SON Deluxe Klassik and Son Edelux not working

[Shackleton]

Hi All,

My Son Edelux light which is powered by a SON Deluxe Klassik is not working. I don't know which of the two components is causing the malfunction. Does anybody have any idea how I can check which component it might be?

Cheers,

Brian

[Danneaux]

Hi Brian!

So sorry to hear you're having trouble with your lighting setup. It seems the most common fault with dynamo systems relates to wiring and connectors, so I would check those first, looking for breaks and loose fittings. It is most likely you're using a double (in the case of Edelux, coaxial) wiring setup, so you wouldn't have to worry about a ground (earthing) fault caused by using one hot lead and the frame as the return.

I would suggest starting with the dynamo itself and see if it is producing electricity. If you have a voltage meter, connect it across the two terminals, give the wheel a spin, and see if anything registers. Lacking a meter, you can connect a bulb and see if it lights at all when moving the wheel.

I can't endorse it, but the SON hub will produce enough current to give a shock at the fingertips when they bridge the terminals while the wheel is spun briskly. That's one way to tell if it is working, but I have to caution against it even though I'm the guy who roughly tests the voltage in 9-volt batteries by placing the terminals against my tongue. 

If the hub dyno is working, then the problem is likely in the wiring or the light. If it is the light, it might be in the magnetic switch. I have read isolated reports that can be a rare problem on the Edelux. If so, I recall seeing the part (ring-switch) available recently on a German vendor's site.

Hope this helps.

Best,

Dan.

[geocycle]

In addition to dans suggestions, also check the edelux for condensation. I also have that combo and it stopped working for a week because of dampness. I put it down to condensation due to a damp shed and relatively warm weather.

[mickeg]

If you try a volt meter or some other type of meter on the hub or wiring, keep in mind that it is AC, not DC.

[Shackleton]

Hey All,

Thanks for the replies!

I just tried the aul fingertips trick and got nothing so I'm presuming its a problem with the dynohub. Any ideas what the problem could be?

Cheers,

Brian

[jags]

yip it's knackered.

jags.

[mickeg]

Hey All,

Thanks for the replies!

I just tried the aul fingertips trick and got nothing so I'm presuming its a problem with the dynohub. Any ideas what the problem could be?

Cheers,

Brian

I never heard of the finger on the dynohub trick, so when I saw that I tried it myself.  I could not feel a thing.  I licked my finger tip to get good contact, still did not feel a thing.  I know my hub works, I have measured power out of the USB port by just giving the wheel a spin by hand. 

So, try another test before you get rid of the hub.

If you have a old style bulb for a tail light, you could direct wire that to the hub with new wire and give it a spin by hand.  I say an old style because an incandescent bulb will work with AC, whereas an LED might not work on AC.  Spinning by hand won't overload a tail light bulb.

[Danneaux]

I never heard of the finger on the dynohub trick...

  <nods> I hadn't either, until I read the warning in SON's manuals, then managed to get my finger on the bare contacts while the wheel was spinning briskly. Could definitely feel it, but -- yes! -- an incandescent bulb is a much better tool to use; as good as a multimeter for seeing if the dynohub is producing juice.
From: http://www.nabendynamo.de/produkte/pdf/english/Montage_SON_28_klassik_e.pdf

Important advice
With the lights switched off, the fast spinning generator induces a high and possibly dangerous voltage. For this reason the switch and generator must be connected by a fully insulated cable like the one provided, i.e. with no bare parts.

...and...
From: http://www.koga-signature.com/docs/Instructions-for-use_SON-28_English.pdf

A hub dynamo generates high voltage when lights are switched off and at the very moment of switching it off. Touching it in such a moment might be painful or even dangerous. For this reason, careful, contact-free wiring must be ensured

As for failure, I just this afternoon saw a SON28 Klassik that had been murdered by a home mechanic who tried to disassemble it to "fix the cones, which were *obviously* too tight. I could barely spin the axle with my fingers". Chucking the axle in a vise, he had reefed on it and promptly broke the internal terminal-wire connections. This is really about the only way a SON will stop producing juice. There is no gearing or internal parts that spin -- the hub shell and magnets simply rotate around the commutator "claw" and produce juice. A grinding sound may be traced to rust on the claw due to submersion or other water entry, or possibly a dislodged magnet. Otherwise, the hub should keep producing electricity. Well worth checking to be sure, but my money is on a broken wire or connection, then if those check out, I'm guessing a magnetic ring-switch on the Edelux. but more likely wiring/terminals.

Best,

Dan.

[il padrone]

I never heard of the finger on the dynohub trick, so when I saw that I tried it myself.  I could not feel a thing.  I licked my finger tip to get good contact, still did not feel a thing.  I know my hub works, I have measured power out of the USB port by just giving the wheel a spin by hand. 

So, try another test before you get rid of the hub.

Yes, I would be looking for much more reliable confirmation of failure. The easiest test would be to connect another headlight up to the dynohub. If none available, talk to friends, local bike shop, or use another type of 6V light.

If you have a old style bulb for a tail light, you could direct wire that to the hub with new wire and give it a spin by hand.  I say an old style because an incandescent bulb will work with AC, whereas an LED might not work on AC.  Spinning by hand won't overload a tail light bulb.

According to Peter White Schmidt make a dedicated DC Edelux light for e-bikes powered by batteries. This tees with my understanding that the regular Edelux runs on the AC from the dynohub but outputs a DC to the tail-light, which some tail-lights may not work with.

The Edelux II DC is now available for E Bikes, often called "pedelec systems". It uses the same LED, mirror, lens and housing as the Edelux II for hub dynamos. But the electronics inside are different, being designed for the DC from an E Bike's battery, rather than AC from a bicycle dynamo. The Edelux II DC is not compatible with a bicycle dynamo

All of my LED tail-lights are wired direct to the SON28, and work fine.

[Shackleton]

Hi,

So my cheapy amazon bought voltmeter arrived today and the dynohub seems to be working fine thankfully! I'll replace the magnetic ring on the edelux as suggested by Dan and hope for the best.

Cheers,

Brian

[Danneaux]

Whew! At least, the most expensive component did not fail.

All the best,

Dan.

[mickeg]

Hi,

So my cheapy amazon bought voltmeter arrived today and the dynohub seems to be working fine thankfully! I'll replace the magnetic ring on the edelux as suggested by Dan and hope for the best.

Cheers,

Brian

I find a cheap volt meter is pretty handy to have around the house.

If you have figured out how to use the resistance (ohm meter) part of it, it can also help identify if you have a broken wire or a short somewhere in the wiring.

But if you have an intermittent electrical fault, that can take a lot of time to find.  I had an intermittent short in a tail light bulb in a 1970 Triumph 500 Trophy, took me two years and a lot of frustration to figure that one out.  On a 1968 Triumph Daytona 500 I finally got so frustrated with the electrical faults, that I rewired about 90 percent of the wiring harness, much less frustration after that.

[rifraf]

Hi,

So my cheapy amazon bought voltmeter arrived today and the dynohub seems to be working fine thankfully! I'll replace the magnetic ring on the edelux as suggested by Dan and hope for the best.

Cheers,

Brian

Whats the update Brian?
I'd be seriously looking at the connections of wire to spade connectors and spade connectors to spade tabs.
Every time my Edelux has failed to threaten extinction to darkness, its been a loose wire or broken connection.
My Edelux has been on a bike for a few years now with no trouble from the unit except from my dodgy wiring abilities.
I expect to be "sun-tanning" the demons of darkness for a while yet.