Thorn heat treated tubing

[Andre Jute]

It appears that Peugeot called their in house manganese alloy steel HLE (Haute Limite Elastique)

Not elastic enough!

From my viewpoint this thread hasn't drifted off-topic at all. See, to me my old Peugeot bike seemed like the triumph of engineering, and marketing too, over customers' interests. The frame was too stiff to ride well, the boutique components didn't last, the whole affair was extremely frustrating. I didn't know enough then (it was the last in the sequence of inadequate bikes that collectively I think of as "my first bike") to come to my final conclusion about it, which now that I know much more is: It was a bike designed by engineers who probably didn't cycle, or didn't cycle much, juniors showing off in order to work their way up to designing cars. On the other hand, once I knew a bit, I arrived at Thorn where it soon became clear (to me at least) that the bikes were heavily influenced by the fact that the designer is a cyclist with a proper respect for the comfort of his clientele (practicality of touring bikes fit for purpose, physical fit of cyclist to bicycle, etc), and for their pockets as well (no stupid, overpriced, worthless boutique parts, just good-value long-lasting components you can trust your life to). The only thing about Andy Blance's designs I didn't (and don't) like was that the tubes are welded together, which is also relevant to this thread. and that is probably a personal matter of being an artist with an overdeveloped aesthetic sense about which the majority of his customers, were they less well-mannered, would say, "Grow up! We don't need the cost and weight of lugs," or even, "And see what it cost you in that Peugeot bike with its pretty fillets!"

It seems to me significant that Peugeot's proprietary HLE manganese alloy, and the jointing method associated with it, have disappeared like the morning mist (together with its Sachs Huret components, no loss at all), while Reynolds tubes and Shimano components march on.

[Paragraph on own brand products removed on hand of PH's post below -- AJ 9 May 2019]

[Prince of Darkness]

The only thing about Andy Blance's designs I didn't (and don't) like was that the tubes are welded together

I don't think any of the Andy Blance designs which were made in Britain were welded. Most were fillet brazed, with a few lugged. Welded Thorn frames started appearing when they started getting them made in Taiwan I really like my welded RST, but always felt that my fillet brazed XTC was a bit special

[PH]

If the implication of posts up the thread is that at least some Thorn brand tubes are relabelled Reynolds,

I don't think that's the case, or see where you draw that implication from.  I've never seen anything that indicates Reynolds make for anyone else, though I know the opposite is true - that some Reynolds branded tubes are made under license by other manufacturers.

[Andre Jute]

If the implication of posts up the thread is that at least some Thorn brand tubes are relabelled Reynolds,

I don't think that's the case, or see where you draw that implication from.

That's why I used the conditional case, "If", as the first word of the observation, because we don't know. I drew the implication from a misreading of the exchange about tube size/numbering between you and Mike; I apologise for the misreading to both of you. I've removed the relevant paragraph from the post. Thanks for the heads-up.