Carradice questions

[leftpoole]

Dan,
One further small point.
You mention green as an option. My experience with other Carradice bags is that the Green/Honey have a less tough material.
Regards,
John

[DAntrim]

I did stumble upon a blog where he made a 'DIY' camper longflap link below.....

http://www.bikepacking.com/gear/diy-longflap-saddlebag-minimalist-bike-touring/

Carlos

[Danneaux]

Thanks so much for the additional thoughts. I'm surely leaning toward black if I buy a Carradice, John, but Carlos' link to make one has me thinking about sitting at the sewing machine once more.

I made my original panniers and handlebar bag myself and they served well for more than 30 years before I finally grew tires of replacing the bin/trash compactor liners daily on wet tours. A neighbor of some years ago made his own saddlebags, and perhaps it is time for me to think along those lines also.

Or...if I could find a deal. Hmm. We'll see! 

Really helpful suggestions and ideas, and now I am fleshing out my kit. It will work with an assortment of dry sacks on the rear rack and my large Ortlieb underseat bag, but it would surely be nice to take it in one bag I could detach and take with me on a shoulder strap if needed.

Your thoughts on waterproofness are especially helpful to me. I would have though sure water might have run in through the top strap mounts, but I'm guessing there is no large gap there in reality, and whatever gap there is must be shielded by the wooden dowel, fabric tension, and any overhang of the saddle and rider's posterior.

All the best,

Dan.

[geocycle]

I have a green Barley and a black cadet with a QR bagman.  Colour wise I prefer the black when new although the green is ageing nicely.  Both have internal drawstring necks that IMO are a bit short but do keep rain out when the flaps are done up nice and tight.  The advantage of the QR is that you can easily take it off and carry it with a shoulder strap making it a commuting option.  The leather buckles just take a minute or so whereas the QR is instantaneous after a bit of practice. I've not reproofed either. I went for the cadet over the Nelson (same size main compartment) as I don't find the pockets very useful.

The bagman rack needs regular retightening but does hold the load OK and keeps the bag vertical.  If I do a short tour with it I would take the rack off as the panniers can't be easily fixed onto it with the bagman in place. I'm currently experimenting with the cadet sitting on the rack held by the QR without the bagman frame.  In terms of functionality, Ortlieb are hard to beat but the carradice bags look great, especially the saddlebags and can be used off the bike.

[mickeg]

Before GoreTex (yup, I was camping back in the dark ages), Kelty nylon backpacks did not have much waterproofing, Mr Kelty said that packs leak so you are better off assuming they will leak.  Mountain parkas sold as shells were often made of a blend of cotton and polyester, the cotton was supposed to swell to retard the rate that water came in.  My Tilley hat that I bought in the 1990s is cotton, it is cool to wear in the sun because it breathes well, but the cotton swells up when it get wet so water does not pour through it.  My Tilley and my old mountain parkas in the 70s were not waxed, yet they were reasonably water resistant solely from the tightness of weave that got tighter when wet.

But, jeans that also have a fairly heavy weave leak like a sieve.  So, the fabric selection and tightness of weave must be most critical.

My Carradice saddle bags (Nelson Longflap and also a Pendal) have a lining fabric inside.  You might not notice that in the photos, thus if you plan to make your own bag, you might consider a lining.  The second photo in my posting with photos had the flap open, you can see the inside of the flap is a lighter color, it is a much lighter weight fabric.  I don't know how much that adds to water resistance or stiffness, I am simply pointing out that most photos do not show a different lining fabric.

[martinf]

If you are looking for a home made quick release rackless support system for a Carradice saddlebag, you could consider copying the Kwiklift I have on 3 of my bikes.

W.G. Lord used to make these, but they are no longer available.

I haven't photographed my own, but photos from the CTC forum should be visible by scrolling down on this link:

http://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?p=130466

[Danneaux]

So helpful; many thanks!

In the same spirit, here is a useful link for consideration wrt to saddlebag supports and their virtues and faults:
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-035/000.html

Best,

Dan.

[leftpoole]

Dan,Your thoughts on waterproofness are especially helpful to me. I would have though sure water might have run in through the top strap mounts, but I'm guessing there is no large gap there in reality, and whatever gap there is must be shielded by the wooden dowel, fabric tension, and any overhang of the saddle and rider's posterior.

Between the flap and the bag you will require plastic bags!
John

[Danneaux]

Between the flap and the bag you will require plastic bags!

 

Uh-oh.

John, can you please you tell me more?

All the best,

Dan.

[leftpoole]

The Carradice Camper has a long flap which folds so to make the bag smaller in general use.
If you want to fill to capacity the folded part simply unfolds giving lots of space. But the sides (each end ) are open to the elements. Require plastic bags.
John

[Danneaux]

Ah! Makes perfect sense now, John; many thanks.

I'd planned to put the tent under the long flap. I think the problem can be overcome, but I have to give it a bit more thought.

I can see I'm a ways from placing an order.

All the best,

Dan.

[leftpoole]

Dan,
I use one for minimum Camping on occasion. I find it satisfactory.
John

[martinf]

I did stumble upon a blog where he made a 'DIY' camper longflap link below.....

http://www.bikepacking.com/gear/diy-longflap-saddlebag-minimalist-bike-touring/

Carlos

I have made several sets of panniers, a couple of handlebar bags and one very large saddlebag modelled on the Longflap, but with an even bigger main compartment instead of pockets. But all out of heavy grade proofed nylon fabric.

Sewing heavy grade nylon or Cordura in bag shapes is hard enough. I would be very reluctant to attempt making a saddlebag in cotton duck, I'd rather try and adapt the Carradice bag if I really wanted other features.

A few years ago I worked out that factoring in the build time and the time spent sourcing the materials it was much more expensive to make bags than buy them, except when I really needed something not available commercially.

So I bought Ortleib bags for my Raven Tour and very cheap basic panniers for the visitor bikes. The latter sometimes get abused, so I reckoned it was better to mend cheap panniers fairly frequently rather than have holes, salt and sand in expensive ones.

I still have my home made panniers from the late 1970's, they are now extremely tatty and are used mainly for local shopping when I leave the bike locked up outside the supermarket.   

[Danneaux]

I still have my home made panniers from the late 1970's...

Martin,

I think we made ours about the same time! I agree with all your observations above. A good set of modern, commercially produced panniers will indeed last a very long time and be reliable throughout. My homemade ones were good also...I used tempered aluminum sheet for the backing plates and formed stainless steel into mounting hooks, employing stainless steel springs as the tensioning members. A *lot* of work. I used a urethane-coated waterproofed nylon oxford, but in time the urethane rubber rotted and rolled off, leaving me with water-permeable nylon bags.  That's where the bin liners came in. They worked also, but wore through quickly on rough roads and then things would become seriously wet from the rainwater pooling inside the outer bags. 

Finally...enough. I became a confirmed Ortliebian and my water ingress woes ended. The old bags still soldier on, but the smell of the rotted rubber is akin to a dead cat and limits their use to more utilitarian aims (i.e. hauling garden hoses and seed packets home from the store).

All the best,

Dan.

[Donerol]

Sewing heavy grade nylon or Cordura in bag shapes is hard enough. I would be very reluctant to attempt making a saddlebag in cotton duck, I'd rather try and adapt the Carradice bag if I really wanted other features.

Just for info, I have sewn both heavy Cordura and heavy cotton duck, and I found the duck significantly easier. I used a domestic electric machine. The waterproof 'plastic' coating on the cordura blunted the needles quickly, and the fabric tended to slither about. On the other hand 12-oz  cotton duck was no trouble. It was only showerproof (didn't need to be waterproof) but it would have been easy to wax it after making up.

The Carradice duck is thinner than my 12-oz stuff.