Thorn Cycles Forum
Private Classified => Bikes For Sale => Topic started by: UKTony on December 04, 2021, 08:46:02 am
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https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224723131202?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3D8b540d2bfcd54441a86e774cf9351ed4%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D224723131202%26itm%3D224723131202%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2380057%26brand%3DThorn&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A15dbba8d-54dd-11ec-a366-062aecc95047%7Cparentrq%3A8495275a17d0a9f736b55ae3fffdbb24%7Ciid%3A1
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Looks like a bargain at that price.
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Good specifications all around.
I was surprised that Thorn did not include the three mounting points on the front fork for the newer bikepacking cages in the Mk III revision. The the text and last photo shows adaptors that were custom made for the task on this one.
I think that is the first SJS assembled Rohloff bike I have seen that had 36 spokes on the rear. Even after Rohloff added the 36 spoke option years ago, SJS continued to stick with 32 spoke. I built my own wheels for my Nomad Mk II in 2013, I used 36 since I was buying the parts, thus this is only the second Nomad I have seen with 36 spokes. But now it is getting harder to find good replacement 36 hole rims, so using 36 on this bike is a bit of a surprise to me.
Owner said he wants a hardtail for off road riding. I wonder if he would have been happier with a Mk II instead since that could take a suspension fork? I have use a suspension fork on my Mk II for some mountain biking trails.
Disc brake rear and rim brake front, that is how I set up my Lynskey.
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I’m just waiting for him to answer questions I sent yesterday….
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If that's the size and spec someone wants it's an absolute bargain, hardly run in, have to feel sorry for the seller, looks like an expensive mistake! There's some top quality upgrades there, I wouldn't like to guess the cost...
Evan at that price potential buyers will need to be sure it's what they want, the short frame with straight bars wouldn't be for everyone, even less so with the current swept back ones (Though they're easily changed) It is very much expedition spec, if you start thinking you'd make a few changes a fair chunk of the savings could be eaten up. Or maybe not? There's a fair bit of sellable stuff included if you didn't need it.
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..., the short frame with straight bars wouldn't be for everyone, even less so with the current swept back ones ...
Good point on the size. Since I am not shopping for one, I did not even look at the size.
They did not make an S frame for the Mk II version when I bought mine. Since I use drop bars, I bought a 590M size, that fits me well but it shows a LOT of seatpost above the frame.
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That’s a great buy for some lucky, speedy person.
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..., the short frame with straight bars wouldn't be for everyone, even less so with the current swept back ones ...
Good point on the size. Since I am not shopping for one, I did not even look at the size.
They did not make an S frame for the Mk II version when I bought mine. Since I use drop bars, I bought a 590M size, that fits me well but it shows a LOT of seatpost above the frame.
I thought the S size on the nomad mk3 was the same thing as the M on the nomad mk2
Or am I getting confused ?
There is no M size on the nomad mk3 …. Why is that ?
Was there an S size on the mk2 ?
Sorry for so many questions 😵💫
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Great looking bike. Any idea of its suitability in terms of height / reach ?
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Great looking bike. Any idea of its suitability in terms of height / reach ?
I’m about 6 foot and would fit into three sizes , this size being the middle size of the three and probably the most comfortable
I think the owner went with the S size for comfortable riding and for a very relaxed upright position as shown in thorn literature
I have considered this type of posture, but I’m a bit concerned I won’t like it . And I have no way of testing it unless I travel hundreds of miles
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That’s a great buy for some lucky, speedy person.
Yup , that’l probably be snapped up fast
Thought about it myself but could be an impulse buy I might regret
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The Mk II brochure really stressed not having drop bars. The Mk III brochure also suggests that you should not have them but they reluctantly have said they make them in an S for those few that want them.
I bought the 590M for my Nomad Mk II because it had a top tube length about the same as my other bikes, that is one of the criteria I look at hardest, as you can adjust a seatpost for more up and down but there is not much ability to adjust reach other than length of stem, and that is only within a small range.
My Thorn Sherpa is a 610S. I have not compared the two bikes for geometry since I bought my Nomad Mk II, but if I recall they have about the same seatpost slope and same head tube angle, or about the same. So, on that basis I was mostly sizing my Nomad Mk II only by top tube length (or effective top tube).
I have no clue why they had an M size for the Mk II, but they did, but no S sizes.
After I bought it I became quite pleased that I had a slightly shorter (in height) frame for the Nomad over the Sherpa, as I do not know if I could have fit a larger frame in my S&S Backpack. That bike really fills up the case to the limit, but that includes the fork and Thorn says the fork will not fit in the case.
When I bought mine, they also had some X frames that had a bit less steel in the frame, mine was rated for 62kg capacity (excluding rider weight) and the same size X frame was 45kg. I did not look very hard at the X frames, so I can't say more other than they sold them out soon after I bought mine. All of their X frames in the catalog I was looking at when I bought mine (spring 2013) were size M, no L sizes.
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I guess it would be difficult to have a very relaxed riding position without a smaller size than the large ?
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I guess it would be difficult to have a very relaxed riding position without a smaller size than the large ?
Am I missing something here? A "very relaxed riding position" for me means near or at least much nearer upright (itself a rather loose word as for the protection of your spine you need to be a few degrees off perfectly perpendicular to the ground).
A near-upright position (with flat bars) then implies a shorter top tube than for drop bars/a flat back, plus possibly a different head-/seat-tube angle.
A near-upright, very relaxed position is possible on a longer top tube with a short stem and swept-back handlebars, the type called North Road being particularly ergonomically sound, especially if the seat tube and head tube angles are slack, say 67-68% to give your legs some leverage with your body nearer a straight line with the seat tube over the bottom bracket. Since the grips on the North Road type of bars point downwards rather than being parallel to the road, the length of the steerer tube also enters into the adjustment of the same frame for the rider's comfort.
On Thorn bikes of the immediately past era, if the rider bought the frame suggested for his height and preferred riding posture and chosen handlebars, most of the work was done for him by Thorn's plethora of thoughtful size/attitude/component combinations -- making the customer responsible only for sending in very specific and accurate body measurements. Basically, Andy Blance had eliminated a huge part of the mistakes made by would-cyclists whose bike end up hanging in the garage gathering dust.
My own opinion is not that all this makes the bike on Ebay under discussion a dicey buy, but that, if it is approximately right, the new owner can adjust it to his preferred riding position with a thoughtful choice of components, though under the restraint already mentioned that the cost of new components doesn't make it as expensive as ordering a new Thorn bike that fits perfectly out of the box. As examples, I have bikes of 55cm, 57cm, and 59cm, all bought as the nearest smaller available size to what would be ideal (it's a mistake to let a salesman talk you in a larger bike than you need) and ranging from rather quite small to 2m long overall, huge, all adjusted by component choices to the same rider (me) fitting them in exactly the same position to within an unnoticeable or at least easily assimilated 1mm. The key in each instance was an uncut, long steering tube or the availability of a steering tube extender of decent engineering probity, and quite a bit of patient tech sheet comparison, aided by old fashioned fit and try. An indispensable aid to such methods is a relatively long swiveling stem, which in conjunction with a long or lengthened steerer tube adjusts both the height and the reach to the handlebars before you take out your saw or angle grinder to cut the steerer tube; several of my bikes actually still have the adjustable stem fitted, because I haven't found a stem of exactly the correct fractional value in length and angle, or because the adjustable stem turns a foursquare commuter/touring bike into a record-setting racer at the flip of a lever. (In my younger days, I set my own ton-up, kph, downhill, truck-assisted, personal record with that stem putting the handlebar grips down beside the fork crown.)
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Andre
Excuse my ignorance, there’s lots of it haha
Thanks , yes that makes sense now. That’s definitely what I’d like to do , have a few frames of different sizes and stems and get my lab coat on and do some experiments to see what really works for me
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Got a reply from the bike owner and he explained why he went with the S frame was he didn’t want a super short stem . The S frame must work better for wiggle room /comfort /aesthetics etc
Bike is still for sale . In fact I think I saw it on Facebook marketplace for £2000
Not sure it’s the one for me , but it ticks a lot of boxes
It’s got andra 40 rims on it too, basically a tank
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It would be worthwhile re-reading the Thorn Touring Bike bible, particular page 25 onwards regarding sizing.
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It would be worthwhile re-reading the Thorn Touring Bike bible, particular page 25 onwards regarding sizing.
Absolutely, my memory can’t retain anything lol
I went back and read some of my old posts from the past to dredge up all the info I was hunting down to get it fresh in the old brain
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Not sure it’s the one for me , but it ticks a lot of boxes
How not sure are you?
IMO the seller has made a mistake by not splitting some of the accessories off for another sale, the luggage and the charging system in particular have a wide market and maybe don't add as much to the bike price. IMO and it is just that, I appreciate it's easier to spend other peoples money, that bike at that price isn't much of a gamble. As long as you didn't do something drastic (Like paint it black!) you'd get most if not all of your money back if it turned out not to suit. The original buyer has taken the big loss, the depreciation curve now flattens out.
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Just checking specs of this bike again and Sale has ended - sold?
Let’s all go to the pub, it’ll be a lot simpler :)
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/353798033672?hash=item5260019108:g:GY8AAOSwxathrOYS
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If Jagger was a bike tourer
I
See
A
Red
Bike
And
I
Want
To
Paint
It
B L A C K
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🎸🤘
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Not sure it’s the one for me , but it ticks a lot of boxes
How not sure are you?
IMO the seller has made a mistake by not splitting some of the accessories off for another sale, the luggage and the charging system in particular have a wide market and maybe don't add as much to the bike price. IMO and it is just that, I appreciate it's easier to spend other peoples money, that bike at that price isn't much of a gamble. As long as you didn't do something drastic (Like paint it black!) you'd get most if not all of your money back if it turned out not to suit. The original buyer has taken the big loss, the depreciation curve now flattens out.
How sure am I about being not sure ? Hmmm , I’m not sure lol
Well, looks like it’s sold … or the auction has ended so my mind could be made up for me now
I messaged him today and got a response , then messaged again but no response yet. Or maybe never will if it’s gone .
I’ve been having a really bad day today and your comment cheered me up and gave me a laugh. Thank you
“ As long as you didn't do something drastic (Like paint it black!)
You may be a complete stranger on a bike forum but at least you understand me 😊
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🎸🤘
😃
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I agree with André that changing components around can make a wide variety of frame sizes comfortable. As he says, the big exception is that you cannot do this with a frame that is too long or too high.
My Thorn Raven Tour, as advised by Thorn, is a 587S. This gives a good riding position (for me) with a long stem and flat handlebars, or with a much shorter stem and compact drop handlebars, which are my current choice.
Later I bought a 612S Raven Tour frame, which I set up as a utility bike. There is still plenty of stepover height for me on this bike, but I reckon it will be harder to mount than the 587S if age limits my agility.
My Raven Sport Tour 611S is also larger than recommended by Thorn.
All three of the above are easy to use.
During the 1980's I needed a semi-expendable bike to leave at the train station in the town where I was doing long-term professional training while I returned home for the weekend. I found an old, small "ladies" frame twin-lateral bike and adapted that with a long seatpost and a tall stem with a long extension. It wasn't as stiff as my "proper" bikes, but it was comfortable to ride. I ended up doing more than 35,000 kms with that bike, and when the twin laterals finally broke due to the stress of a young, fit and heavy rider I got my local bike shop to braze on a "top tube" so that I could continue riding the bike. I only scrapped it when the bodge-job top tube started cracking at the joints. Then I replaced it with another old (1950's ?) frame, "gents" version this time, that was theoretically a bit too small for me, which I have also used for more than 35,000 kms so far.
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I can confirm it’s sold
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Martinf
Have you ever tried a long Thorn frame ? Just wondering how you found it compared to your short frames if you have
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Though I have never ridden a Thorn with a long top tube, I owned a size 560S Sherpa Mk2, my Nomad Mk2 is a 590M and the bike so kindly loaned to me by a Forum member for my 2014 tour was a size 587S Raven Tour.
By adjusting cockpit length via different reach stems and drop handlebars with different reach/drop (in my case, Thorn-supplied Zoom Anatomic vs Bontrager compact) all these bikes were made to fit me within 1mm variance, essentially identical. My preferred back angle of 45° with hands atop the brake hoods and elbows slightly bent for shock absorption is the same as well All were fitted with 26 x 2.0 tires.
Although my contact points on the three bikes were the same, the Nomad's top tube is longest. It gives a feel of riding "in" rather than "on" the bike and I like it very much. My body, butt to hands, is wholly and equally within the wheelbase of the frame and it handles and steers very well.It also handles extreme loads easily the best of the three. While my camping gear is light, my extra weight comes from carrying a lot of food and water for my solo, self-supported desert tours, away from resupply. The bike handles well with or without a load. The Nomad has the shortest stem but the widest handlebars, so the moment arm/distance between my hands on the brake hoods and the center of the steerer is nearly the same as with narrower 'bars and a longer stem so steering and leverage are nearly the same as well.
My Sherpa did not have the Nomad's ultimate luggage capacity, and had the shortest top tube and longest stem of the three. It is a bit hard to compare due to variations in frame geometry including chainstay length and of course weight, but the Sherpa felt nipper in handling and the shorter top tube felt -- in contrast to my Nomad -- as if I were riding atop the bike and the longer reach stem felt more like a tiller.
The Raven Tour slotted in between in terms of feel...again hard to judge in terms of top tube length alone because there are many other variables at play that contribute to the overall feel and "flavor" of the bikes.
Of the three bikes, I appreciate the Nomad's more steeply sloped, lower top tube for the extra standover clearance it provides, of great value for me on deeply pothole roads, logging roads, and cross-country where I sometimes find myself dismounting into a hole in the road surface or ground and clearance becomes less generous.
Best,
Dan.
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Dan made a good point about different bars have different reach. When I built up my rando bike, I did not look hard at the bars as a variable, but the bars I put on that bike have about 1-2 cm more reach to the hoods than the other bikes I was using as my base for measurements. I could not find a good stem to make that adjustment, in the end moved my saddle a bit more forward to reduce but not eliminate the extra reach.
My folding bike has a geometry that is equivalent to a much shorter top tube, but on that bike I lower my handlebars, thus I can have my back at about the same lean angle as on my other bikes, but my arms are angled down more.
That said, for me to find a good fit on a bike, the top tube length reach to the bars is much more critical than the seat tube height where I can easily adjust the seatpost up and down.
The Nomad Mk II has a high bottom bracket, or at least it is high when I use 57mm tires. Thus, standover height would be a more important issue if the top tube was not as sloped as it is. Historically when top tubes were all horizontal, stand over height was a more important measure than it is on the sloping top tubes we have today. But if you had an unusually long torso and shorter legs, standover height might be a much more important factor to consider.
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>Have you ever tried a long Thorn frame ? Just wondering how you found it compared to your short frames if you have
No. But the old mountain bike I used as a heavy tourer before I got my first Thorn Raven Tour had a long top tube, very nearly the same length as the Nomad I was considering before being persuaded by Andy Blance at Thorn that a Raven Tour would be more suitable for my needs.
With drop bars I needed quite a short stem on that mountain bike. It performed OK, and was comfortable. The drawbacks compared to my Raven Tour were :
- the old racks I used were much less stiff than the Thorn racks on the Raven Tour,
- the mountain bike had a U-brake, strategically placed to spray water and sand onto the chain,
- the derailleur gearing. Partly due to the U-brake, but chain life was very short.
Big advantage was that it wasn't worth very much, so I didn't worry too much about theft when I locked it up somewhere.
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It looks like yet another bought too small frame. Pfffft. Looks like a silly small crank too.
Probably took 2 rides and thought this Rohloff is sooooo slow. LOL. It took mine 12,000 miles to loosen up.
That straight HB is an abomination as well. With a swept bar he could easily use a bigger frame.
My guess is he's 6'1".
I just don't understand how so many buyers seem to feel guilty of spending $5,000 and never ride it.
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He told me he was 5 ‘ 10” with long legs when I was messaging back and forth before it sold