Installing Gilles Berthoud shifter? Nipple size and shape?

[keleher]

Trying to install the new Gilles shifter, problems.

First, is the nipple on the end of a rohloff shifter cable different than the standard derailleur cable?

I ask because the Gilles shifter comes w/ small "spikes" that are threaded to go into the cable grooves. In the picture, the "spike" is the threaded doohicky that laying on top, next to the "1". It's not actually attached to anything in the picture.

You can see the derailleur cable nipple, it will not go any deeper into the groove. I have the feeling that the nipple is supposed to fit down inside, and the spike is screwed in afterwards to keep it there, but the nipple doesn't fit.

So, is the rohloff shifter cable nipple different than a derailleur nipple?   Of course, I should have just kept the old cable to check, but didn't....

[Danneaux]

Hi Keleher,

Sorry you're having problems. If it's any help, the solution isn't readily apparent to me from what I can see in the photo, either. Have you checked the installation diagram posted here?: http://www.sjscycles.com/Instructions/Gilles_Berthoud/Gilles_Berthoud_Twister_For_Rohloff_Hubs_Instructions.pdf

The instructions are a little um, vague, but it appears the cable end may be intended to slip into a different aperture. I'm thinking the one we see next to the grub screw is perhaps intended to hold the cable in place after wrapping 'round the drum (I don't have one, have never done the job, so this is intended as helpful speculation). Can you remove the cable and see if the grub screw will actually engage threads in the area we see? The crinkly area where the leaded cable end is looks a bit too oval to be threads...?

Best,

Dan. (trying to help, without much to offer this time)

[keleher]

Yes, the "grub screw" (a new term!) does thread nicely into the opening. It doesn't appear any wider in cross section than the cable nipple, but evidently the threading makes the difference.

[stutho]

First, is the nipple on the end of a rohloff shifter cable different than the standard derailleur cable?

Yes it is see my post below

OK what follows next is an educated guess given that I do not own and have never seen  a Gilles Berthoud shifter.

Take a  file to the nipple of the gear cable and remove a small amount from the circumference - you could also do this with sand paper. I believe that the cable nipple is meant to slight down beyond the threaded section and then the Grub screw fitted.  BUT THIS IS A QUESS - proceed with care!  

I have fitted a few gear cables to the standard shifter and I have on occasion found the tolerances a bit too tight just a light file made all the difference.

Stuart  

[keleher]

This did, in fact, work, though the result is an extremely stiff-shifting system. I'm theorizing that my 5yo cables are thicker than the rohloff cables, which will be here monday. Kind of a waste of the old cables, though I wasn't going to ever use them anyway.

pete

[NZPeterG]

This did, in fact, work, though the result is an extremely stiff-shifting system. I'm theorizing that my 5yo cables are thicker than the rohloff cables, which will be here monday. Kind of a waste of the old cables, though I wasn't going to ever use them anyway.

pete

Hi Pete I have had a Rohloff for over 6 years, I have never seen nipple's like in your photo!
The nipple's in the photo cable look like STD gear cable's and Not Rohloff gear cable's.
I run STD gear cable's in my Rohloff outer cable thinking that the Rohloff cable's were too small   But gear changing was always poor! I was thinking that my Hub was playing up   But it was because I was running the wrong cable's  
I Sold my old Rohloff Hub late last year! Only to find out and Order a New Hub  

Pete....

[stutho]

My reply above was incorrect!  I answered the wrong question!  I will try again...

First, is the nipple on the end of a rohloff shifter cable different than the standard derailleur cable?

They are the same.  

I am really sorry for the earlier incorrect reply - I occasional go word blind, I comprehended your question in my mind as 'is the Rohloff cable the same as dérailleur cable'.

The Rohloff Speedhub uses standard inner gear cable and standard outer brake cable.  I, and many on this forum, have replaced old or damaged original cables with off the shelf standard cable with completely successfully results.   Indeed the quality of the original cables has sometimes been questioned.  Historically The Rohloff outer cable in particular used to give problems with the cable liner sometimes becoming damaged and then migrating  into the shifter mechanism. This issue (I believe) has how been resolved.

Although the Rohloff cable IS standard gear cable I have noticed that the nipples on the Rohloff cable seam to be ever so slightly thinner but not enough to stop standard cable from working (we are talking about manufacture tolerance here not a deliberate difference).  I have never taken a Vernier callipers to the nipples so this is anecdotal only.

Again can I apologize for my earlier reply.

Stuart

  

        



 

  

[keleher]

The Rohloff Speedhub uses standard inner gear cable and standard outer brake cable.  I, and many on this forum, have replaced old or damaged original cables with off the shelf standard cable with completely successfully results.   Indeed the quality of the original cables has sometimes been questioned.  Historically The Rohloff outer cable in particular used to give problems with the cable liner sometimes becoming damaged and then migrating  into the shifter mechanism. This issue (I believe) has how been resolved.

I think you are talking about the cable housing here, right?   We might be getting lost in different terminologies across the atlantic.

Although the Rohloff cable IS standard gear cable I have noticed that the nipples on the Rohloff cable seam to be ever so slightly thinner

The nipples were not close to fitting inside the shifter track before I shaved them down w/ a file. I think you first response was to exactly what I was asking.

I have never taken a Vernier callipers to the nipples

Um. Sorry, my sense of humor got locked back when I was ten, this is just too funny......


  

        



 

  
[/quote]

[stutho]

   I made a funny.

and yes cable housing = cable outer

[NZPeterG]

Well I do have some Vernier callipers.

Rohloff (new) inner cable nipples are 4mm

Std gear inner cable nipples are 4.5mm

Rohloff (old) inner cable was 1.1mm (new) is 1.2mm

Std gear inner is 1.2mm but can be up too 1.3mm  

So I was a little wrong too  

Sorry  

[keleher]

Thanks, your measurements make sense.

[Dave Whittle Thorn Workshop]

This is true Rohloff cables have slightly smaller diameter heads and are 1.1mm wire, these should be used where possible as now th new Rohloff outer cables have a ferrule with a seal in which will be damaged by larger 1.2mm cables, also the bigger heads can distort the plastic in the twistshifer housing.

In short OEM Rohloff cables are best, or we developed some tandem length cables which meet OEM requirements with Fibrax see http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/fibrax-fibrax-tandem-inner-gear-cables-rohloff-compatible-3500-mm-prod28660/

Hope this helps,

Dave