looking for link to best light

[jags]

hobbes and dan i promise i'll never ask again 
but stick up a link to your favourate  front headlight  bush +muller.
every time i look at these lights i get totally confused with all the numbers

cheers lads

anto.

[Danneaux]

Hi jags!

In truth, dynamo lighting is in a state of flux at the moment, with a number of new, great-sounding lights just arriving on the market. The best advice I can give is to wait a couple months and then read the reviews as these things hit the market and get actual use.

That's what I plan to do.

Meantime, I will continue to use my B&M Lumotec IQ Cyo R Senso Plus Black (with less bright/better dispersion 40 lux, taller beam). It is the one that retails for USD $107.00 on Peter White's site, here: http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b&m-hl.asp  I like the *amount* of light very much, but have also been extremely disappointed by the bright-white hotspot in the middle of the beam that mars the otherwise nice spread. When I ordered it, I *thought* I was getting the older-style reflector, but instead got the later job that results in a less ideal beam and that horrible hotspot that draws one's eyes to center on it, making the rest just so much beam-spill. Andre knows the difference, and so do I -- I rode at night through the NL's Green Heart and Hoge Veluwe next to a friend who had the old-style reflector/LED on his IQ Fly and still remember the velvety, even spread of light that was wonderful to behold. I desperately wish mine was like that; the older IQ Cyos were, till B&M changed them.

Of the three IQ Cyos SJS Cycles offer, I believe the one like I have is here: http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/busch-and-muller-lumotec-iq-cyo-r-plus-40-lux-headlight-with-bracket-prod22818/

Jags, so you'll know better what to look for, here is how the name breaks down: B&M Lumotec IQ Cyo R Senso Plus Black means...

B&M = Busch & Müller or BUMM, maker
Lumotec = range
IQ = rear-aimed LED bounces light forward off a carefully shaped reflector
Cyo = series
R = reflectorized lens with nearfield illuminaton that starts the beam at about 1m from your front wheel. Less bright at 40lux but a closer, more even spread than the other (non "R") offering in the Cyo series.
Senso = Third position on the switch besides ON and OFF, this uses an electric eye to turn the light on/off automatically, as when entering/leaving a tunnel...or leave it on SENSO all the time and the light will turn on/off whenever it gets dark/light. Andre politely differs on the value of this feature, preferring instead to leave his on all the time for visibility. I prefer to turn mine off on long, car-free rural stretches in the desert so I can get maximum juice to charge the batteries, yet not forget the light when I need it. Just a difference in preference.
Plus = equipped with a standlight. This is a capacitor that stores electricity so the light will remain lit for up to 4 minutes or so when you are stopped, allowing you to remain visible at traffic lights or when trying to find the right key to your shed-door padlock.
Black = color. Also available in a silver/chromed case at a small upcharge if one prefers.

The "N" ("No") model you sometimes see has just the plain ON/OFF switch and no Senso (standlight) function and is a little less expensive as a result.

The model without the "R" in the name is the more powerful 60lux version that leaves a black hole in front of your wheel. It is therefore better suited for high-speed riding rather than slow or on bike paths/lanes, where you'd want to be able to see and avoid glass and debris at lower speeds.

Peter White also describes the new B&M Luxos at the same link above. It is available in two flavors, one having USB charging and a high price equivalent to a Cyo and a Tout Terrain The Plug2 combined. For no particular reason, I am deeply suspicious of the long-term life of the rechargeable battery it uses to provide charging and "panorama mode" lighting. Given what it costs, I surely hope it will be replaceable when/if it develops a "memory effect". All may indeed be well, but I wish BM had stayed with capacitors for the purpose, but understand why they could not, given the design. I will be a gentleman and let others go ahead of me in line so I can learn from their experiences before plunking down so much money when I already have something that wrorks. If it proves to be a corker in long-term use, then I can develop a case of "gottahavits".

My suggestion for you? Grab a Shimano dynohub wheel now(ish) while it is available at a good price. Get the color you want (black or silver) or it will bug you all the while you own it. Then, wait a bit till the lights sort themselves out. I realize this means you might not have a working dyno-powered light setup for awhile, but it will assure you get a great combo for the least money overall. Andre has generously offered you an older-model, non-LED light that would at least let you use the setup and would get you by for awhile til the perfect LED light shows up at a good price. If you went for the newer AXA Nano/Nano Plus model Rualexander has referenced, you would have a light and charging system all in one, catching many of the features of the new B&M Luxos for a fraction of the price. It looks nice, and the design is very clean as well. It makes a lot of sense. I haven't used or seen one myself, but it has all the needed ingredients and I trust Rualexander's firsthand experience with his AXA Nano Plus in actual use. To read more about it in his posts, go to:
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4121.msg24549#msg24549
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4121.msg24605#msg24605
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4121.msg27687#msg27687
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=5129.msg27025#msg27025
I plan to read up on it a bit more myself.

I hope this helps.

All the best,

Dan.

[jags]

Dan your a gent thanks a million for that really appreciate it,
ca n you believe that wheel i'm after is still not in stock
if it's not in by next week i will go looking at Andre's xxcycles maybe i should have gone ther in the beginning.
but yeah i will hold on for the light until later in the year i'm in no hurry.
thanks again Dan.

jags.

[il padrone]

When I ordered it, I *thought* I was getting the older-style reflector, but instead got the later job that results in a less ideal beam and that horrible hotspot that draws one's eyes to center on it, making the rest just so much beam-spill. Andre knows the difference, and so do I -- I rode at night through the NL's Green Heart and Hoge Veluwe next to a friend who had the old-style reflector/LED on his IQ Fly and still remember the velvety, even spread of light that was wonderful to behold. I desperately wish mine was like that; the older IQ Cyos were, till B&M changed them.

Of the three IQ Cyos SJS Cycles offer, I believe the one like I have is here: http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/busch-and-muller-lumotec-iq-cyo-r-plus-40-lux-headlight-with-bracket-prod22818/

The one to get is the 60 lux version
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/busch-and-muller-lumotec-cyo+-60-led-headlight-with-bracket-prod18717/

I have this on three of our bikes and it has always been an excellent light - no problems with any 'hot-spot'. It has a great road beam with a good horizon - just brighter than the German lighting standard - fine anywhere else.



Useful beam comparison between the 40 lux and the 60 lux senso plus is made here:
http://www.longleafbicycles.com/products/dynohubs-and-lighting/dynamo-headlights/busch-muller-iq-cyo-senso-plus-chrome/

One point that I agree with about the lack of close illumination

Some people don’t like this dark zone.  I personally never found it to be a problem because anything in that dark zone will have passed through the illuminated beam because it gets close too my bicycle (I am excepting suicidal nocturnal squirrels who might dart in front of me at the last minute, but I don’t plan my component choices around such rarities and figure if something can dart into a dark patch four meters in front of my bicycle I’m not going to be able to avoid it whether it is illuminated or not.)

[Andre Jute]

Anto, before I saw this thread, in which you've basically been told everything I say, I sent this to another thread:

just found my headlight on there Andre good price i tried to stool my daughter to buy it for my  for my christmas pressie ,
she said it was 45 euro to much  ah well guess i gotta wait.

http://www.xxcycle.com/php/boutique/page.php?nom=PANIER&key=27566&action=ajouter

Jags, that Fly is a reasonable lamp -- for what it is. I gave it a good review as an E-lamp, suitable for electric bikes, because everything else was more expensive. But, by itself, it has a serious fault that will bother you every time you ride it. Dan understood my remark about the hot spot being "deeply unfortunate" correctly. as condemning the lamp for any but electrified cyclists.

My advice would be to look out for a new old stock (NOS) or secondhand first series CYO nearfield lamp (this is the one with the reflector and R in the number, 40 lux) which is a fundamentally more agreeable lamp, and eminently suitable for all kinds of riding in Ireland. I have one, not in use right now, but I'm hanging on to it in case I get to deelectrify. (My cardiac team has just put me on six month review and my GP is smiling all over her face at how well I've recovered.) You don't want the lamp with the daylight running lights under the main lamp -- that's just the Fly I have repackaged, complete with irritating hotspot. You don't need the "senso" because sensible people leave the light running day and night, but you do need the "plus" to keep the light shining at stop streets. However, most of the lamps offered on ebay at a decent price have both facilities, so you just take them.

Here's one that looks to be the right model for €49 delivered (could be a display model judging by the packacing): http://www.ebay.de/itm/Lumotec-Cyo-senso-plus-40-Lux-Fahrradleuchte-LED-B-M-Fahrradlampe-NEU-/230885726855?pt=Sport_Radsport_Fahrradteile&hash=item35c1dc9a87#ht_1299wt_1258

Andre Jute

[jags]

Thanks lads yeah very confusing as to what the perfect light is
but unless the family pool there money together( i'm working on this strategy )i will have to wait until the new year to get the one i want.
i reckon on night rides i will also be taking my new cateye lamp so should have plenty of good ligh to see and be seen. if you ever come across the older version Andre give me a shout please.
anyway thanks guys for the info much appreciated.

Anto.

[Andre Jute]

The one to get is the 60 lux version
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/busch-and-muller-lumotec-cyo+-60-led-headlight-with-bracket-prod18717/

I have this on three of or bikes and it has always been a great beam - no problems with any 'hot-spot'. It has a great road beam with a good horizon - just brighter than the German lighting standard - fine anywhere else.

Depends where you ride and how fast you ride. Here in Ireland, where Jags and I ride, even the little sidespill, and the light in front of the wheel, are very valuable because the roads and lanes are in bad condition, with severely broken verges, and instant dropoffs into deep, icy ditches overgrown with thorny gorse. You really want to see them, and the 60 lux lamp's light starts too far in front of the wheel, and has too little sidespill, to serve here.

I should perhaps say I have both lamps, the nearfield or R 40 lux, and the sports 60 lux, and on the bike with the 60 lux lamp I go only on main roads in the middle of the night when I know there won't be enough cars to force me into an unseen rail... When I want to speed in the lanes, I use the less powerful Cyo R and thank God I had the sense to buy it despite the urgings of the "sporting set". I can't even see there is a difference in throw at the extremity between the two lamps. So, just to be clear (he-heh!), I prefer the  40 lux by a huge, huge margin.

All of this refers to the first series Cyo. The Cyo with a T in the number for daylight running lights, and the second series Cyo are simply rubbish in all their models, including the Fly. I have their optics in a current series IQ Fly specialized for e-bikes, same as the optics in Dan's second series Cyo, and I explain in a post above why it's a constant pain. By the time I start riding at night again I'll have time to rig up my first series Cyo R with the battery, but meanwhile I feel for Dan. You don't want to pay that kind of money for a lamp that irritates every second it shines.

Andre Jute

PS Jags, I wouldn't make any promises about not asking again. Right now lamps are probably the most vexing and expensive business about bikes, and there are bound to be further complications before it sorts itself. This is the place to ask; we'll all need to lean on each other's experience if we're not all to make expensive mistakes.

[Aushiker]

but stick up a link to your favourate  front headlight  bush +muller.

I am pretty happy with my Busch & Muller Lumotec IQ Cyo Senso Plus front light, model number 175QCSNDi which I have installed my Surly Long Haul Trucker (whoops .



Andrew

[il padrone]

I like the *amount* of light very much, but have also been extremely disappointed by the bright-white hotspot in the middle of the beam that mars the otherwise nice spread. When I ordered it, I *thought* I was getting the older-style reflector, but instead got the later job that results in a less ideal beam and that horrible hotspot that draws one's eyes to center on it, making the rest just so much beam-spill.

I guess my Cyo is the earlier model as I bought a couple about 5-7 years ago and the one on our tandem (less often in use) about 3 years ago. However this hot spot problem may simply be a case of adjusting your aim  

See the beam shots for the Cyo on this updated version of Peter White's lighting photos. If the light is tilted a bit lower down the beam does develop a bright centre that is washed  out.

Equally interesting to see the image from a light mounted at front axle height - the beam is dramatically altered. Having the mount too high eg. above handlebar height will lead to a light that poorly illuminates bumps and potholes. The generally most desirable mount height is around your fork crown height.

[Danneaux]

However this hot spot problem may simply be a case of adjusting your aim

Hi Pete! Excellent suggestion, but sadly...not to be in my case. It is the reflector. 

The generally most desirable mount height is around your fork crown height.

Agreed! That's why I went with an IQ Fly canti mount to lower the light from where it would have sat with the stock Cyo mount. The Nomad crown hole is higher than "normal" (and higher than my Sherpa crown mount was), so the lower mount puts the light in the proper place.

Great ideas, though, and -- yes! -- aim can make a world of difference. One of the great joys of a hub- or lowrider-mounted headlight is it skims across the tops of potholes and such and brings them out in stark relief. The downside? Less noticeable to oncoming cars, and too much of a good thing, as much detail gets lost in the "skimming". Still a very good idea for some applications, though.

All the best,

Dan. (Who's feeling a little "light-headed" reading this thread... )

[il padrone]

I must admit, looking at those beam photos from Peter White again, the best beam for me would have to be the Supernova E3 Pro glare-free lens. It  has the brightness on the road, lights up closer than the Cyo and is wider to boot. I have the symmetrical E3 Pro on my Nomad and an original E3 on the road bike. I was always put off by the glare-free lens as being dimmer (305 lumens vs. 370 lumens), but the road beam is brighter if anything.

[Danneaux]

...looking at those beam photos from Peter White again...<nods> Yes, Pete, those beamshots are *really* helpful and I've gone back again and again for another look. I just have to remind myself of three things:

1) The beams are brighter than they look in real life (due to camera exposure).
2) The beams are shown on a gravel road, rather than on asphalt, so they look brighter (due to environmental factors).
3) Wet pavement just "eats" light, due to scatter.

Best,

Dan. (...going back for another look myself!)

[il padrone]

Peter White also describes the new B&M Luxos....

....I will be a gentleman and let others go ahead of me in line so I can learn from their experiences before plunking down so much money when I already have something that wrorks. If it proves to be a corker in long-term use, then I can develop a case of "gottahavits"

Ah, thanks Dan.  Your comments just reminded me of a number of experiences I have had in the past with disappointing results, when I was ahead of the pack in purchasing new gear. The discontinued Shimano ax cranks and pedals come to mind (still have these in the workshop  ) and the failure of the rather cool SunTour Tech rear derailleur  





I think I'll hang off on purchasing the Luxos for a while.

[StuntPilot]

I would second the B&M Lumotec IQ Cyo R Senso Plus as mentioned by Dan. I think the reflector equipped model is better for touring bikes based on their speed in use. I found the same light on a German web site and after becoming aware that there was a difference between the 2011 and 2012 model (the distracting spot in the middle of the field of light in the 2012 model) I was happy to see the light listed as a 2011 model.

A few days later when I went to order from the same site it had changed to the 2012 model!   I went ahead and ordered it anyway. The spot of light is a little distracting but I am happy with the light. It provides a good beam as Peter White's excellent photos show. What I don't like is the provided bracket -  I would recommend getting another bracket, especially the Thorn one ... the Rolls Royce of front light brackets!

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/thorn-alloy-dynamo-headlamp-bracket-m5-fork-crown-mounting-black-prod12373/

I have just today checked the web site where I obtained the B&M Lumotec IQ Cyo R Senso Plus, and the model is now listed as a 2013 model!

Just wondering if the 2013 model is the same as the 2011 without the central spot of light?    Has anyone bought the 2013 model and can confirm the 'spot' has gone?

It would be good to see updated photos for this front lamp on Peter White's site comparing the 2011/2012/2013 models of the B&M Lumotec IQ Cyo R Senso Plus!

As for hub dynamos that is the way to go. Though the high cost of a wheel build and SON dynamo with Andra Rigid CSS rims (my goal) has made me hold off from that for the moment. I considered a Shimano dynamo hub wheel but as the goal is the SON build from SJS Cycles, I took the interim step of getting the excellent Nordlicht 2000 bottle dynamo. Runs both the front B&M Lumotec IQ Cyo R Senso Plus and Busch + Müller Toplight Line brake plus LED Rear Light very well. Not that loud in operation and can be run on the rim as well as the tyre side wall.

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/nordlicht-2000-sidewall-bottle-dynamo-prod1064/

It has got the lighting system up and running till I scrape the money together for an expedition SON wheel build!

[julk]

I need a headlamp with connectors so I can remove it before the locals do.
I commuted for many years with a battery driven twin halogen bulbed headlamp.

I started my 'led' headlamp phase with a Solidlights, then upgraded it to an XB2.
The Solidlights had a conical shape beam with a lot of scatter, useful on dark country lanes but difficult to avoid dazzling traffic in front of you. It also had a flashing option which I did not use.
The connectors were nice to use, but very difficult to change as you had 4 miniscule wires to try and solder in place.

Leds moved on, I sold the Solidlights and got a Supernova with the non dazzle lens, liked it.
Upgraded to the E3 Pro non dazzle and that is what I currently use. I like it the most of what I have had.
The gold connectors make it easy to wire it where you want and they are wearing well with use.

I drive mine with a SON dynohub, it gets bright quite quickly.
Like Andre, I run with the lights on all the time.

I would now like the option to drive a charging port from the headlamp, come on Supernova…
Julian.