Author Topic: Ultralight touring on light bikes  (Read 9262 times)

jags

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2015, 10:35:57 PM »
Yip Andy here to tell the tale  ;D ;D
life is only a bubble you blow in then you blow out so enjoy it while we can. ;)

leftpoole

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2015, 09:15:29 AM »
Have to disagree there a bit John, going light weight or ultralight has been going on in the UK for years with bikes, kayaks and on foot. It all boils down what one is prepaid to put up with and going ultralight you have to be dam sure you know how to use that kit correctly. That said, it can all go "Pete Tong" (wrong) very quickly if you skill, ability, kit and judgement are flawed, as many mountain marathon runners have found to their cost! that applies to all three disciplines above. Admittedly you do have to have the determination  and commitment to get any real enjoyment from that type of activity in the UK , the VISA card option sound the best way to light at my age ;D

Andy

Hello,
I've been camping/cycling for 55 years! I have now at long last the very best quality lightweight kit that is 'affordable'. It all works very well. Take a look here:- www.pbase.com/leftpoole
I have had some heavy gear in the past because lightweight was not light at all!
My mention of Ray Jardine appears to have been interpreted incorrectly or maybe written incorrectly?
What I should have said:- Jardine has made money from 'his' lightweight ideas, but in my opinion most of it is nonsense when it comes down to UK use and comfort. Indeed even Chris Townsend the outdoor living backpacking hobo who earns from book and magazine writing the same as Ray Mears) has now scorned some of Jardines 'ideas' as impracticable.
By all means sleep in a ditch if that's what turns you on, but for me a kilo in weight tent will do nicely. Along with titanium pots etc and a stove of choice...
All the best,
John
« Last Edit: January 13, 2015, 09:43:38 AM by leftpoole »

in4

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2015, 10:10:15 AM »
One could of course leave one's physical bike at home and take an imaginary one to ride thus drawing this thread to a light-hearted but perhaps philosophically significant conclusion.  ;)

leftpoole

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2015, 10:13:54 AM »
One could of course leave one's physical bike at home and take an imaginary one to ride thus drawing this thread to a light-hearted but perhaps philosophically significant conclusion.  ;)


That is exactly what Anthony is going to do!
 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Danneaux

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2015, 08:43:28 AM »
 ;D

I agree with John in finding the ultimate in weight-saving minimalist cycle-camping has not been for me. A 1kg tent (which I used for some 35 years) served me well, but I really wouldn't have wanted to go lighter for reasons of durability, personal comfort and preference, and appropriateness to the conditions and need for use.

One thing I have found for me, in my use, is (super) ultralight camping gear may work fine for a period of time, but items that are even a little more robust can last for a much longer period, making even slightly heavier stuff a better investment for me. There have been times when I have ridden far into the night to "make distance" and when I finally stopped, fatigued and weary (I've found the states to be additive, rather than synonymous), I would occasionally fail to see the blackberries woven through the grass beneath my tent, or the sharp rocks I would have easily spotted in daylight, both of which can wreak havoc on the lightest of silnylon floors but are shrugged off by my slightly heavier urethane-coated floor sitting atop a footprint/ground cloth. A sleeping bag can be unzipped and used as a quilt or a bag, but a dedicated quilt lacks that versatility and hasn't been so well suited for me as a frequent side-sleeper. Ultralight panniers are fine in and of themselves, but sharp-cornered pokey things can eventually work their way through with sufficient vibration and distance, or very quickly if the bike is innocently leaned even with great care against a rough-stuccoed building or a tree with coarse bark or even laid down on gravel 'cos the prop stand (Click-Stand in my case) was left home to save weight. Such things prove to be false weight-economy for me. If I were an adventure racer, the choices would tip sharply in favor of the lightest possible approach.

My personal weather experience also agrees largely with John's UK in that Oregon can be a Very Wet bit of country for 8-9 months of the year...and then I often go to the other extreme in its desert regions in high summer. Not all shelters will do for all conditions and I've been grateful for my heavier tent over a lightweight tarp in many a thundering wind-driven downpour or where bugs and snakes predominate.

For me, even (maybe especially!) controversial ideas get the creative juices flowing, and I do appreciate Ray Jardine making me think...enough to buy his book to learn more about what propounds. I also like his idea of an integrative approach to Trail Life, and have adapted my own version, but most often in very different ways from what he endorses, usually because his methods often would not work well for me in the places where I ride and camp.

In the bigger picture, it is interesting to see how individual voices and philosophies have emerged and spawned whole schools of thought in the Internet Age. Grant Petersen, Andy Blance, Ray Jardine, Iik...these and many more present their views of what works as they know it. Many have a business interest that has developed from their personal interest, so naturally some marketing is involved in addressing what they see as an unmet need. Many of us were doing many of the same things in our cycling and camping and cycle-camping for decades before electronic communities, but having a vocal spokesperson gives a rallying point as well as a common frame of reference, especially helpful for newcomers who lack experience and are looking for ready-made solutions to get up to speed quickly with a "systems" approach, precanned and ready to go. Nothing wrong with that, but a few years down the road and with use, no doubt those ready-made packages will be altered to suit personal preference.

For me, I still run the gamut of Camping Solutions from Ultralight (my Short On Luck kits to address unexpected strandings) to Expedition, depending on need and appropriateness. I rarely have the same inventory for any two trips. This year, one of my goals is to change the nature of my long-distance day rides, to split them roughly in two so I don't have to turn around at the halfway point in order to make it home in one go. That is getting a little old, and I think turning a long day ride into two days with some added distance to explore new areas once I get there will make things fresh again and add a whole new dimension of fun. "Oh, look! I took a long day-ride, and a tour broke out!" Carrying a minimalist kit (light sleeping bag for >freezing conditions, small/light pad, my 1-person tent and footprint, a beer can spirit stove and small cup to boil water plus rain gear and food for a couple of meals in only two front panniers) for such occasions makes a lot of sense for "overnighters", less so for my self-supported trips away from ready resupply for 4-5 weeks. Yes, the usefuless of that minimalist kit can be extended, but for me I begin to feel the lack of more comprehensive gear after a week or so, enough to make me pack differently for longer trips. A folding chair can be a really nice addition to Camp Life!  ;)

All the best,

Dan.

Slammin Sammy

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2015, 01:02:00 PM »
As my dearly beloved and many of my friends can attest, I almost always ride with "too much stuff". My bike has lots of "fruit", including three computers/navigators, seven running lights (besides the Dynamo head and tail lights), a frame bag for a hydration bladder, tyre pump, tripod and Click Stand, bar bag, top tube pouch for wallet and phone, saddle bag for tools and spares, two cables (for the Amparo frame lock and the n'Lock stem), full rain gear, etc. etc. This is for commuting and local riding. My touring setup is mostly additive (Dan I take a chair AND a table  :D), but I drop off the running lights when adding my Ortleib bags fore and aft.

In all this stuff, it seems a bit pointless to spend heaps of money just to save even 200 grams. I am, however, always fascinated reading other people's anti-weight crusades, although I'm not likely to ever give up my creature comforts and gadget freakiness to try and emulate them.  ;D

Here's a recent shot (not on tour). I've been meaning to do a proper rundown on Atilla the Nomad, since he's over 18 months old now, but I'll post it in the Gallery section.

Danneaux

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Re: Ultralight touring on light bikes
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2015, 09:32:14 PM »
Lovely bike and wonderful setup that is a joy to see, Sammy. If it makes you happy...why not?

All the best,

Dan. (...who is surely looking forward to all the details on this one)