Reducing the weight of my Thorn Sherpa...how did you do yours?

[Vintagetourer]

Hi PH...I particularly like your distinction of cycling with camping, from camping enabled by cycling. They certainly are different activities, and possibly defined by often and how long the camping sessions are.

On multi-month tours which can include 1 week-long or longer camps in one place, then the comfort and roominess aspect of tent and bedding becomes a priority. On faster rides, then ease of packing/unpacking becomes the priority. Anticipating weather conditions...and insect life i.e. mosquitoes, midges etc is also a consideration.

You also have me thinking that there should be, and probably already is somewhere, a volume to weight ratio for the various types of panniers and bags. I think it is likely to show that handlebar bags and saddle bags have less favourable ratios. However they are probably better on air resistance. Randonneur (Audax) riders seem to favour this style of carrying stuff for some reason.  I am yet to be convinced on backpacker style bags except for routes which involve a lot of closed vegetation and other entanglements which catch on bags. New Zealand has a lot of these type of backcountry tracks.

Yes it will be easier to lose weight on the kit. I am experimenting with the trifecta for this next tour.  The aim is to lighten the body, the kit and the bike. Reducing weight on only one of these categories saves money. The other two cost more.  My observations is that bikes and kit are like bikinis. The more you pay, the less you get.

[pondweed]

I've just been cleaning my front forks and have taken out about 9 stainless bolts which are 'protecting' various holes not currently in use!
I ordered some black nylon bolts from ebay for this purpose... they look neat and I've saved about 40g! I've also just cut my saddle post down (no-one taller than me is going to use this bike in their right mind) and drilled a few 'oles through the thickest alloy ribs on the saddle attachment brackets.

But what do others advocate? Do threads corrode when plugged, or when they are not? (I realise that ones that actually enter the frame are different)

The only downside with the nylons is that they are quite easy to strip the cross head top, if you dont go carefully and grease the thread well.

[energyman]

Best way too loose weight from a Sherpa is to buy a new bike🤣

Bob

Agree.  Horses for courses I believe rings true in this case.
My dream is a Rohloff equipped carbon fibre framed bike.

[Danneaux]

I've saved about 40g!

<nods> A remarkable accomplishment but as a former devotee of the drillium craze of the late 1970s-early 1980s, I have concluded a little extra weight just makes me that much stronger (training aid) and the only real path to lightweight of any consequence is a "systems" approach - frame, wheels, and then components in that order...and dieting, of course.

The water bottle full or empty tends to make more difference than drilling or cutting. 

All the best,

Dan.

[mickeg]

I did a two week kayaking trip a couple months ago.  After two days when I was stuck on shore due to big waves with little to do, it occurred to me that I had not weighed my food for the trip.  I had my luggage scale with me which allowed me to weigh my four dry bags that were mostly full of food.  After I had been eating for two days, I still had 15 kg of food (plus the empty weight of four dry bags) remaining.

I know that there are people that get enjoyment about drilling holes in their toothbrush handle to make it lighter, and for those people all I can say is that am quite happy that you have found a way to enjoy life.  But, that is not for me, I find it quite difficult to get excited about cutting down the weight equivalent of a quarter of a glass of wine.

Your plastic bolts, they do not need to be tightened very much, you should not worry about shearing off the heads.  In some places they will keep water ingress from your frame or fork, thus lightening your load by a few ml of water on a rainy day.  I will continue to use stainless bolts in such places.

I agree with Dans comment on a water bottle, if I had to use my last water bottle on my bike I consider that to be running low on water for that day of travel.  I like to finish the day of riding with one full water bottle for safety purposes, and since I use one liter bottles for touring that is one kg of water that try to carry without using every day.

[Vintagetourer]

13kg for the semi naked Thorn Sherpa with a few bits on it.
- new wheels
- Ti rear rack
- heavier pedals ... don’t ask why
- swapped to wood chipper handlebars

Work in progress. Now overthinking the tour load

[pondweed]

I tried drilling out toothbrush handles but they just aren't fit for purpose - the paste blocks up the holes amd goes rock hard. Titanium probably the way to go?

The pedantry of it all only extends to the period one is engaged in the activity (if the results are fit for purpose, of course) My quick calcs last night show me that all the changes (tyres, tubes, saddle and all the pedant bits) have saved over the weight of my 470g rack just added. I'm more thinking that EVERY time I use it I will thus get the 1/2 kg benefit.. but mostly that when I attempt to do a little tour (rather than a theoretical planning of one), I will be psychologically more capable of x miles a day knowing I have some power in hand!

[Vintagetourer]

Carrying a toothbrush? Sheer luxury. Back in my day we used grass stalks as toothbrushes.

More seriously, I find knocking a few kgs off the total load makes a difference.
It’s a month before my next tour, so I will find ways to lessen the load including losing weight from the rider.

[pondweed]

btw, found great variability in Schwalbe 1.6 Supreme weights as delivered.
One at textbook 440g. One at 510g, which I sent back! Replacement acceptable-ish at 470g.
Pedantry again, I know.

[jags]

Just go and ride  ::)if you somehow managed to knock a kilo off everything i guarantee you will never notice it once you start cycling.and that's a fact.

jags

[bobs]

I have to agree with Anto , just enjoy the cycling. If you want a light bike buy a like bike, there plenty of good ones out there.

Bob

[Vintagetourer]

I have been commuting with the lightened Sherpa for the past week, and I do notice the difference. Where the weight reduction is noticeable most as anticipated is with the wheels. Swapping the bombproof Rigida wheels for lighter wheels makes the Sherpa much more enjoyable to ride, especaily in the stop-start commute ride.

The 36-spoke Rigida CSS wheels I had on, are overkill for most of the touring I do. If I ever do another expedition ride, I will refit them. Meanwhile I will use the 32 spoke DT Swiss wheels. The test will be the tour I start next month.

In other words, having two pairs of wheels...light duty and heavy duty... is a cheaper weight saving option to getting another bike. The difference in rolling weight of tyres and wheels makes a difference in the fatigue factor on tour. The ride feel of the bike is another consideration. The Thorn Sherpa is never going to be a nippy bike, but the lighter wheels/tyres do make it more sprightly.

[mickeg]

..., having two pairs of wheels...light duty and heavy duty... is a cheaper weight saving option to getting another bike. The difference in rolling weight of tyres and wheels makes a difference in the fatigue factor on tour. The ride feel of the bike is another consideration. The Thorn Sherpa is never going to be a nippy bike, but the lighter wheels/tyres do make it more sprightly.

Years ago when I still had my Long Haul Trucker, I got  a lightweight pair of wheels for a great price so I bought them.  Put some 25mm wide supple faster tires on them, and they really made me feel like I was much faster.  But the ride with the skinny tires was much more harsh on rough pavement (tarmac) than it was on my 37mm tires.  Although I felt much faster, when I got home and compared times between the wheels my lighter weight wheels only trimmed about 3 or 4 percent off of my total time for the ride based on my bike computer.  This comparison was made with lots of rides, not just a few, so I felt that the 3 to 4 percent difference was accurate.  Eventually I pretty much just used my touring wheels because of the softer ride, I did not feel that the 3 to 4 percent reduced time of travel was worth the cost in comfort. 

I built up a new Titanium touring bike earlier this year.  It is not a lot lighter than a steel frame bike because the weight of the frame is only a small part of the total weight of the bike.  But, it is the lightest (non-folding) bike I have.  I am running those same 37mm tires on it that I had on my Long Haul Trucker.  I like the combination of speed and ride with those tires.  I could run skinny tires on it, but I don't really want to.

I think everybody needs to make their own decisions on comparing speed and comfort.  I probably could get a lighter weight set of wheels and run those wider tires with lighter wheels, but I just do not see any real advantage to it.  The rear wheel with tire weighs more than the weight of the Titanium frame without fork, so the wheels are not that light.

[Vintagetourer]

Titanium has a lovely ride feel. It is not only the weight saving but Ti seems to absorb road noise better than steel.
I agree about the tyres. Rolling comfort is more important than weight. I am using slick 1.6” tyres which are still fairly hefty, and more comfortable than the 2.1” nobblies they replaced.

The ultimate tyre if thorns and glass on the road were minimal would be Compass tyres. They ride like a pair of soft comfortable slippers. I have used them on my Ti road bike. They roll superbly but attract punctures.

[Vintagetourer]

Getting close to the final set up for the next tour.
Looks like this.
Basic bike approx 13kg
Load without food, water, stove fuel approx 18kg
With food, water, fuel it will be about 34kg.