Spec for my Nomad MK2 ?

[sbseven]

Thanks for the update, Mike.
Something's not quite right somewhere! As mentioned above, Stu's Nomad Mk2 came with the cast end adapters fitted. These wouldn't fit if the rear dropout bosses were 6mm. My 2009 Nomad Mk1 definitely has 5mm rear dropout bosses. Oh well...

[PH]

Regarding lighting I decided to go with the Edelux on the front to be supplemented later with an Ixon IQ that can be recharged via the E-Werk.
Mike

Nice spec.
I'd have another think about the lights, the Edelux and Ixon have very similar reflectors, they have the same beam pattern.  The second light will not add much, you'll have the same pool of light, just brighter.  That would have been a considerable benefit with halogens, but modern LEDs are so good it's a bit of a waste. 
That's not to say running two lights isn't a good idea. they just need to be different enough to give benefit.  An E3 with an Ixon would have been a good mix, an Edelux with something like the Hope One or another narrowish spot would offer the same.

[MikeD]

Well I have today received an email from Lisa at thorn with the following text:

Looking more closely into this I have found the that lower rear rack braze-on is 5mm. We use a drop out adaptor which is 6mm

this is after several requests for confirmation on the size of these braze-ons....

I have since spoken to Andy Blance, who was convinced that the solution offered using this adapter:

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/product-Thorn-Thorn-For-Rohloff-Cast-End-2-x-M5-to-1-x-M6-Stainless-Dropout-Adaptors-11703.htm

This entails using 1 6mm bolt either side of the thorn rack to secure it to the adapter, then securing this adapter to the braz-ons with 2 5mm bolts on each side. Andy pointed out, that the rack is now secured via 4 5mm bolts spread over 4 seperate fittings. Of course this is all very well, Andy, as he reminded me, has crossed the Andes 23 times and never had any problems.... he was either annoyed that I had dared to question his wisdom or beleived that I had no input that was worthy of hearing.
I am now in two minds as to what to do, Thorn do produce great bikes and if you want a Rohloff equipped touring bike the options are very few and far between.
Do I let the order go through, save some money and order a Raven Tour (This has the same mounting options anyway at a lower price...), I may talk to a few other builders, Roberts etc.
I must admit, after placing a deposit on a Bike costing very close to £3,500 including a few spare parts etc. I am a little suprised.

Any input is still welcome.....
Thanks
Mike

[sbseven]

Mike

I didn't want to say Lisa was wrong but I was reasonably sure of my position, having spoken to Thorn myself about this issue! I normally ask for Dave, who's their "technical query" guy and knows pretty much everything. He's also a good chap.

As discussed previously, although the bosses are 5mm on the dropouts and this IS an anomally for the Nomad spec., it isn't really an issue. It certainly shouldn't be a deal breaker, IMO. Have the cast adapters fitted (or tap out the bosses) and the rack mount is strong enough for any load you can manage to pedal! I'm certainly not worried about my rear rack load busting my 4 x 5mm bolts or bosses. Also note that most tourers have 5mm bosses anyway and you don't hear too many issues of bolts/bosses breaking. Cheap racks yes, bolts/bosses no.

Be aware that Mr. Blance is known for being, let's say "abrasive". You would not be the first, or the last, person to notice that! You mentioned Roberts, I believe they (he?) can come across the same way during the specification and ordering process. I've seen this mentioned on several forums too!

I think you were right when you said "Thorn do produce great bikes and if you want a Rohloff equipped touring bike the options are very few and far between". I think there are others worth considering such as: Santos, Koga Miyata and some other German / Dutch manufacturers that I can't name off hand. There's also Roberts (maybe other UK frame makers), as you mention, who have a fair bit of experience with Rohloffs. I thought Thorn had that extra edge, what I call "accessibility". I know I can ring them up and get immediate answers to queries. I know all the spares I could possibly want are in the warehouse behind the office and ready to ship. I know that they have a great reputation for sorting out problems (especially Rohloff problems) when you're on the other side of the world. To me, this is worth quite a lot in itself.

Regarding the Raven Tour v. Raven Nomad. The Tour is a pretty capable tourer in it's own right. Perhaps comparable with most other tourers from the companies mentioned above. I think you've got to "push the envelope a bit" to exceed the Tour's ability. A couple of differences between the two are the extra bit of robustness and the extra bit of luggage carrying capacity of the Nomad. One thing that swung it for me was the use of the Rohloff EX box on the Nomad. The Tour uses the internal gear change mechanism which is a bit more fiddly and takes a bit more effort to maintain. Note that the Tour and Nomad frames + forks are the same price, so there's no real price difference. It's all about the components used in the build. You could build up the identical bike with either frame for the same cost. Then the Nomad version would weigh about 500-700g more, I reckon. (Dave would be able to tell you, I'm sure!). The Nomad has the S&S couplings option of course. The Nomad also has the correct frame geometry to take 100mm suspension forks, which could extend it's considerable range that bit further. Whether any of these differences matter to you, I don't know. (I bought my Nomad for most of the "extras" mentioned above).

Hope that helps in some way.

Shaun

[MikeD]

Well, after all of the experience with Andy, I decided to think long and hard about what I wanted from the bike and looked around to see if anyone else could build a comparable bike. I have decided to continue with the Thorn build after a few emails from Robin Thorn and a telephone call from him, if I had done anything else it would have been out of spite and not a good decision for me......

I discussed the reason for the adapter with Robin, in his opinion it was the best solution, when asked about tapping out to 6mm he said that he would personally prefer the adapter, I got the distinct impression that he thought that there was not enough material to make this a better solution.

Regarding front lighting, I have decided to augment the edelux with a helmet mounted LED light that I can recharge via the E-Werk. So far the Hope Vision 1 LED is the best option for beam pattern and cost (Thanks PH), it will also be good for other activities other than on the bike. I do like the look of the Ay up V4 adventure as well, this is just a whole system and a great deal pricier.......

I have in the past few days talked at length with a local rider who rides lots of audax events, I may well be trying a couple myself over the summer if time allows. He also mentioned a ride in Norway called the great strength test, riding over lots and lots of big mountains for fun....... could be something to try !

Mike