twin e6 setup or solidlight 1203D???

[scottyoz]

Hi all,

I am after some info and opinions on a light produced by a company in England (Solidlights) that make a light suitable for a dyno hub called a 1203D. Has any one had any experience or know of anyone who has tried this light?

I currently run 2 e6's that i am very happy with but am always on the look out for products that make my night audax's easier.

If anyone has tried this light how would they compare to a twin e6 setup?

Cheers Scott....[]

[julk]

Scott,

I have a Solidlights 1203d running off a Schmidt dyno-hub.
The light produced is excellent for low and high speed riding in the dark.

The spread of light is best described as a brighter centre and plenty of peripheral lighting to the sides as well.
I prefer to mount it on the handlebars rather than the fork crown  - it still needs pointing down a bit to avoid dazzling oncoming traffic.

I am sorry I can't compare it to twin e6s.
I do have a B&M Lumotec with a 3w bulb. The Solidlights gives more than twice the light in my opinion and much more of a spread.

I found it interfered with a wireless computer when mounted within 5 inches of it.
They are not always in stock - it may take a month or two to get one.

 hope this helps.

Julian

[freddered]

I was asking this question last year.  My answer came from the ACF Forum - http://bikereader.com/forum/index.php

Mal Volio is a very experienced long-distance Audaxer and has both setups you mention.

He prefers the Solidlights.

I have only used Solidlights but I've used them on Audax's for 5 hours at a time.  They are simply superb.  You forget you are riding at night after a while.  They don't have the same bright spot on the road as E6 apparently but they illuminate ALL the road, from side to side plus the hedgerows/pavement.  

I never rode in TRUE darkness before (I'm a city boy moved to the country) but Solidlights make riding in total darkness a real pleasure.

Also the flashing mode is superb for riding through towns with street-lights, you'll be amazed at the way reflective signposts flash back at half a mile away.

Take a look on ACF, I think you'll be persuaded to get Solidlights.

PS - you need a DYNOHUB.  A bottle dynamo isn't suitable
PPS - I don't use the Cateye light now.  No point.

[PH]

quote:Originally posted by scottyoz


If anyone has tried this light how would they compare to a twin e6 setup?

They’re about as different as two dynamo lighting systems could be.  I’ve been using E6s for about four years. I borrowed some solidlights for a weekend and an overnight Audax and couldn’t get on with them.  I didn’t like the spread of light, the bluish colour or the way it varies with speed.  At full power (18mph?) with both LEDs blazing they are impressive, I doubt there’s any other dynamo light can match them.  At walking pace and crawling up hills they also impress, much brighter than an E6.  At the speeds in between, where I spend 80% of the time, the difference between them was marginal.  They do have some clever features, the standlight is the brightest I’ve seen and a flashing option would be great in poor light.  I wonder if that amount of technology will have an effect on longevity, I note many people have already had to send them back for an “upgrade”.  
There are alternatives.  I tried an Inoled, which was pretty good except they have a design problem when used with a hub dynamo.  The manufacturers are aware of it and planning a modification.
I’ve recently bought a Supernova E3, first impressions are that it’s very similar to riding with E6s at full power, except it produces that amount of light almost as soon as the wheel turns.  It’s a whiter light than from any other LED I’ve seen, it also appears to be brighter than the other 3w LEDs I’ve seen ( I have the same diode as Solidlights use in a battery light)  I’ve yet to use it on an overnight ride, so I’ll save my final verdict till then.  The only review I’ve seen is in German here, a pity they didn’t have the Solidlights for comparison.
Another alternative I’ve tried is to combine dynamo with battery and halogen with LED.  I use a wide beam 3w LED (Niterider Mi-Newt, though there’s plenty of others) alongside a single E6.  You get the reach of the E6 and the width of the LED, perfect to see and be seen.  The 6 hours run time of the tiny Li-Ion battery easily gets me through a summer overnight and with careful use probably two nights.

Conclusion;
Err…make your own mind up, but defiantly try and see any lights before buying, or get them on sale or return.

[freddered]

It seems that lighting is a very personal thing and I agree with PH,  that you should try to beg/steal/borrow both types for a direct comparison before you spend over £100.

Solidlights do have a variable output but, in my opinion, it seems to match the speed very well.  I mean that you can see enough of the road at 3mph going uphill (where most Halogens are not doing much) and as you increase speed the output increases to suit.

The main decision though is what spread of light do you like?

If you like a very bright, focussed spot on the road at the expense of riding surrounded by total darkness then the E6 has the best focussed beam (everyone says that).

If you want a big 'wash' of light (imagine Car Headlights but on a smaller, less bright scale) then Solidlights are the best.

Also, they are very small, smaller than you'd think given the incredible output and can be swapped between bikes very easily with bayonet mount (which means you should not leave them on the bike like E6)
For size comparison:

[ManchesterRambler]

PH

How have you got on with the Supernova? Do you still think it out-performs the twin E6 set up? Have you had the chance to compare output with someone using a Solidlight 1203D?

[PH]

quote:Originally posted by ManchesterRambler

PH

How have you got on with the Supernova? Do you still think it out-performs the twin E6 set up?

Yes, the more I've used it the more I like it.  And it just got better.  The 2008 model, available now, has several improvements.  The biggest is the change of LED, they've started using the newer Cree LED which produces twice the light (Really, that's not exaggeration or marketing hype, twice the light)
The lens has been changed, the light already had as long a reach as you could need so they've used the extra light to make the beam wider.  And they've added a standlight.  
They've played with the electrics to give full power at around 4.5 mph.  
The switch has changed from a toggle to push button, don't know if there's any reason.
It's also now possible to buy direct, the head and tail lights have been separated rather than sold together and you can use Paypal (Though there is a 10 euro surcharge) Still a lot cheaper than Wiggle.  If  I've worked it out right the front light with delivery and Paypal surcharge is £130
http://www.nova-factory.com/store_en.htm
My light is back with them for an update, I get the new LED and I think lens, though not the other features.  The ability to do this shows the sort of customer support they're known for.
 

quote:Have you had the chance to compare output with someone using a Solidlight 1203D?

I'd be interested to see the new E3 and the Solidlights side by side.  The differences will have narrowed, the Solidlights twin LEDs are now matched by the E3s single and the narrow beam of the E3 that some people didn't like has become wider.  Of course at some point the Solidlights will start using the newer LEDs...where will it end

[ManchesterRambler]

Thanks PH - that's really helpful. Nice looking light, too, the Supernova. The new Cree LED sounds very interesting. As you say, presumably Solidlights could use it or the new Luxeon K2 to squeeze even more from 6v 3w.

[rogerzilla]

I see too many reports of water ingress and reliability problems with the Solidlights, although customer support seems to be excellent.  I'd have the Supernova E3, although at the moment my old-technology E6 is doing just fine.  I ride pretty fast, and a long penetrating beam is more important to me than a wide wash of light.

[gearbob]

Hello -

This is my first post here. I'll apologize straight away for this lengthy, multi-pronged response, but hope it will be helpful for others out there researching similar bicycle lighting topics.

As I stumbled upon this thread, I was actually searching for some comparisons between the 1203D and the "to be released November 2007" updated Supernova E3. I still have not found any thorough comparisons between the 1203D and the 1st generation E3. If someone has experience here, please share!

One of my bicycles is a Rohloff-equipped Surly Long Haul Trucker with a Schmidt Dynohub. I use it year round for pretty much everything from commuting to work, organized events, to week long tours. I live in the Midwestern US where I ride year round on a great variety of roads, gravel and paved tracks, and single track hiking trails. Besides the dynamo system below, I also have a Niterider 12+20 watt battery-powered system that I use for different types of rides.

For one year now on the Surly, I've been using a B&M D'Lumotec Oval (LED version of the Lumotec Oval) as my primary, along with a Schmidt E6-Z secondary. The D'Lumotec is mounted on my fork crown, and the E6-Z under my handlebar. I still have an E6 under my workbench, but there were good reasons for me to find an alternative with different characteristics for the primary light on my bike...

I specifically wanted better low speed lighting, softer beam cutoff, and better corner illumination for narrow tracks or tight corners. The E6 has such a narrow focus and sharp cut-off to the periphery that I could not see well to the sides, especially whenever things got slow and twisty.

As an all-rounder, this D'Lumotec and E6-Z combination works great for me. As a primary, the D'Lumotec provides useful light on low speed climbs, and provides a smoother and somewhat broader spill of light to the sides for navigation (when compared to E6). As speed increases, the E6-Z comes online as my "high beam," projecting it's good distance beam up the road ahead.

The D'Lumotec's LED starts to provide useful light at a walking pace and quickly reaches 100% output thereafter - something the E6 cannot match. On straight stretches of highway, this  D'Lumotec + E6-Z combo still continues to be my preference over an E6 + E6-Z due to the whiter light color rendered by combining these together, as well as the complimentary combination of their beam patterns.

B&M's D'Lumotec Oval has a well-designed beam pattern with decent projection down the middle along with a nice and smooth transition to the sides. The version I have has a good standlight. The negatives for the D'Lumotec Oval are the cheesy on/off switch, and heavier weight when compared to an E6.

For anyone inclined to mix and match lights...

There is difference in electronics between the E6-Z and E6. The E6 does not work "well" as a secondary. (I tried them both as a secondary to the D'Lumotec... The E6-Z provides useful light as a secondary around 11 mph, whereas the E6 as a secondary did not provide useful light until 16+ mph.)

I purchased the Inoled 2 watt version before much was known about them. I (like a few others) thought it could be used as a primary with another headlight as a secondary. However this was not the case - it didn't work properly. But in any case I personally did not like the wide and flat beam pattern or sharp cutoff out on the road. My dealer kindly took it back.

As for further evolution, I would love to try Solidlights’ 1203D. I've been in contact with Solidlights and was very impressed with other's comments about the lights and service. But being in the US would make any returns to the UK for service or upgrades a serious inconvenience. I haven't found anyone in the US Midwest with a 1203D to check out myself. I also sense that the 2nd generation Supernova E3 will be the top dog, both from an output and aesthetic point of view. Since the E3 is designed to conform to Germany's laws, does this mean surplus dynamo power might be available to run an E6-Z secondary??? Hmmm.

I've been a long-time fan of high-power LEDs, having made many of my own LED headlights in the past 12 years. Now they are mainstream, cheaper, and the output color and power continue to improve. The electronic controls and power regulation are now beyond my capabilities for garage engineering. I believe the LEDs are slowly going to obsolete filament (e.g. halogen) and arc (e.g. HID) options for bicycling purposes as the future unfolds. The 2nd generation NiteRider MiNewt and E3 are examples of this trend.

Not to mislead anyone, the D'Lumotec + E6-Z set-up is completely inadequate for MTB-type singletrack trails, especially in really curvy stuff. Bring a helmet mounted light for these conditions. I’m still looking for the ideal dynamo-powered system that can tackle these conditions.

For what it's worth, I have been running a Princeton Tec EOS camping-style headlight on my helmet to supplement the bike-mouned lighting on my bikes. I removed the EOS' stock elastic band and attach it through vents to my helmet using a short length of 3/4" nylon webbing with a Nexus ladder lock buckle sewn onto one end of the strap. Quick on and off, and solid on my Giro Atmos.

The EOS is unfortunately not dynamo-powered, but it is inexpensive, tiny, sturdy, and surprisingly powerful. It gets good runtime from the 3 AAA batteries, and has a 1 watt LED with an excellent beam pattern for cycling (unlike other camping headlights I've tried such as Petzl's Tikka XP). There are for modes of operation: High, Med, Low, Strobe.

Princeton Tec EOS' regulation is superior to other brands I've tried, extracting maximum power from the little batteries and tolerating anything from Energizer Photo Lithium AAA's to NiMH rechargeables without issue. My example is over three years old and has held up to regular use and frequent battery swaps very well.

I recommend an EOS for the tremendous versatility it adds (think... Need more light to read road signs? Need to fix a flat? Find a spot to rest?). If you already have a dynamo system, this is way more useful than supplemental handlebar-mounted battery lights that I see others using (Cateye, etc.).


Relavent links:
<http://www.bumm.de/index-e.html>
<http://www.nabendynamo.de/> (for Schmidt's company page)
<http://www.solidlights.co.uk/>
<http://supernova-lights.com/index_de.html>
<http://www.princetontec.com/>

NOTE: For anyone interested in the Inoled, read about them on Peter White's web site: <http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/lightingsystems.htm>)


Thanks to everyone here for sharing their info. I hope this was helpful!

[Fred A-M]

I've finally just given my new Supernova E3 the acid test: I can happily report that it passed with flying colours.   

The power from one single light is awesome, clearly lighting pitch-black countryside lanes for about 30 yards ahead from virtually walking pace.   The beam is wide and strong enough to travel at full pelt, once I'd become accustomed to whole experience. 

Thanks PH for the illluminating info on this: it sounded just too good so I ignored the advice to beg, borrow or steal to try it out and compare it with other lights on the market and bought blind. 

I've never had decent lights before but based on what I've read, it seems that the revolution in LED lighting is here, and for me at least, it's going to be a very liberating experience: no more anxiety about getting back before nightfall!