Thorn Cycles Forum
Community => Rohloff Internal Hub Gears => Topic started by: Danneaux on August 28, 2013, 07:31:26 PM
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Hi All!
I recently received an email from Oliver Römer, principal of Tout Terrain with Stephanie Römer. Oliver tells me Tout Terrain are spinning-off their accessory business under a new name, Cinq5.
Henceforth, Tout Terrain accessory products will be branded "Cinq5" and will center on the further development of existing products as well as new ones. Cinq5's offerings will contain updates to familiar products, which I will cover in separate posts in the Lighting and Electronics boards' Battery Charging from a Dynamo child board ( http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=7171.0 ).
However, the most exciting news for the Rohloff Board is the Cinq5 Shift:R Dual trigger shifter for Rohloff, intended to fit straight or drop handlebars. Here is what Tout Terrain/Cinq5 have to say about it:
It is what many Rohloff Speedhub riders have waited for: The thumb shifter.
The Shift:R combines the legendary durability of the Rohloff Speedhub 500/14 with shifting comfort of a modern derailleur drive train system. Now some unique technical innovations allow you to choose a new ergonomic option for Speedhub
equipped bikes.
» EasyShift: The simplified shifting logic with separate levers for low and high gears makes it easy to get used to
» Improved ergonomics: with the Shift:R you can now use full-size grips on both hands
» Flexibility: The Shift:R can be used on multiple bar types, e.g. drop bars or conventional flat bars
» Easy adjustment and fine tuning through the EAS system: cable tension can easily be adjusted right at the shifters
» Easy installation: due to the ORS technology (Optimized remount sequence) the gear position of the Shift:R and the Speedhub don’t require synchronization
» Using ICM (Inverse Cable Mount) technology an extremely compact shifting mechanism can be integrated in the Shift:R box
It appears from the product photo (attached below) a modified EX shift-box may be involved, but this is unclear to me at present.
I presume pressing one trigger shifter down would move the other up and vise versa, given the hub's push-pull shifting action.
I will post a MSRP and availability dates as soon as available.
The Cinq5 website isn't fully live at present, but is available here: http://www.cinq5.de/
The Cinq5 Blog is here (German): http://cinq-five.blogspot.de/
The Cinq5 Blog GoogleTranslated to English: http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fcinq-five.blogspot.de%2F&act=url
The Cinq5 catalog may be viewed or downloaded in .PDF format here (German/English): http://www.cinq5.de/CINQ_DE_EN_FINAL_Katalog_web.pdf
Best,
Dan.
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Hi All!
In looking closely at the Cinq5 trigger shifters, I think it might be possible to place the triggers near the brake hoods on drop handlebars.
I'm not sure how weather sealing is handled at the point where the cables enter the housings; that remains a question for me at present.
Best,
Dan.
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Thanks, Dan, for all this -- I noticed the weather-sealing question as well. Surely designers based in N Europe have taken account of cold-wet-mucky?
J.
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Yes -- thanks, Dan. I guess they're showing this at Eurobike, so it popped up on my Twitter feed today also.
Here in Austin, weather sealing isn't a problem ;D
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Thanks Dan I like the look of them so much that i'll have to find out where to order from :o
Cost? It's only money!
Weather Sealing? who care's we have loads of Rain in New Zealand. NZ and OZ have the finest dust in the world!
Pete ;D
Who is Loving Cycling and working at One of the Top Cycle shop's in the World :-*
.
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If you are trying to set up near the hoods on drop bars, perhaps you need to fabricate a bracket on each side similar to the Kelley Take Offs. If you are not sure what they are, do an internet search
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Hi Dan any more on where to order from?
Anymore about how well they shift?
Looking great from Mountain Biking in the Mud! I have find that the new Rohloff shifter is not very good in the Mud (Too Round!) Old Rohloff shifter was far better in the Mud!
Pete Great to be working full time again and in a Cycle shop! :-*
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FYI, Rohloff announced a new shifter that should solve your problem (it is not only mud, but the same problem appear if you have wet hands from riding when raining, riding in hot conditions...):
(http://i76.servimg.com/u/f76/16/30/47/21/poigna10.jpg)
The new part is only the plastic/rubber part (you keep the remaining parts of your old shifter), compared to the Tout Terrain solution is is very cheap, it will cost ony 16€. All new Rohloff will be delivered with this new shifter.
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Oh, nicely found and shared, Fleur; thanks!
This cover looks very promising, and the price is surely right. So nice to see Rohloff continue to develop and refine the Speedhub and related components.
Rohloff detail the replacement procedure in a video here: http://www.rohloff.de/en/technology/workshop/videos/twist_shifter_grip_replacement/index.html
The rubber grip can be replaced without having to remove the shifter cables.
Best,
Dan.
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Where can this new grip be purchased? Not listed on SJS nor on bike24.
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I don't think it's been released yet, but I'm ordering one as soon as it is.
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Due for release in early 2014 we have been told.
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They are on the SJS website, delivery expected 04.10.2013 (thats the correct english date for American viewers).
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Very good.
:-)
Why can the people of the US of A not write the date right?
Pet......
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Old Ebeneezer here nearly choked on his gruel at the £250 price tag. ???
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Hi All!
Direct link for those who are waiting...
http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/cinq5-shiftr-thumb-shifter-for-rohloff-hubs-prod32695/
Best,
Dan.
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http://www.cinq5.de/CINQ_DE_EN_FINAL_Katalog_web.pdf
Page 16, its all there in photos
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Well you will have plenty of time to save up because they haven't got em. Took my order at sjs and nothing happened. Now eta is december/jan.
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Very good.
:-)
Why can the people of the US of A not write the date right?
Pet......
..............because they just have to be different.................they even drive on the wrong side of the road too !
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;D
We left-front brake on our bicycles, too.
;D
Go figure!
;D
Best,
Dan.
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;D
We left-front brake on our bicycles, too.
;D
Go figure!
;D
Best,
Dan.
Dan Dan Dan......
Why?
There is one good thing and that is all your Motorcycles have your front brake on the right SIDE!
You all get onto Horses from the Left hand side so Why get on from the middle of the road? this is why we all drive/ride on the left hand side of the road!
This is why the U.K were the 1st to set road rules about which side of the track/road to ride/drive before cars were Horses and in the U.K. like in the US people get onto horses from the left side off the footpath :o
Pete ;D
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because ,most people are right-legged.
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because ,most people are right-legged.
?
Pete
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This is why the U.K were the 1st to set road rules about which side of the track/road to ride/drive before cars were Horses and in the U.K
Pete ;D
Surely depends which way you're travelling?
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You all get onto Horses from the Left hand side so Why get on from the middle of the road? this is why we all drive/ride on the left hand side of the road!
This is why the U.K were the 1st to set road rules about which side of the track/road to ride/drive before cars were Horses and in the U.K. like in the US people get onto horses from the left side off the footpath :o
Pete ;D
I was going to say the same thing with the addition that motorcycles have their stands on the left hand side for the same reason.
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We English ride on the left so ones sword arm is not obstructed by the horses head when one meets a brigand coming the other way ;D
But on the canal we keep to the right?
Old Indian motorcycles in the US had left handed throttles so 'cycle cops could fire their pistols on the move ::)
I had a Jawa where the gear lever was also the kickstarter and it was on the right hand side.
Ian
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Old Indian motorcycles in the US had left handed throttles so 'cycle cops could fire their pistols on the move
My father had a couple of Indian moto-cycles back in the day, Ian! For a photo, see: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4523.0;attach=2419
The left-front braking thing here comes from riding on the right and using the left arm to signal turns. The idea being to have the rear brake controllable by the right hand, figuring the consequences of an unintended lock-up would be less severe occurring at the rear than on the front. Of course, 90% of my intentional braking is done with the front brake, it providing the best stopping power thanks to weight transfer.
Best,
Dan.
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A snazzy fellow!
I used to have my road bikes set up with left front brake, ('cos that's how the continental pros did it ::)) it did seem to make riding in a bunch safer....more modulation and less sudden if you grabbed a handful.
Nowdays I have a strong preference for rear braking..... not many people crash from losing the back end! And years of riding to survive on motorcycles has lead me to view the need for hard front braking as an error of judgement on my part.
On the wall of death the left throttled Indians allowed the rider to wave at the crowd as they went round anticlockwise. ;D
Ian
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8)
Pete
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I had a Jawa where the gear lever was also the kickstarter and it was on the right hand side.
It can be quite difficult (sometimes painful) to kick start a big engined bike that has the kickstart lever on the left, when you're used to it being on the right usually, certainly was for me anyway when it decided to kickback.
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I had a Jawa where the gear lever was also the kickstarter and it was on the right hand side.
Ian, are you sure your Jawa had its kickstarter/gearshift on the right? I had a 350 Jawa twin in the late 60's, with that same ingenious dual-function foot thingy, and I remember mine as being on the left side. Mind you, I was using that bike south of the Equator, so maybe its polarity was reversed, so to speak. Or maybe mine was...
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Polarised memory John. 'twas on the left as you say. :P
BMW sidecar outfits are hard to kickstart. Lever goes down and outward (rather than down and back) into the gap twixt bike and "chair".
Yamaha XT 550 appalingly hard to start. (especially if petrol not turned on ::)
A friend of mine was hospitalised by an XT500 with worn points......
Ian
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Hi All
Well as I have said before I havebeen a Motorcycle for over 30+ years! (O deer)
So said some old old motorcycle did have thl on the left hand side of the hanlebars BUT on the right hand side was the Avd/Ret (timeing adjustment)!!!
Jawa's! Started off being made in the CZ and ended up being made in Germay.. I have repaired newer Jawa and the kick strder and gear lever are on the left hand side! BUT you can fit the gear lever (only) can be fitted to the right hand side!
Also over tha years motorcycles have had the drive chain on the left and right hand side! Like on bicycles over the years! Yes this is ture! NEW bicycles had it on some BMX bikes.
We have a few for sale at work.
This is not the point! All over the World People get onto horses from the Left hand Side! All newer Motorcycles are desgined for you to get on from the Left hand side to!
Why get on from the mid of the road?
Do you all know that in parts of Europe you drive on the right hand side on the highways and Left hand side in the Towns! Yes mad but ture! the last in Europe was in the late 1970's
Pete...
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Back to the original post! My Raven is currently in build so will I get the new shifter or the old?
Ads
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Flat bar - old shifter.... but possibly wait to get the new version for better grip.
Drop bar - Tout Terrain's levers make some sense.
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My Raven is currently in build so will I get the new shifter or the old?
Hi Ads!
The decision as to which shifter to get can be a difficult one.
You could get the one most suited to your needs and preferences, use it as long as it functions, and if it somehow fails to meet expectations, then consider selling it on. Fortunately, the shifter is a separate part from the hub and you could always revert to the OEM Rohloff shifter if needed.
The downside of going with any aftermarket component with unique function is long-term serviceability and maintenance parts. Having gone this route in the past, I found such parts sometimes very ably addressed a need but at the cost of long-term repair and availability. I sometimes found parts were available for only a short time (if at all) and only in large, well-stocked shops with purchase contracts or direct from the manufacturer. I've seen enough of the CNC-billet aluminum craze in the late 1980s-1990s to be a bit cautious. A lot of businesses cropped up when CNC mills became inexpensively available, but sometimes the manufacturing method wasn't well-suited to the materials or designs and there was a greater incidence of failure than in forged parts available from larger, more well-established manufacturers.
I kept all this in mind when specifying which shifter to choose for my drop-'bar Nomad. I finally decided to go with the standard Rohloff shifter, reasoning it was well-shielded against weather and parts or a replacement would likely be available in some form as long as Rohloff remained in business. Rohloff has always been good about making any new products backward-compatible with older/existing products, so I reasoned this would work in my favor when it came to getting replacement rubber shifter grips, etc. The original works well for me, I'm happy, but did have to use some creativity in mounting it for use with my preferred drop handlebars.
Some questions to ask yourself about any Rohloff-compatible shifter might include:
• What are the mounting options? Can it be freely repositioned if needed?
• Is it well sealed against weather?
• Does it use standard cables, housings, and end ferrules?
• Is the diameter a comfortable size for your hand?
• How will it work in the wet, hot, or cold? Is the surface slippery?
• Are gear positions well-marked or marked at all? Is this important to me?
• Are replacement parts available?
• Are the complete units widely available?
Hope this helps.
Best,
Dan.
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Ain't gonna pull the trigger on something so pricey. Nope.
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Ain't gonna pull the trigger....
Hahaha!!! ;D
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Apologies if already posted but here are some photos of said Cinq 5 triggers
http://www.shandcycles.com/2013/09/03/toute-terrain-cinq5-rohloff-thumb-shifters/
Don't you just love yellow ;)
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Hi thanks I like the look more..
This is the best shifters I have seen for a Rohloff B-)
I may have to put my money down on a set....
Pete.........
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A dual -trigger would be welcome. The standard Rohloff gear changer has ruined my right glove index finger.
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Me to!
I would be buying a set if I did not have a newmountain bike coming..
How if Rohloff put more money into designing a better shifter ...
Pete
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I'm wondering why people are calling this system "trigger shifters." I would have said that, by definition, trigger shifters are ratcheting shifters where the levers return to position after a shift, with the levers thus always being in the same place before use.
These shifters are IMHO really dual, opposed thumb shifters. Moving one will move the other in the opposite direction, the lever positions will NOT be constant, and I wonder if the levers might not be hard to reach in certain gears, as is the case with thumb shifters. At least the various grip shifters are always in the same place relative to one's hand...
Later,
Stephen
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I would have said that, by definition, trigger shifters are ratcheting shifters where the levers return to position after a shift, with the levers thus always being in the same place before use.
Which by definition are virtually impossible to run with the Rohloff as it relies on two opposing cables. Trigger shifters require a spring tensioning of the cable to function (to hook into the ratchet, and to release the cable).
At least the various grip shifters are always in the same place relative to one's hand...
Correct. I'd very much agree this is the best option.
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Hi Stephen!
There is also the Cresswell Ovo ratcheting shifter described more fully in this thread:
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=6541.0
Like the Cinq5 shifters, the Cresswell does not return to its starting point for the reasons Pete (Il Padrone) described (it is due to the Rohloff's pull-pull cable action). It does, however, have buttons and a ratchet to allow it to change direction...and will still remain where placed rather than returning to its starting point as would a true "trigger shifter" as you've correctly defined it.These shifters are IMHO really dual, opposed thumb shifters. Moving one will move the other in the opposite direction, the lever positions will NOT be constant, and I wonder if the levers might not be hard to reach in certain gears, as is the case with thumb shifters.
Exactly! ;D Some bike parts are named popularly rather than correctly.
Best,
Dan. (...who has yet to see a truly "free" wheel. Most are captured in bike frames and cost money ;D )