Quote from: Andyb1 on May 03, 2026, 10:45:23 PM

The KMC E1 is reputed to be a good chain but not cheap.

I use these for most of the hub gear bikes I maintain. With ChainGliders if possible. My take on this is that the higher price over a standard chain is compensated by longer chainring life (except for Rohloff the costs of rear sprockets are cheap enough to be ignored). Plus less time spent on chain maintenance.

With Rohloff / chainglider I am using cheap chains - Sram PC870.  £15 at Halfords.  It is what was fitted on the bike when new and I now use two PC870 chains which I swop around every 5000 miles……it will take me a few years to wear them both out as their projected life looks around 15,000 miles each……they may outlast me.


Without a chainglider I would definitely fit a better quality chain - like a KMC E1 EPT.  (AFAIK the EPT bit just means it has better rust protection). £30 at Halfords.

Thanks, All, for the kind words; much appreciated!

I've missed here is the ability to "like" someone's post...

I'm always open to suggestions. I've been Forum Admin for the last 15 years now, and followed the Forum daily as a nonmember for 7 years before that, so I knew most of the faces when I signed on. Back in the day, the Forum's "Karma" setting was enabled, then switched off early on. Still available, is is described thusly:

"Karma is a feature that shows the popularity of a member. Members, if allowed, can 'applaud' or 'smite' other members, which is how their popularity is calculated".

This doesn't sound like what Moronic has in mind, and I fear it could lead to divisiness or diversion from our main purpose of "discussive camaraderie and mutual aid" as it can lead to competiveness in posting, gaming the system, or retribution in the case of feuds. Reading the Admin chatter on various fora, there can be a number of unintended consequences. I think if I could find a way to add only the thumbs-up as Monorinic suggested, that could work well. Something similar using emojis seems to work pretty well for Facebook, barring the sarcastic or inappropriate use of the "laughter" emoji.

An AI query returned this useful summary of the Karma opton pros and cons...

The pros and cons of the karma setting in SMF 2.0 can be summarized as follows:
Pros:
Allows users to earn and lose karma based on their contributions, fostering a sense of community and accountability.
Encourages users to engage in discussions and contribute to the forum, as karma can be gained or lost depending on their activity.
Provides a way to reward users for their active participation and engagement with the community.
Cons:
May lead to a negative perception of the forum if karma is not managed properly, as it can be seen as a form of "pay-to-win" or "gaming" the system.
Requires careful management to ensure that karma is awarded fairly and not abused by a small group of users.
May not be suitable for all types of forums, especially those that prioritize a more neutral or neutralizing approach to user contributions.
It is important for forum administrators to carefully consider the pros and cons of the karma setting and to implement it in a way that promotes a healthy and balanced community.

In contrast, I do like the idea of a "thumbs-up" for liked posts and agree it would encourage more open expression of approval for topics of interest. A quick check of the "SMS Forum Forum" shows it is on the development list and may be available soon as the open-source coders get to it. I'm not yet sure if it will be an inbuilt option or available as a "mod" (modification) that can be installed and then activated. I have generally tried to avoid mods over the years, as they can conflict with or are broken by later updates and can cause a mess. Some are innocuous yet useful, and those are high on my interest list. Even those bear watching for unintended consequences. Thumbs up/down options often affect page rankings, as on YouTube listings, so negatively rated posts can slide down the listings independent of date and vice versa for postive feedback. The result can present difficulty for those who just want to logon and see "the latest". Rankings work better and are more appropriate on a monetized platform.

Meantime, I can see view counts on each topic and I use that as a general measure of reader interest. It has been long enough since I logged in as a regular member, I'm not sure if most can see that or not. For me, the count appears just to the right of the topic title when viewing the topic and replies to it.

I do wish the Forum's internal mail system was back online and available. Ours broke in an upgrade and our (mine and Thorn's IT specialist) best efforts to restore it have been frustrated. There's a couple more things on my personal wish list I keep looking to implement and will, when available.

Thanks again for the kind words and suggestions!

Best, Dan.

The KMC E1 is reputed to be a good chain but not cheap.  It looks like it has done well.  Perhaps helped by your 45 / 19 ratio?
The chainwheel being alloy probably explains the wear - but if you can flip it then it will also do a good total mileage.
If you fit a new E1 and flip both chainwheel and sprocket then in another 22,000 km everything will be due for a change.

Put on a new chain, flip the sprocket.  Your sprocket looks amazingly good for that distance and if your chain is worn.  My sprocket was more worn than that when I finally flipped it.

Your chainring looks more worn than the sprocket does, that surprises me.  I would replace the sprocket chainring at this time.

You might consider measuring your chain later.  The cheap small chain checkers are not very accurate, but you can measure the length of an entire chain when it hangs from a hook.  One link is a half inch when new, thus 100 links is 50 inches from center of pin to center of pin.  If it is 50.5 inches, that is one percent elongation.  I think on a Rohloff bike replacing the chain when you are a bit over one percent elongation is a good time to replace it.

EDIT:  I made a correction above, I meant to suggest replacing the chainring, but used the word sprocket inadvertently.

Strange how the chainwheel is more worn than the sprocket - but maybe it is alloy while the sprocket is steel?

If it's the original chainring supplied by Thorn it is almost certainly aluminium alloy.

With teeth starting to hook is there a risk of the chain being sucked up the back of the chainwheel and locking up?

Very unlikely on hub gear without a derailleur or derailleur type tensioner. Even with a slack chain, though with the latter it can drop off the chainring.