Panniers for Raven Sport Tour - Carradice or Ortleib

[j22jbl]

Hi
I am looking for feedback before I buy a new set of panniers. Looking for front, rear and with a bar bag. Not too concerned if the bar bag is same make as the front & rear.
It has been suggested that the Carradice Super C may be too big for the rear - I have not seen a pair in the flesh so I can't comment. What is your experience?
Carradice appeal to me because of their traditional outlook. I spotted some Ortleib complete with pockets on the side, but these were retailing for £150, is that good value?
I want something that will last, be reasonably water proof (I always pack in plastic bags anyway), have good supply of spare parts and not stand as as being brash! for the bar bag, something to take a pocket camera, pasport, tickets etc. It doesn't need to be vast, and should ideally serve as a bum bag when off the bike.
Thanks in advance for your feedback, I am a little overwhelmed by the choice!
John

[Joatamon]

You do have to be a bit careful with loading up the RST because of the short chain stays.  I've ridden mine with rear panniers only and it can be very light headed.  With four panniers it is more at ease.  I've toured with over 20kg distributed load and mostly it's fine though occasionally I do experience what I presume is frame flex, maybe riding through  a small pothole or something like that.  I don’t let it run away on downhills either.

I have the set of Ortlieb Front Roller and Back Roller Plus panniers on Tubus racks.  The rears are modestly sized compared to some (Carradice?) so that limits the load anyway.  I really like them,  I like the way that you can roll the closure down so the pannier is always bulked out even when it's only partly filled.  It only takes seconds to close them up once you've got the hang of it.

My Ortliebs don't have external pockets as standard, but they can be added.  They fit at the rear, though, so not ideal from a balance point of view.  I do like the look of the new model  Vaude Aqua Back Plusses which have a side pocket.

Bar bags - I have the Carradice Carradry which is plenty big enough for my small slr and a lens, plus other valuables.  Fully waterproof.  Well made and so far it's kept its shape.  The map pocket is far too small, near useless.  Off the bike I have to sling it across my shoulder, it's too big as a bum bag.

[Bowland Rider]

Hi, Im just in the process of buying panniers myself and i've opted for the Vaude aqua roller panniers instead of the Ortliebs, because:
1.  They have a roll closure which clips into the sides of the pannier.  I believe that the Ortlieb roller panniers have clips which clip into the shoulder straps which then hook around a hook thingy at the bottom of the pannier.  Basically the Vaude's are easier to open and close up. 
2. The Vaudes hold slightly more, 48 litres the pair i think.  Handy for bulky items.
3.  The fixings for the Orlieb go directly into the back of the panner whereas the Vaudes have a rigid plastic back which, i think, will be more robust than the Ortliebs.

I researched this subject to death before opting for the Vaudes.  The cheapest i've found them online is £90/pair. 

[Joatamon]

Yeah, I've seen those pictures of Ortlieb panniers with the strap looped through that hook at the base of the pannier.  I've never done mine up like that.  I don't bother with the shoulder strap at all, I roll them up tightly (Ortlieb say 3 folds minimum I think for water-tightness) then I clip the two loose ends into each other, over the top of the bag.  Always done it like that, I thought it was the correct way and they've always been waterproof.  Whether it's the right way or not it only takes a moment to do, in fact, because there's only one central clip to deal with it's probably quicker than the Vaude way which I presume has a clip at each side.

[j22jbl]

Thank you for the feedback. I will take a closer look at the Ortleib.

[Fred A-M]

Just in case you're wondering what a set of Ortlieb (Roller Plus) panniers look like on an RST, see below link.

http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=2197.0

Pros:

Lightweight
Watertight
Stylish (IMO)
Hardwearing (reputedly)

Cons:

Lack of built in pockets
Latex interior against which things like plastic bags (to keep things organised) tend to not slide out easily.

[j22jbl]

Thank you very much for direction to the RST pics - it is much easier to get a feel from seeing something in a picture. I may go for a set of these. Out of interest, is the bar bag an Ortleib too?

At the moment I am dragging my six year old around on a trailer bike (attached to the seat post), covered 350 miles in Holland over 10 days this way in early August. That was a series of day trips, with a small pair of Carradice on the rear. I suspect that if filled to the brim, any pannier including the Ortlieb will impede the arm of the trailer when turning, so I will have to watch out for that one......or give the fuller bags to my wife to lug around!

Hoping next year to use a Bob Yak off the rear end of my wife's bike for a camping tour of France (Loire), and looking forward to my youngest son getting a little bigger so he can use his own bike, in a year or two! Must admit have found the RST a great bike, nice and quick of the mark, but now wondering if a Raven may have been more suitable for a heavier load. You didn't seem to suffer with your gear in France, and presumably have no concern over the weight issue. Looking for a pair of Hillebergs or a couple of Robert Saunders tents to accommodate a family of four.....but that is another forum topic!

Thanks again
J

John

[Fred A-M]

Hi John

I've this last week got back from France, having spent a few days on the Loire myself, but sadly not cycling!

The bar bag is an old Altura number - the tent pictured in the bottom picture is a Hilleberg Nallo and can't recommend it enough. 

I think I was carry around 17/18 kilos but someone on the forum contact SJS who advised that the recommend load max of 17Kg was more to do with handling than physical capacity.

I personally found that the RST handled like a dream with front & rear panniers and would have no qualms putting an extra 5 to 8kg luggage on, which is probably as much as you'd need in the circumstances - I hasten to add that RST also seems to have coped admirably with my own personal weight gain since I got the RST 4 years back of around 10Kg! 

Cheers

Fred

[Joatamon]

Not to compete or hijack the thread but to show a slightly different take on the same theme of 4-up:

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-3/672416/Raven%20Sport%20Tour%20loaded%20small.jpg

I have Tubus racks, the rear one has a lower rail and the panniers sit quite low.

Notice my "unofficial (?)" method of securing the Ortlieb panniers and leaving the straps at home.

On a camping issue, I don't now take 3 water bottles - I just buy 1.5 litre PETS and stuff those in the cages.

[wal]

Apologies as I am posting this twice in different threads in an effort to elicit a response, but I have noticed that several people seem to run with Tubus Duo and Ortlieb Front Roller - which I have just purchased.

My problem is that I cannot seem to get the Duo level on my RST. No matter how I try the top bar is always lower at the nose. I wonder whether this matters and if so how I resolve it. Has anyone else had the same problem?

Any thoughts from those with more experience than I have of running this rack setup.

Regards

PW

[julk]

wal,
I have the same 'problem', I have got round it by ignoring it and the rack seems to work ok with a load on it.

I have used Blackburn, Thorn and Tubus Tara, Ergo & Duo low riders and the Duo is the first rack to have this 'feature'.

I suspect the jig Tubus make the Duo on is wrong as I would expect the middle hole of the 3 available at the top fixing to give a level rack top tube.
Julian.

[wal]

Thanks for your reply. I have decided to run with this as a positive and adjust the panniers a little. Hopefully the pannier clips will not disintegrate being exposed to more shear force. It appears from others that this will not be so.

Many thanks

PW