an alignment problem on a frame with something and he fixed it with those spherical washers that come on rim brake pad holders that are designed to adjust alignment.  That is how I got mine fixed, see photo.

But I agree with you, it should have been aligned right in the first place.

Later I switched to a B&M light with a metal mount.  So, more time spent to get the mount bent just right to compensate.

il padrone

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Re: Thorn Nomad fork rack mount
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2022, 12:30:45 pm »
For the past 9 years while using the fork I used a set of the same spherical V-brake pad spacers (from cartridge pads) to correct the light aim. Even with a rod-steel headlight bracket I could not bend it to get the aim straight. Since I got the new disc fork I binned these and could not find any more at short notice, so for the past 2 moths I have just put up with it.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2022, 12:35:52 pm by il padrone »