Thorn Cycles Forum
Community => Non-Thorn Related => Topic started by: Matt2matt2002 on March 17, 2013, 09:03:02 PM
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Just had my 7th ride out on the Raven.
All Tarmac country roads, well known to me, minimal traffic.
All with out a bell!
I moved things over from my Dawes Sardar and unintentionally left the bell behind.
So far I haven't missed it but it did occur to me I might need it. But then again on the 7 rides so far I have never required it.
Thoughts on bells, folks.
Legal? Sensible? Over-rated? Alternatives?
Matt
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I use my bell a lot. Coming down a long hill just to scare the deer away. Coming up behind somebody walking their dog. Coming up alongside parked vehicles where maybe somebody has the door open & is unbuckling their child.
I have an old bell probably early 80's or so. It was in one of my ancient old parts bags. Works good enough!
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Never used one in my life, first thing I ditch....
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Pete (Il Padrone) has a nice one that snuggles next to his left grip, nicely mirroring the Rohloff grip-shifter on the other side.
Since you're not using drops, this "stealthy bell" option is open to you as well!
Best,
Dan.
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Legally required here.
Mostly used on bike paths to warn pedestrians.
Pointless in road traffic, but so is a kickstand :P
I rode without a bell for many years, but since I have one fitted now, I do find it very valuable for those bike path and railtrail rides that I do.
[edit] The one on my Thorn Nomad is the Mirrycle Incredibell Grip bell
(http://www.ikd21.co.jp/ikd/items/img/l426.jpg)
I do also really like the big "Avon-calling" gleaming low-rider bell on my Shogun roadster
(http://www.getprice.com.au/images/uploadimg/796/_1_2204130.jpg)
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Hi All!
Surely everyone who has read Matt's topic title is familiar with this old joke?
http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071105143935AAXD2y9
This is the more common variation:
http://shaggy-dogs.briancombs.net/270/the-classic-tale-of-quasimodos-bell-ringer
Best,
Dan. (...who thinks it would be funnier if the setup wasn't so long)
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i got a bell from bikepacker exactly like the second one you posted heavy beast but a nice ring. ;D ;D
dan sent me a nice brass one i have that on the Raleigh.
good to have on the bike i reckon. ;)
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The main use I find for a bell is letting other cyclists know when you are approaching them from behind.
Did not ride with one for years but now find it invaluable
Andy
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Did not ride with one for years but now find it invaluable
Andy
I could say the same thing about my mirror.
I have Humbert bars so,the incredibell would be hard to fit? I guess it slides onto the end of the bar?
The web site does not make the fitting clear.
Does it ring by twisting or pinging?
Matt
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I have Humbert bars so,the incredibell would be hard to fit? I guess it slides onto the end of the bar?
The web site does not make the fitting clear.
Does it ring by twisting or pinging?
To the contrary. You'd just slide it on between your left grip and the brake lever and tighten it up. It is a twist-ring - maybe a little tingy to my liking (why I like the cruiser bell's "Avon-calling" tone*) but very handy.
* Sounds like this (http://youtu.be/YbbzUmLJykk) ;)
Did not ride with one for years but now find it invaluable
The same could be said about three of my handy bike accessories - each of which were discarded in my late teens as "too dorky man!"
Kickstand, bell, and mirror.
The mirror was the one I picked up again earliest - I have been using one for 'traffic management' since about 1981, when I was 23 yo. The kickstand and bell have been much more recent re-discoveries.
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And dont forget mudguards too. Pulled them straight off my 86 Raleigh Medale along with the rear rack, and then there is spoke reflectors which I have taken off bikes relgiously for years and years and then am now buying them (albeit in a different style) to put back on again
Andy
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yes ... a bell. I share il padrone's bell taste in the Mirrycle Incredibel ...
http://www.mirrycle.com/gripbell.php (http://www.mirrycle.com/gripbell.php)
I obtained one directly from the company but in the silver/grey colour. My old ping bell just was not loud enough to warn pedestrians when approaching from behind. They used to jump out their skin as they heard the bell at the last minute. The Incredibell works well giving plenty of warning thus avoiding the pedestrian users of the shared cycle/walking path leaping into the air!
I suppose I could always cough, shout, 'say hello', or 'bike coming watch out' or whistle, but the Incredibell has such a friendly ring! (see link above). I prefer it. Built into the handlebar grip means that it does not obviously look like a bell. For those planning to tour in countries where you are constantly surrounded by groups of kids it would be ideal. Reading some touring blogs, they all seem to want to ring the bell!
Matt - I found it very easy to fit on the Thorn Comfort bars. It pings internally when you twist it if that makes sense.
Bells must be fitted at the point of sale but there is no legal requirement to have one on a bike in the UK (except Northern-Ireland and the Isle of Man) ...
http://www.ctc.org.uk/cyclists-library/regulations/safety-regulations (http://www.ctc.org.uk/cyclists-library/regulations/safety-regulations)
I would keep one on a bike as if you are ever in a collision with a pedestrian, and they decide to take legal action, they may claim a lack of due care and attention or some other wooly British legal term if you did not have a bell fitted (I am not a lawyer though!).
While searching for the legal status of bike bells in the UK I found this ...
ISOBEL ASKS: IS A BELL NECESSARY ON A BICYCLE? BIKEHUB ANSWERS: MAYBE BUT IT’S NOT A LEGAL REQUIREMENT
At the point of sale (ie shops) bikes have to be fitted with bells but there is no legal requirement for them to be fitted to bicycles no longer on shop display. [NOTE: thanks to the Coalition Government's Red Tape Challenge this requirement will be history soon but, for now, is still in force).
The Highway Code does not stipulate that bells must be used. It states: "Be considerate of other road users, particularly blind and partially sighted pedestrians. Let them know you are there when necessary, for example by ringing your bell."
Another 'audible warning device' is the human voice: a polite 'excuse me' can often come across as a lot less aggressive than the apparently insistent tinkling of a bell. However, 'angry of Tunbridge Wells' type letters to newspapers continue to insist that cyclists - from church-hopping old maids to downhill mountain-bikers - ought to use bells, despite the fact their use often scares the bejesus out of pedestrians.
On the Continent, the use of bells is more widespread and pedestrians do not leap out of their skin when they hear a bicycle bell behind them. Perhaps, in time, the use of bicycle bells in the UK will once again mean cyclist approaching, please don't move to the side rather than oi, cyclist coming, get out of my way.
The full, sometimes amusing, article ...
http://www.bikehub.co.uk/featured-articles/cycling-and-the-law/ (http://www.bikehub.co.uk/featured-articles/cycling-and-the-law/)
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Then there is of course this bloke's use of the bell (http://youtu.be/k7oGk-ozhKI). Certainly demonstrates to me that some people respond much better to a bell ring than to a spoken voice.
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[Matt, you may want to see the last go-'round on bells; there's some good links: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4118.0 ]
Perhaps, in time, the use of bicycle bells in the UK will once again mean cyclist approaching, please don't move to the side rather than oi, cyclist coming, get out of my way.
This is the classic dilemma I face when closing on pedestrians here. I was summarily dressed-down for giving a single <ding> of my bell yesterday, and was told it a) scared the dog, b) annoyed the owner, c) was rude in the extreme, and d) was totally unnecessary. I rang in advance, rather than waiting till I was right behind.
Also, it seems a number of people have hearing losses in the very same frequencies as my bells ring (I have a collection: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4118.msg18672#msg18672 ) If they seem oblivious, it is because they can't hear it! Lower tones are a real help in this case.
On the other hand, if I politely say "Passing on your left", about half the people will suddenly dart left as if jolted with electricity!
I am beginning to think having a multi-ring bell -- and using it starting at a distance might be a) more annoying but b) less frightening/startling/effective.
Loved the "bell troll" video Pete just posted!
Best,
Dan.
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This is what you need:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001NGD5ES/ref=asc_df_B001NGD5ES1680980?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&tag=dealt1-20
A fantastic and old design but definelty the solution to the problem of scarring people. Just set it working 100 meter up the road
Andy
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This is what you need...
Andy! Yay!
You re-found the PowerBell! They went missing for a time. I started looking for one of these when they were actually produced in New York and never did get one. The inventor's original site went down, then a Youth Project that was selling them ran out, and then....
I wanted one of these in the worst way for my maroon bike. Ever since I saw something similar on Jim Cunningham's Singer at CyclArt ( http://www.cyclart.com/ ), the desire has been burning, Man. Just think how nicely that might be made to fit the Thorn's bottle dyno mounts...!
Ah!
All the best,
Dan. (...who still dreams of one, even if they aren't quite the same in sound or quality as the Original PowerBell)
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Maybe a dynamo driven electronic bell may be the modern day equivilent
Andy
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I am beginning to think having a multi-ring bell -- and using it starting at a distance might be a) more annoying but b) less frightening/startling/effective.
Dan,
I use a rotating bell which I keep rotating from well back until I get a response or have passed them by.
Single ping bells just don't seem get through to most walkers with dogs.
Julian.
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Perhaps the ultimate single-pinger...and at €76, it ought to be!
The Van Nicholas CNC'd Ti bell: http://www.vannicholas.com/componentsdetails.aspx?id=114&type=vntitanium
31.8mm clamp diameter only.
Best,
Dan.
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This is getting Pavlovian...
J.
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This is getting Pavlovian...
J.
As the OPer of this thread may I bring it back to topic please? ;)
Without a bell, what is the correct shout out to warn incomers?
Please bare in mind this is a family site.
:D
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Right, Matt. Mea culpa.
Bell-less, wot to do? "Bazwaldo's dream-spec Nomad" thread overlaps/chimes in, as it were, so let me replay my comment from that:
One finds that there's usually an etiquette with bells -- I learned in the Netherlands this past autumn, for example, that it's Bad Form to ring them too much/too insistently/too whatever. Some places, they barely seem to exist--riding in the environs of New York City was astonished to see how few there were. Scared the hell out of me, but then, I'm just a country boy adrift in the big city.
I depend on my Incredibell--mostly to alert others to my presence, in a discreet, Canajan sort of way. Especially useful, maybe even critical, on mixed-use paths. In Austria, on the Donauradweg, I even had wandering tourist pedestrians thank me for using the bell.
On the other hand: Walking in Berlin with my daughter, and being a bumbling auslander not alert to the etiquette and the markings on the sidewalk (pavement) (trottoir), I was dismayed to hear, not a tinkling wee bell when I was in the way (unwittingly) of a fraulein on a big city bike, but "Aus dem weg! Aus dem weg!" I said, "Chill, babe, how serious can it be?" This had no discernible effect, but I felt, well, justified after a fashion, 'cos she didn't have a bell, nor even a whistle.
Bells are valuable where bikes & pedestrians mix...cows know this too, of course--they wear bells 'cos their horns don't work.
Cheers,
J.
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how about one of these as a bell alternative
Plastimo-Mini-Trump-fog-Horn
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Plastimo-Mini-Trump-fog-Horn/dp/B000WISPYS?&tag=rnwff-20
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As the OPer of this thread may I bring it back to topic please? Without a bell, what is the correct shout out to warn incomers?
Hi Matt!
Here, where we drive on the right, the expected phrase when closing on a pedestrian is "Passing on your left!"...at which point one of two things happens:
1) The person invariably steps left, directly into one's path
...or...
2) The person crosses the path from left to right, again directly in front of one.
The behavior is not unlike that of the common red squirrel when crossing the street -- back, then forth, then back'n'forth-- in front of an oncoming automobile.
Oh! A third response frequently ensues, where the pedestrian, angered at having their reverie broken, lets the notifying cyclist know that in no uncertain terms.
I've had the best luck so far with my Cheeky Parrot squeeze horn mounted on the handlebars of my tandem (yes, those are friction/indexed thumbshifters on drop handlebars). See this thread on warning devices: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4118.0 Children of all ages seem to enjoy it's cheery "Eeep!" and actually smile in response. Full details and a photo of my ever-growing bell colllection here: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4118.msg18672#msg18672
I put the parrot on the bike as a sort of joke, but it has proven to be my most effective warning device -- much better than "Passing on your left!"
Most "racer-types" on my local paths practice The Way Of The Silent Assassin and simply carve through pedestrian traffic at speed. Horrifying afterwards if one is walking, but it does reduce the unpredictable behavior of those who hear a warning first.
Best,
Dan. (...who now understands why people are sometimes described as "squirrely": http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/squirrelly)
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I've had this conversation locally.
Cycle bells are either not heard or have the adverse direction effect.
I usually go "excuse me" to notify people of my presence if the bell is not noticed.
If somebody surprises me last moment by stepping out right in front more...er...direct words may be uttered.
In Netherlands the cyclists just drive over you, so everybody is attuned to the sound of them ;D
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I've had this conversation locally.
Cycle bells are either not heard or have the adverse direction effect.
I usually go "excuse me" to notify people of my presence if the bell is not noticed.
If somebody surprises me last moment by stepping out right in front more...er...direct words may be uttered.
In Netherlands the cyclists just drive over you, so everybody is attuned to the sound of them ;D
Hi your right on two things
!st Bike Bells I Mountain Unicycled for years along cycle ways (and a Unicycle makes No noise) if I called out the walkers would step in front of me (and down I would go) I mounted a bell off my Camlbak and it worked very well ;D
2nd Netherlands? was always fun 8) watching my PAX (Passage's) walk along cycle lanes and getting Hit ;) (we did talk the PAX not to walk in the bike lanes)
Pete
8)
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For many years I did ride without a bell. To let others know I was approaching I used to just whistle an inane tune (I'm a crap whistler). It generally seemed to work surprisingly well.
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Whistle Duelling Banjos or March of the Empire? ;D