Author Topic: adjustable stem  (Read 12346 times)

tyreon

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adjustable stem
« on: July 27, 2014, 07:36:35 pm »
By chance visited this site to see an adjustable stem made by Thorn. Howsoever,I thought the posting was 2005. The workshop had posted the picture. Is this stem still available? My wife has a British Eagle with a quill stem. Am thinking about quill to aheadset stem with the adjustable stem as made by Thorn. Trouble is in gauging the rise and angle. My wife would like the height of her current stem raised a tad,and the reach just brought in a tad. How do you gauge all this without lottsa buying and returning stems and the like,and annoying retailers(Thorn?)

Hope I have made sense.

Guess I could forward photo to Thorn workshop and as their expertise. Any other things I could do to make this task simple? Well,as simple as it can be!!

Donerol

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2014, 11:09:11 pm »
Try one of the stem calculator sites such as this one or this one, or a simple chart like this.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2014, 11:11:10 pm by Donerol »

tyreon

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2014, 08:08:05 am »
Thank you. Just what the doctor ordered. Never knew such a site existed. Let's hope me bemuddled brain gets the calculations right.Next,guess I gotta trawl through cycle retailers and stem sellers to find the thing. Fingers crossed

Donerol

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2014, 10:54:24 am »
The 2005 post from the Thorn workshop gives you the details and they are still made - they are used for tandem stoker stems and come in two parts:

the stem extension (other sizes and angles available)
 


and the 'stem' or the bit that holds the handlebar



Pricey! Otherwise you could look at the Ritchey adjustable stems which are very good and do not slip in use.  If you are looking for only small adjustments, get one the same length as the current one.


Andre Jute

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2014, 05:50:46 pm »
You can get plenty of high quality height- and reach-adjustable quill stems.

My favourite adjustable stem is Gazelle's Switch stem, which I used on a utility bike to get my back aerodynamically flat to set my personal ton-up record. It has three great advantages. It is toollessly adjustable; you just flip a lever and you can adjust height, reach and angle of handlebars. It doesn't break your  fingernails because it is competently designed by proper industrial designers. For the same reason, it is beautiful. I have one but it is not for sale. The designers (Gazelle farmed the job out) are at http://www.vanderveerdesigners.nl/en/our-work/projects/625 and this retail store http://en.hollandbikeshop.com/branded-bicycle-parts/gazelle-bicycle-parts/gazelle-bicycle-handlebar/gazelle-stem/gazelle-adjustable-stem-switch-3-22-2mm-230mm/ has them in stock. A Dutch retailer I've found amenable to finding me rare components and posting them to foreign parts is http://stores.ebay.nl/BIKERS-STORE; they've had the Switch adjustable quill stem in stock in the past and therefore know where to find you one. Your wife might like this one best of all, especially as she can make adjustments herself until she is satisfied, or make different adjustments for different purposes -- I do when I use that bike, for instance lowering the bars when I'm speeding into a winter headwind. Photo of a Switch stem on my Gazelle Toulouse at http://coolmainpress.com/BICYCLINGgazelletoulouse.html Notice that in my photographed applicaiton the stem is set near vertical to bring the bars high-high-high above the saddle and right close in; this was a bike I bought specially for sitting on bolt upright until the physios could undo the damage a previous, badly fitted, bike did to my back. On this same bike, by flipping a lever, when I want to crouch down low, the bars were moved to below the headset and in the same motion the bars were turned to set the grips near vertical, way out over the lamp. It's an incredibly versatile stem. Only availble in a quill fitment, last time I looked.

Kalloy makes a good if somewhat industrial adjustable stem; there are spanner versions and a version for which you don't need tools. The Kalloy branded one is cheap; others, like Richey, are several times the Kalloy price and are no better, in fact precisely the same thing, only label-engineered. Kalloy makes version for Ahead steer tubes and quill stems. I don't have one -- Duh, I have a manual version on one of my bikes, see the last photo at http://coolmainpress.com/BICYCLINGsmover.html for the Kalloy at full extension. Mine seems to be an extra-well finished version, possibly a special order by Trek, on whose top Benelux-only bike it is fitted. I admire Kalloy gear (for the same reason I admire Shimano gear: cheap and good), and have several other Kalloy components on expensive bikes because they work so well.

A solid adjustable Ahead stem for utility, transport, heavy duty, heavy touring, and violent sporting bikes is a Cane Creek copy made in the Cane Creek factory for the German distributor Humpert inder the names Swell, X-Act and X-Stacy. (They also sell Cane Creek's legendary S6 headset, made for them by Cane Creek, for a fractiong of the price of the same thing with a Cane Creek brand on it...)  I have a Humpert adjustable stem; it came on a Utopia bike, than which none better. (Utopia test all components to destruction, but they don't go much on flash. They're a bit like the German version of Thorn, but without the cost constraints; some say Rolls-Royce is the better comparison.) The Humpert version has the advantage of being a bit cheaper than the anyway unobtanium Cane Creek version; it's not actually cheap, but on close examination and in use I thought it very good value. Here's a whole list of versions you can drool over: http://www.humpert.com/en/bikeparts/suche/produktsuche/artikelnummer/?begriff=swell  As fitted on my Utopia Kranich at http://coolmainpress.com/AndreJute'sUtopiaKranich.pdf

However, if your wife's bike is a utility bike or a shopping bike or gets parked often, all these perfectly good stems would be a silly purchase. The only stem that you should consider is the adjustable n-lock. This would give your wife adjustable height and reach -- and for the same price a convenient, most superior, bike lock that doesn't require her to bend over inelegantly. The bike lock works like an American car's breakaway steering and makes the bike unrideable, and makes it appear to be broken. Mine in the photo below is not the adjustable version but the adjustable version is owned by several other forum members.

The main thread on the n'lock on this board is http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=3930.0 and you can use the search engine other threads on it and bits where it crept into other discussions.  If you decide on it, return to us for instructions on which n'lock to buy for your wife's bike as the difference between the models is pretty esoteric.

Hope this helps.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2014, 11:39:08 pm by Andre Jute »

tyreon

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2014, 09:42:22 pm »
I don't know who you are Andrew Jute,but yer one hell of one knowledgeable bloke. Aint read your reply in full yet,but plan so to do. Thank you x10. This info can be like gold dust. I just had one hellaofatime searching for clarijs panniers,again from Holland. Ordered them for my own shopping bike. The stems and options you've given me open up some interesting shopping. Thank you again. And for those that replied to my queries: thanks too.
Very interesting

Donerol

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2014, 10:28:12 pm »
Kalloy makes a good if somewhat industrial adjustable stem; there are spanner versions and a version for which you don't need tools. The Kalloy branded one is cheap; others, like Richey, are several times the Kalloy price and are no better, in fact precisely the same thing, only label-engineered.

That is not quite true - the Ritchey for instance has a better design which will withstand strong heaving on the handlebars. Of course a more sedate riding style would probably be all right with the Kalloy.

http://velocelt.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/adjustable-stems-good-bad-and-ugly.html

tyreon

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2014, 08:45:54 am »
I would like to 'mix it' with all you 'senior folk' on here(by that I mean you bicycle experts). Am afraid I would be embarrassed. Well, embarrass myself,really. I have difficulty operating this thing(the computer),and following some of your 'technical talk' can be difficult when in a 1-1 I feel sure my understanding would be quicker.
Back to my stem adjuster. Some solutions proferred maybe technically practical and achievable,but in implementation can be xxxxxxxxx frustrating.
Let's see if I can explain. Let's go with getting a quill adjustable stem. Simples? Not so. Well,not for me. You see when I ordered one over this thing(the computer),I ordered one to arrive with an exceptionally long shaft(which then could not lower itself into the frame). This was then compounded by the reach of the adjustable stem to be well too long all but putting my wife on 'ape bars'(I exaggerate too much). So,truble!
Well,that's your fault you might say. Yes,but the retailer can't/won't/doesn't give the measurements of the adjustable stem on his/her advertisement...that,or his/her description doesn't make sense(well,not to me). So,the problem remains.

Let's go with the quill to aheadset changer stem. Okay,let's buy that. But when I put it in my wife's frame I find the 'Do not raise above here' line not giving me the height I want,there's just not enough quill stem left in the bike for said safety. It won't give me the extra height my wife(may)need. Then you have the adjustable aheadset. The adjustable necks too long/won't raise itself and 'pull back' to the desired shorter reach. And are retailers advertising the length of the adjustable stem?
Just one other thing. I want the 4 bolt or 2 bolt handlebar extractors. I can't attempt to go through with any threading of handlebars through said stem: it'll kill me. Have mercy: my back's already aching from what bending and twisting I've done.

Just finding out this whole 5 minute job is hours of torture...and complexity.

I want sypmpathy. Some guys out there must know the 5 minute job turns into a hair pulling 8 hr job...don't they? Of course,sometimes disappearing into the garage I expect hours of torture to come back with the job finished in 2 minutes.

Is it just me?

Maybe I'll try and post a photo. Hold on! I've now gotta learn to do that on this xxxxxx computer. Grrrrr...

tyreon

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2014, 12:01:39 pm »
Nope. 40 minutes trying to put a pic on here. No go.

The wife's bike's 25+ years old. A British Eagle 531 job. Guess the top tube's just that little too long.

Guess I could buy that forward moving saddle gizmo job from SJS,or turn back the 'high riser' h/bars she has so that they're a little nearer.

Am now becoming obsessed with this stem-job-thing.

lewis noble

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2014, 02:31:26 pm »
Hello tyreon

I reckon there are 2 themes in your post, firstly the stem problem and how to sort it, and secondly frustration at being unable to do things with bikes (or on the Forum) that others (seem to) find so easy.

Stem problem first - I guess there is a limit to how high you can raise stems or change the position dictated, to a greater or lesser extent, by the frame.  I was given a Condor road bike recently, it had been in a neighbours cellar for years . . . . Surprisingly good basic condition, but the drops (which I have not ridden for >45 years) were too low.  So, I put in a quill to headset adapter, a Genetic I think it was from SJSC, and tried a selection of stems I have at home.  It is nearer the way I like it than it was, and maybe I will get used to it, but still feels too low.  I will see how I get on on my forthcoming hols in France before I decide what to do.  But short of putting an extension on the adapter, which I reckon would introduce areas of weakness, it cannot be got any higher.  And some people say that having a steeply rising / very short stem upsets the handling of the bike.  From my experience, I think they are right.

So, you may have done as much as you can.

And the second point, you are not alone!!  My local bike shop has done well over the years from my bungled attempts to fix mine and friends' bikes.  But don't give up.  People on this forum, Andre, Dan and several others, appreciate how tricky things can seem and give better advice than on any other forum in my view.  And I stil haven't posted a photo yet . . . .

Good luck

Lewis
 

Donerol

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2014, 02:59:55 pm »
Don't move the saddle forward as a solution as it may affect her pedalling action for the worse.

Assuming I have understood correctly what you want to do, I would try getting a quill-to-ahead converter like one of these:

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/genetic-quill-stem-adaptor-1-inch-quill-to-1-1-8-inch-threadless-adaptor-prod22444/?src=froogle
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/protec-ahead-converter-prod3063/
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/profile-design-stem-convertor-1-inch-quill-to-1-1-8-inch-threadless-prod20442/

These are different heights, not always very clear but a call to the shop should help.


Then fit it with an adjustable ahead like t one of these:
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/ritchey-ritchey-comp-adjustable-1-1-8-road-ahead-stem-258mm-clamp-black-prod15685/
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kalloy-Adjustable-70-130d-Threadless-Black/dp/B001CJV70U (currently unavailable)
The stems come in different lengths. I presume the handlebars are about 25mm diameter rather than the modern oversize - make sure you choose the correct bar clamp size.

In the review I posted above the Zoom stems were NOT recommended.

Don't despair - you'll get there in the end!


tyreon

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2014, 03:25:58 pm »
Donerol...and significant helpers: Am getting the idea. Your message makes sense: quill to aheadset adapters offering various heights. So far,thus understood.

Now we go onto adjustable stem. Can see the angle and length of the stem affecting reach. (But what's with the one offering the very high angle? Wouldn't that be coming back on itself? Well,almost!)

Now for the fitting of the handlebars. I cannot believe my wife's handlebars would be oversize. So no problems??

I guess I could phone the shop for advice. Send them a pic and an explanation of what I want. Order x3 quill adaptors for seeing which is right,return the two which would be 'in excess'. Have I arrived?

Donerol

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2014, 04:08:50 pm »
(But what's with the one offering the very high angle? Wouldn't that be coming back on itself? Well,almost!)

It gives 45 degrees on either side of horizontal, which adds up to 90 degrees but not 90 upwards, which would indeed be almost coming back on itself.


The easiest way for you to post a photo is like this (from Danneaux):

...when making a post just click on the blue "Additional Options..." link at the lower-left corner of the page. Once there, click on the "Browse" button and navigate to where your photo is stored on your computer.

The photo will appear below your post as a thumbnail. Forum members can click on it to enlarge the view.....
Maximum of 5 attachments per post, totaling 512KB in part or whole.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2014, 04:12:37 pm by Donerol »

Andre Jute

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2014, 04:31:24 pm »
One more possibility. Though it looks a bit naff to the rest of cycledom, there's no law saying your stem must point forward from the steering tube. It can also point backwards, like a tiller.

Donerol

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Re: adjustable stem
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2014, 04:34:23 pm »
It can make the handling a bit odd though unless the bike is designed for it. I wish we had a photo of the current set-up.