Author Topic: First Tour  (Read 3105 times)

Neil Jones

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First Tour
« on: May 15, 2013, 02:41:55 PM »
I've booked two weeks off from work at the end of June and was thinking of embarking on my first mini tour. I ride a RST which is my pride and joy and is equipped with a Thorn Expedition Rear Rack. I also have Carradice Super C front and rear panniers which so far have been used mainly for shopping etc. Being an avid follower of the forum for a few years many people suggest spreading the weight on an RST as the front end is quite twitchy so I may have to invest in a pair of front low riders. My plan is to tour around my native Wales but I'm unsure whether to be self supporting or to use Bed and Breakfast accommodation. I have a Hilleberg Akto tent and don't need to buy anything else as I've undertaken quite a few long distance trails in the past. I would be grateful of any opinions on how people prefer to travel. Also what sort of rough milage per day is a sensible distance bearing in mind Wales has some pretty hilly terrain? I'm reasonably fit as I commute 20 miles a day to work but I'm not use to long days in the saddle. Any other tips and suggestions would be warmly received.

Danneaux

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2013, 04:13:26 PM »
Hi Neil!

How exciting! A tour in the works; grand fun and Adventure await you and all best wishes in advance. You've a lovely machine to ride for it.

As for weight and distribution, a quick check of the RST portion of Thorn's Summer 2011 brochure reminds me of Andy Blance's recommended weight limits on page 8...
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The RST can carry just 4kg on each side of its forks and will cope with 16kg at the back. This is its limit and the RST is not at its best near the limit!
A reasonable caution, given the more sporting nature and lighter tubing of the RST. A bit later in the page, Andy adds...
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The RST is at its best with around 6kg, this load has no effect whatsoever on the bike's sublime handling. The RST will encourage you to keep trying harder as long as you don't overload it. I'd never want to travel far with more than 10kg on the back, unless the front was also carrying some weight.
Given these cautions, the amount of weight will help determine if you wish/need to carry front panniers.

You can surely tour on the RST; just keep the overall weight and its placement in check, and I think you'll do fine. You don't have to carry everything but the kitchen sink to have a good time or live in reasonable comfort while camping self-supported -- going the B&B route allows even more freedom. You'll do fine either way, I'm sure.

The matter of using front panniers or not is nearly as individual as the decision to wear a helmet, and there are people who are not only happy with their own way of doing things, but staunchly committed. In my own experience, I have found it helpful (necessary, from my perspective) to distribute the weight around the bike, so I use front panniers and sometimes a lightly loaded handlebar bag and heavily loaded rear panniers, but -- and this is key -- my frames are not as lightweight and sporting as an RST's. I had a Sherpa Mk2 (think: Raven Tour framewise) and now a Nomad M2, so weight and its placement was not as critical as on a lighter, more sporting machine. Reading AndyB's suggestions, it sounds as if front panniers are pretty necessary to maintain good handling if you approach the RST's weight limits.

Since you already have a full set of very nice bags (and tent!), I would suggest loading up the Super Cs in various configurations and giving them a try to see what works best for your needs on some test runs and day rides. This sort of "shakedown cruise" is tremendously valuable for finding what works for you, as are overnight "camping trips" in the backyard or very close to home. Those elements of the trip are little different from what you'll find on a RealTour™...and you are close enough to home to make changes quickly and easily without having to suffer much in the way of consequences if something doesn't work or fails. In this case, if riding with only a rear load "doesn't feel right", then you can spring for the front pannier racks. If things go well as-is, you can save the cash toward lodging or other things.

Given Andy B's counsel on weight, perhaps something light but bulky in the front bags would be just the thing -- a sleeping bag in one and your inflatable pad in the other, with a wind jacket and a fleece distributed in the remaining front bag space. That would free up more room in your rear bags/atop your rear rack, leave your most-used/changed clothing ready to hand, and keep within Andy B's endorsed weight limits on the forks.

As for daily distance and limits, I would suggest keeping the Danneaux's Fun Imperative® in mind -- bike touring should be enjoyable on the face of it, so having realistic mileage goals helps a lot, especially early on if you're not used to doing it. Again -- I would suggest loading up the bags with the weight you expect to carry and doing some day rides in similar terrain (which may mean seeking out hills, slopes, and even loading ramps) to see how it goes. Low gearing will make any hill easier to conquer and add to the fun in doing so; you'll be carrying extra weight, after all, so don't hesitate to shift down when needed. "Tour" implies longer days in the saddle, and more consistent ones than the usual day-riding, so you may wish to adjust daily mileage downward a bit, adjust pace, and engineer in some rest days off the bike to stay fresher. Your 20-mile daily commutes will be a tremendous help, as you've already built a daily "base" on which to build your tour miles.

After some "engineered play", I think you'll know much better what your limits are, and where you will need to make changes.

Your planned trip sounds wonderful Neil and you're bound to have a good time. I can't wait to see photos on your return. Though my suggestions aren't specific, hopefully something will prove helpful going forward and you're almost guaranteed to receive helpful, on-target responses from other Forum members -- some of whom likely tour on RSTs.

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2013, 04:55:55 PM by Danneaux »

jags

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2013, 06:43:29 PM »
How's it going there Neil.
a couple of friends of mine ride ravens wow beautiful bikes that's for sure.
myself I'm not a lover of marathon plus tires  ;D ;D sorry just thought I'd throw that in  ::)
or front panniers barbag yes, i reckon that's all the extra balance you need up front, you should get all you need into the 2 rear pannier.what takes up all the room is sleeping gear and cloths so if you can figure out how to cut back big time on these items without sacrificing comfort your on a winner.
very best of luck with the tour remember its a holiday so do your best to enjoy. ;)
« Last Edit: May 15, 2013, 07:00:26 PM by jags »

RobertL

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2013, 08:04:13 PM »
Last year cycled Holyhead to Nottingham but on a B&B approach - it was early winter and North Wales via Llanberis and Betws-y-Coed was spectacular - the hills not too challenging, and very little traffic. It took me two and a half days, but would have dialled it back to three ~ four days - that equates to around 60 mile days. The low traffic density being 'off season' made the ride very enjoyable, also easy to get good B&B rooms.

John Saxby

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2013, 01:38:11 AM »
Hi Neil,

To add to Dan's suggestions:  If you're summer camping, and eat at cafés, etc., you can avoid the extra weight and bulk of stove & fuel, cookware & food.  That should mean you're within the RST's weight limits.  (And have space for your favourite snacks too.)

Enjoy your trip!  The few times I've travelled in Wales, I've enjoyed it immensely.

John

Neil Jones

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2013, 03:44:40 PM »
Thanks very much for all your suggestions, I'm very grateful. I'm almost sure that I'll be camping now as I love the freedom of pitching up wherever and whenever I feel like it. I'm going to follow your suggestion Danneaux and load up my panniers on my rear rack and go for a weekend trial to see how the bike behaves with the extra weight, I have a feeling though that my RST would handle better with a little weight up front, we'll see.
I've not preplanned my route yet but will probably follow the North Wales Coast where I live and travel westwards taking in Angelsey the Lleyn Peninsula and Pembrokeshire going down as far as Carmarthen then head inland through Mid Wales towards the Shropshire border before heading home.
Hello there Jags, yes I've ditched the Marathon Plus for the time being and I'm now running 1.6 Supremes which roll much better and are more comfortable although I might put the Marathon's back on next autumn when the hedgecutting season starts again.
It should be a good test of whether cycle touring is for me, I've always fancied just setting off without a plan and seeing where you end up. You never know if I enjoy it that much I could be tempted to supplement my RST with a Nomad.
Thanks again for your tips, what a great forum this is for all us likeminded people.

jags

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2013, 09:52:26 PM »
Good stuff Neil hope it all works out perfect for you.
i guess doing it solo is the way to go and better still no plan so you can do exactly what ever you fancy doing i like it. ;)
thing about front panniers you end up taking the kitchen sink ,with some very carefull planning you will get all you need into rear panniers making IMHO for a much better ride.
i know most if not all the lads here say that front panniers balance the bike making it more stable on the road,well myself i have never found this to be the case.
but each to there own what ever works out best for you is the way to go.
cheers
jags .

Danneaux

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Re: First Tour
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2013, 04:00:44 AM »
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I'm going to follow your suggestion Danneaux and load up my panniers on my rear rack and go for a weekend trial to see how the bike behaves with the extra weight, I have a feeling though that my RST would handle better with a little weight up front, we'll see.
Can't wait to hear how it goes, Neil.
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...will probably follow the North Wales Coast where I live and travel westwards...
Looks a fabulous route on GoogleEarth, and you'll see some wonderful countryside.
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It should be a good test of whether cycle touring is for me, I've always fancied just setting off without a plan and seeing where you end up. You never know if I enjoy it that much I could be tempted to supplement my RST with a Nomad.
<nods, vigorously> Yes! Sometimes going without a specific plan is the best of all, and with your "house on your back" you can do just that, stopping as you wish and making the days as long -- or short -- as you wish, subject only to finding a good camping spot. Depending on where you are, that can mean wild/stealth camping, and that alone opens up whole new worlds of enjoyment (and is my favorite means for camping). I have a feeling it will work out wonderfully for you, and -- Yes! -- there just might be a second Thorn in your future! Meantime, you can have a wonderful ride and tour on a fantastic, sporting bike -- the RST.

Very welcome, Neil. All good times your way!

Best,

Dan.