Why not stainless steel

[ourclarioncall]

I’m looking a nomad 2 frame and possibly building the bike up

But the potential for scratching and rust kind of antagonises my no fuss worry free desires

I don’t want to always be looking for scratches and marks here and there and touching them up with paint

I see some folk make make stainless steel frames /bikes that don’t rust ? Why does Thorn not make them in stainless steel ? Cost ? Performance? Tradition ?

[leftpoole]

Stainless steel?
With a Thorn it is used in dropouts and other parts.
In my opinion and to save those others writing long unbearable replies, it is not required.
Has anyone ever seen a rusted Thorn?
Start over and bore everyone? No not needed.
John --in MY opinion of course!

[Prince of Darkness]

I don't really see the use of stainless as being necessary from a rust point of view. Living very close to the sea, I actually see quite a lot of supposedly stainless steel with superficial rust (there are various different types of stainless, some of which fall short in a salt water environment). My Thorn bikes have never shown any more than minor superficial rust to their Reynolds 853 and 725 tubing, possibly because their chromium content is actually making them fairly near to being stainless? On the other hand, corrosion of my aluminium Thorn chainring has been quite extensive, though not to the detriment of performance so far. That said, some of the available stainless tubing, such as Reynolds 953, does seem to have remarkable physical properties, on top of the corrosion resistance.

[ourclarioncall]

Good question - HAS anyone ever seen a rusted Thorn ? 🧐

[ourclarioncall]

“ Stainless steel is typically specified because of its ability to resist corrosion in a variety of environments. Unfortunately, stainless steel is not fully stain or rust-proof, it is just more resistant to corrosion that's why it's called stain less steel.

Exposure to corrosive process fluids and cleaners, high humidity or high salinity environments such as sea water can remove the native protective layer (chromium oxide) and can cause stainless steel corrosion.  Removing surface rust from surfaces improves the appearance, but it's importance goes beyond the decorative.  Rust, left unchecked, can lead to pitting and structural damage to products and components and can impact the performance of instrumentation, contaminate flow paths, and impact reliability. ”

Internet quote

[ourclarioncall]

I think I first believed stainless steel could rust

Then read something recently about stainless steel bikes that planted the seed in my mind that stainless didn’t in fact rust

Now I’ve been brought back to reality

So stainless CAN potentially rust and not a good idea to let waves wash sand off your bike after a ride along the sand

[rualexander]

Good question - HAS anyone ever seen a rusted Thorn ? 🧐

Yes.
Depends on your definition of "rusted", but my Sherpa has several areas prone to rusting that need keeping an eye on and annual treatment. Particularly fork braze-ons,  fork crown/leg joints, chainstay bridge,  etc.
My Audax mk3 not quite as bad partly because the braze-ons are stainless steel.
Same applies to the Raven that I maintain for someone else.
Salt on the roads in winter here, and year round storage in an outdoor shed makes it hard to avoid a degree of rusting.

[ourclarioncall]

If I get a Thorn I definitely want to keep it indoors.

And I usually stop commuting to work before winter anyway so maybe those two things would heighten my chances of staying a bit more rust free for longer

I hear folk recommend just use a cheap bike for winter

Chase and face ? What’s that all about ?
https://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/spew_care_and_feeding_of_your_steel_frame

[Danneaux]

Chase and face ? What’s that all about ?

If you are buying a bare Thorn frame from SJS Cycles, then their Workshop Prep is a good thing to consider especially if you don't have the needed tools and hardware ready to hand:
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/frames/frame-workshop-prep/?geoc=US

Basically, it means all overspray is removed and threads are chased so parts will fit and install smoothly. Thorn also installs "blanking" bolts so the bolt holes in the frame are filled, preventing water entry. Finally, the frame's interior is sprayed with an anti-rust preparation and the vent hole in the head tube covered with masking tape as the steerer tube and eccentric are greased. Good value for the modest cost, I think.

If you are buying a complete Thorn bicycle, then these operations will occur as a matter of course during their assembly.

Best,

Dan.

[martinf]

The stainless steel Tubus Cosmo rear rack looks quite pretty on my old utility bike, which has been used in all weathers, including in coastal areas with a bit of salt. Just a slight bit of discoloration on one of the welds. The alloy shell on the S5/2 hub gear I fitted to this bike is discoloured from salt corrosion after 44,000 kms of use, but it still functions OK.

An ordinary steel rack such as Thorn's own brand gets rust spots caused by the pannier bag atachments rubbing the paint off. It may not look pretty when the bike is ridden without luggage, but I don't find it a big deal, the small amount of surface rust doesn't impede function and the rack just gets the same treatment as the frame and forks. On these, from time to time I rub down any rust spots I see, and touch-up the paint. At much longer intervals I strip the bike down completely and repaint the frame and forks (and any other painted parts) completely.

My old utility bike frame dates from the mid 1960's at the latest, it could be much earlier, maybe even from the early 1950's. And I still have my 1977 Woodrup steel frame derailleur tourer, which has had the same "touch-up paint, very occasional complete repainting" maintenance regime for the external frame/forks, plus an internal treatment with a sticky rust-inhibitor a few years after purchase.

So rust isn't a major problem for me, it might be different in areas where salt is used for long periods in winter, if you ride in coastal areas in bad weather (salt spray), and for bikes stored outside for long periods. 

If you build up the bike yourself, it is easy to treat the insides of all accessible tubes with some kind of rust preventer after purchase but before doing the build. But I think Thorn frames sold nowadays get a fairly good rust prevention coating anyway.

Facing and cleaning out the threads are operations you do on a new or repainted frame before building up the bike. Thorn offer them as an optional service called "workshop preparation" when you buy a new frame from them. I took this option for the 3 Thorn frames I bought unbuilt, as I reckoned it wasn't worth buying the tools to do the job myself. They do this automatically when you buy a complete bike.

[ourclarioncall]

Great info ✅

Is there differences between the older nomad 2 frames and the ones they have for sale now in sjs store?

Maybe I’m mistaken but thought I read somewhere there was an introduction of stainless steel on some parts.

[Aleman]

I believe that Reynolds 921 and 953 tubing sets are in fact stainless.

Sven Cycles use 953 in some of thier bikes and Woodrup make a 921 framed bike.

So "stainless" steel tube sets are available ... Is it worth the cost over 853, 725, or 531? Or even, dare I say it, 969? My Dawes 531 Tandem has been stored in an open shed, and in a wooden shed for the best part of 30 years. It has significant rust areas, BUT I've never taken any care with the prevention of rust at all until this year, when I rubbed down the rust areas and 'Touched up' the paint, and coated the inside of the tubes with some Dinitrolrust preventer ... it will get a full strip and respray with a 2K paint at some time.

The Raven has had Dinitol applied internally, and I'm going to be taking much better care of the powder coat finish should it get scratched or chipped.

One tip, don't leave a steel framed bike, even stainless or titanium, in a brick built shed with lime mortar!! Any mortar that falls on the tubes will cause rust in a big way 

[RHSJS]

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/bikes/thorn-scorpion-stainless-steel-55l-29er/

Just leave this here...

[UKTony]

Great info ✅

Is there differences between the older nomad 2 frames and the ones they have for sale now in sjs store?

Maybe I’m mistaken but thought I read somewhere there was an introduction of stainless steel on some parts.

When I bought my Mark 2 Nomad in 2013 the frame specs included
Stainless steel fittings: 
bottom bracket shell, dropouts, lo-loader carrier bosses, dynamo, mudguard and lamp bosses , seat clamp, guides for routeing fully-enclosed brake and hub gear cables, oversize (6mm) carrier bosses, cast vertical Rohloff specific socketed dropouts, eccentric screws, bottle cage mounts (3) and direct-fit mudguard mounts.

Stainless steel rear dropout adaptors (2xM5 to 1xM6).
You’d need to check the specs for the latest Mark 3 to see if they’re any different.
T.