Author Topic: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?  (Read 37585 times)

il padrone

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #105 on: September 07, 2013, 02:14:38 am »
I find my knees just don't get along with the lateral heel-out-release against strong spring tension of most Shimano clipless pedals,

Dan, you must be kidding surely ?? Shimano SPD pedals/cleats have quite low spring tension, if you have the tension backed off. Much lower than their road shoes and a good deal lower than my Time pedals which I much prefer over Shimano for a couple of other reasons.

Maybe you have the tension screw tightened up ??

Danneaux

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #106 on: September 07, 2013, 04:27:38 am »
Quote
Dan, you must be kidding surely ??
'S'truth, Pete. I eventually tried no fewer than six different Shimano SPD pedal models, and it wasn't until I tried the T400/T700 with the tension dialed to minimum combined with their included multi-release cleats that the knee pain eased and eventually subsided. I never had it in 35 years with my Dettos and Pavarin cleats (up and back to release), but I sure did have it with the other SPD pedals that had stronger springs and required a heel-out lateral release, at least when used with my new Shimano MO88 shoes. I even had it when the tension was dialed to minimum and I used multi-release cleats.

The main component was the heel-out release, but the spring tension of the SPD pedals was a huge factor as well, even with the multi-release SPD cleats. I've got to tell you, it really hurt inside my knees, a deep bone-ache and bad. I gave up entirely on them for a bit, then sat on the bike without riding and tried releasing from the pedals and after about three tries -- BAM! -- massive knee pain again; that seems to be what caused it. I gave up riding entirely for about three weeks, during which time my knees felt wobbly and sore when walking and getting out of a chair, about the way they did after the long-ago car accident, and it scared me plenty.

After resting from riding completely and returning to the T400s with the same cleat position as before, again no problem! As soon as I tried another of the other SPDs, the pain returned immediately, so I have to say that in my case and for my knees, I just couldn't stand to use "normal" SPDs even with minimum tension and MR cleats, and had problems until I discovered the T400/T700 pedals also with the tension dialed to minimum on both sides of both pedals and MR cleats. Spring tension that is acceptable or minimal for others sure doesn't seem to work for me.

I'd never heard of others similarly affected till I read the product reviews for Shimano's SPD pedals on Amazon and various vendors' sites, the comments written by people with prior knee injuries or knee surgery or knee replacements reported finding relief in the T400/T700 line with those pedals' greatly reduced engagement/release tension. I guess I must fall into that same category, 'cos I sure had problems with standard SPDs that resolved entirely with the T400/T700 pedals (identical except for a few grams, cage shape, and an XT-level bearing/spindle assembly on the T700).

There's a good in-depth review of the T400s on BNA here: http://www.bicycles.net.au/2013/03/shimano-click-r-commuter-cycling-pedals/

The downsides? They look dumb to other riders (who won't mind telling you so) and they are *heavy*, though not as bad as one might think compared to others like the popular M324. REI actually weighs a range of samples then averages the results, so here's how the T-pedals stack up against other Shimano SPD pedals they carry:
315g - A520
346g - M540
380g - M520
383g - A530
398g - XTR M985
457g - T700
472g - M424
507g - T400
530g - M324

By the way, a new version is available with the T400/T700 pop-up, low-tension cleat on one side and a plain platform on the other and is called the Shimano Click'R PD-T420. See: http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/shimano-pd-t420-click-r-pedal/rp-prod108681 They seem to be very popular among German bike-trekkers.

Best,

Dan. (...who thinks T400/T700 pedals aren't for everyone but sure worked for him when others hurt his knees)

JWestland

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #107 on: September 10, 2013, 10:16:15 am »
I recently started cycling with old school straps/pedals on my vintage bike (let's face it, SPDs would look "cack" on it) and there's nothing as floaty as that!

Turns out my left foot is more rotated than the right one when comfortable (damaged a tendon in my hip on the left some 5 years ago) so it doesn't surprise me that SPDs take some fiddling/trying out even though in theory they should fit everybody.
Pedal to the metal! Wind, rain, hills, braking power permitting ;)

Danneaux

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #108 on: September 10, 2013, 01:36:56 pm »
Are you using "vintage"* shoes with slotted cleats as well, Jawine? If you could get 'hold of some Sidis or such (Dettos even better!), you'd get the full experience. Perhaps some Alfredo Binda Extra toe straps, too!

Best,

Dan. (*...who feels "old" 'cos he remembers when "vintage" meant "contemporary")
« Last Edit: September 10, 2013, 02:39:04 pm by Danneaux »

JWestland

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #109 on: September 10, 2013, 02:22:03 pm »
Can't find vintage shoes in my size...I can look again but can be top ££££

Toeplates are a bit of a liability in traffic though...I'm not pulling straps up either, need to be able to get out in a jiffy when needed.

Alfredo Binda blue straps on Campagnolo SR pedals. The titanium axle ones. Unfortunately left one is on the way out...been eying up e-bay for ages now but top $$$
Pedal to the metal! Wind, rain, hills, braking power permitting ;)

NZPeterG

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #110 on: November 24, 2013, 04:39:34 am »
Well at last I got a pair of Speedplay Frog Pedals.
Fitted Friday Night and test ride today and All Good so far.......
The only SPD still made that you cam shim up to help with my left leg being 10mm longer then my right leg..

Pete..



 
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Danneaux

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #111 on: November 24, 2013, 04:54:39 am »
Wonderful news, Pete, and bound to help many of us who are not completely symmetrical.

My Shimano T400 Click'R pedals are still working fine for me, mostly 'cos I don't have to use the heel-out movement to release. That just killed my knees regardless of tension. With the T400s, I can set minimal tension and can do either tiny heel-in or roll-the-ankle movements to release with no effort or pain; attached solid as can be otherwise -- Yay!

I really wanted some Speedplays and fingered them longingly in the store, but found they just weren't compatible with my knees. 'Sure like the design, though.

Best,

Dan.

NZPeterG

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #112 on: November 24, 2013, 05:03:25 am »
All Good Dan,
Please note that the 20 degree's to get out can be adjusted by adjusting the angle of the shoe part in 10 degrees and then you only have 10 degrees to unclip.

No Spring loading and foot move easy




Pete . . .

« Last Edit: November 24, 2013, 05:08:56 am by NZPeterG »
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JWestland

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #113 on: November 25, 2013, 03:44:51 pm »
My left side is "wonky" i think...pedaling just not as stable as right side.

I tore a hip tendon years ago, that may have done it. At least I'm not a horse so I don't need shot...

Bike fits are good for any issues, but alas very expensive in UK, £200.
Pedal to the metal! Wind, rain, hills, braking power permitting ;)

cycling4chapatis

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #114 on: December 14, 2013, 08:38:19 am »
Just a general touring shoe recommendation:

We both use SPD pedals for commuting and touring (Shimano PD-A530). While the flat/ non-cleat side only gets rare use, it's still nice to have for quick rides round the corner or if a mud-fest of the African back-country makes cleats all bugged up. Can heavily recommend them. Both of ours have done somewhere above 10,000k and are still going strong, minor surface scratches aside.

I have a couple of Specialized mountain biking shoes, which both do a great and comfortable job (one of them with the Specialized inserts to stop getting numb toes on long hilly rides on my road bike). While walking around with them off the bike is ok, it's not super-comfy due to the obviously stiff build. The other thing is that with having wonky feat, I walk off the outer back of the heels. I've glued pieces of old brake pads on them to stem otherwise perfectly ok shoes from going to unusable toast, but I only got onto that when it was a bit too late, so they keep coming off (lack of flat surface for good gluing). The shoes I'm looking into for our upcoming 1 year touring trip are the ones my partner has had for 6000km in Europe/ Africa and then the same again in commuting since: Lake mountain biking/ SPD shoes with vibram soles. Despite their use they are in great shape and the vibram sole keeps them from wearing out from walking on them. Can heavily recommend them for touring! Don't get confused by photos showing them with two massive spike cleats at the front, they can be optionally screwed in (like football/ soccer cleats) for cyclocross etc. Without those the bolt heads are up from the sole around it, so don't touch the ground.

Re knee pain from un-clipping: know the feeling. Way to avoid is to a) have tension right down, b) a drop of chain lube on the spring and c) not too loose shoes (if they are too loosely closed you have to jerk harder to get out; shoes comfortably snug reduces the play between foot, shoe and pedal, which lowers jerk required to get free.

Cycling shoes are for cycling, even ones with MTB vibram soles. If you want comfy shoes for walking around town/ camp/ hiking while touring you're better off with another pair. That said, after both logging a pair of hiking boots all the way through Africa and only wearing them once (!) - basic lesson from touring: on your days off the bike motivation for exertion is...minimal. We got sore legs only from days of walking rather cycling! For our next trip we're going with said SPD cleats/ sturdy outdoorsy trainers and flip-flops/ thongs.

Relayer

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Re: Clipless cycling shoes/pedals for touring: Suggestions?
« Reply #115 on: January 28, 2014, 01:14:29 pm »
I have been using Shimano MT (Mountain Trail I think) MTB SPD shoes for some years now and I have been very happy with them.

However last year I did a lot of cycling on my audax bike and this led to me reverting to lycra cycling shorts as opposed to baggy MTB shorts which I use with my RST. The only / minor downside to this was that I always felt the somewhat chunky look and weight of the MT shoes looked a bit silly with lycra shorts - but I wouldn't consider returning to road shoes and Look cleats ... been too long and I'm not fast enough for those any more! I had given up looking under 'touring shoes' ages ago because there was never anything SPD compatible available except MTB style shoes, but it seems that things have changed!

Last week I discovered some new lines of very smart looking SPD touring shoes, which look very similar in style to traditional touring shoes with a slim shape, but also with 2 or 3 velcro straps to add a kinda roadie look.

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/shimano-rt32-spd-shoes-black-prod26728/

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/shimano-rt82-spd-shoes-black-prod26727/

But then I found a pair of Specialized BG Sport Touring shoes with 30% off!  :o

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/specialized/bg-sport-touring-shoe-ec025555

These arrived today and first impressions are great, they seem to have a stiffer sole than the MT shoes which almost brings back the feeling of riding with rigid soled roadie shoes, but ones you can walk easily in. They are a neat fit and well ventilated, I can't wait for springtime when I will be getting them out regularly.  ;D

Jim (... whose Shimano MT61 shoes are great for winter time)