In light of Thorn now offering bikes with Shimano hub gears here's a brief review of my mum's Koga Alfine 11 bike.
My parents love cycling in weekends, and have always cycled Dutch Roadster inspired bikes, eg full mudguards, "sit up and beg" position. I got a chance to try my mum's Koga Signature for an hour cycle with my dad.
I will share my opinion on how both bikes feel for people that are looking to find the right bike. As I ride different types of bikes (fixed, XTC, old roadster) too.
My Thorn XTC setup: Sun CR18 rims, Derailleur Triple, Drop bars (steel and 26" wheels). No suspension. Avid Short Canti's. Around 14 KG with Shimano dynohub and LED lights. Semi sporty position.
My mum's Koga: A modified Comfort City with option to carry low-riders.
Alumium triple butted frame, small travel suspension in fork just underneath head tube, Maguara hydralic brakes. About 18KG. Sit up and beg position.
The test ride.
The Thorn normally get taken for 30 minute rides to work on reasonably potholed roads.
I went cycling with my dad on Dutch roads/cycle lanes which where very smooth therefore I can't say if the suspension on the Koga was needed...the roads were too good!
The extra weight of the Koga wasn't much noticeable on starting. But it was much more "sluggish" in acceleration than the XTC. 4KG weight on top of the XTC is a factor possibly. The small travel suspension fork may have had something to do with this also.
I don't think the tires/rims had anything to do with it, wheels felt very reactive and rolled well.
I didn't notice any drag or gaps in shifting (the infamous Rohloff 7/8 gear shift) or noise with the Alfine 11. No sound of the sprockets engaging like on a triple. So it's silent (which you get used to, as you need to relearn the engagement point there's no click to help you)
It handled very well and overall the finish of it is very well, welds are tiny for alu, paintwork is very well done, rims are excellent and my dad told me that compared to his 8 years old Alu Batavus the frame is much more stiff. Overall a quality bike clearly.
Overall to me the bike felt very comfortable but "dead". The suspension dampens the road and slows acceleration by pushing weight forward and stomping (as the fork goes down first...) and the frame is very stiff which is ideal, shifting was light and easy and the bike happily rolled along and steered well. Just a tad slower than my XTC.
Position
A sit up and beg position is comfortable but has the downside of catching a bucketload of wind, and because you cannot pull against the bars (which you can if bars are roughly saddle height or lower) you don't have an optimal position for power/speed.
My personal preference therefore still is about 45 degrees forward (semi sporty) as that bit of extra power is nice to have for hills/long rides and dipping down is handy if there's a lot of wind (which we get in NL).
But of course it also depends on the state of your back/neck/wrists. If no problems, a semi sporty may be fine. But if you really want 0 weight on your wrists a sit up may be best for you.
Rims
The Koga rims roll very well, and even though the bike isn't a lightweight at 18KG is rolls away quickly. It's hard to compare "feel" as mine are 26" Koga are 700c but the wheels felt very good.
They are Koga branded Exal light rims. A Shimano dynohub is fitted to the LED light system (which is what I use for winter)
Gears
Shimano Alfine 11 VS Shimano Triple.
Well. It both works! I grew up on 3 speed SA hub gears and they're the ultimate practical gears.
Speed wise, I noticed the *very occasional* slow shift on the Alfine. There was no drag or dead points in shifting, or any noise.
If you travel with your bike or have to cycle extreme mucky/snow conditions I'd go for a hub gear. If you commute and often need to change gear or have to park in overful cycle racks (NL comes to mind) again hub gear. And hub gears have the advantages of being knocks and transport (no bent derailleur hangars)
Some members here have to cycle in -20 celsius conditions with a lot of snow and noticed their Rohloffs kept going while derailleurs seized. As the hub is basically an oil bath temperature is less critical, nothing can seize. And you don't have to clean grot of your sprockets every week (or more often) when the rain and grit season hits.
Derailleurs are often a bit cheaper and easier to get, and can be repaired on the road. As unfortunately when a hub gear does go belly up (very very rare to have a total failure though) unless you have a Rohloff you're a bit stuck. However, you are more likely to get a bust derailleur hangar than a full failure.
If you have to shift under pressure, you need a deraileur as hub gears don't like being shifted under pressure, you need to keep the pedal moving but can't put hard force through either the gear jams or it goes, but in the long run it wear it down much quicker.
Hub gear wheels are not dished which is good if you need to go on insanely bad roads.
Brakes
Maguru hydralics are more powerful than my canti's. A good set of V-brakes does the job for a lower price. Hydralics may be overkill unless you go down very steep descents. And they eat your rim a bit more than standard Vs, so you may then need tungsten rims. If in doubt you really need hydralics, I would just go for V-brakes/canti's.
Weight
So for the extra weight the Koga offers: Mud guards (nice if you don't like lycra or stuffing your pants in your socks) a suspension travel fork, AXA lock and fender lights. And I would say a little bit more material in the frame, as it can carry 140KG (rider plus luggage) the XTC info for my 525L frame I have is 20KG and rider, I'd say 120 maybe 140. *some people noticed XTC can flex a tad with a heavy rider I am a light person at 61 KG mark*
Of course a Sherpa or another tourer with a heavier steel frame means more load carrying.
Suspension
The roads were simply too good. I think a small travel fork might actually be very nice on the potholed UK roads. Rollsplit for example is an absolute wrist killer on long rides.
But...you can also put on fat tires on your bike. I would try fat tires VS the suspension if unsure. Both carry a performance penalty: Tires as they're harder to accelerate, suspension as you lose a bit of pedal power due to fork travel.
Budget wise putting fatter tires on your steed is cheaper than having to change forks.
The Verdict
Well...as always budget is often a starting factor. The Rohloff was 850 euros extra for 3 more gears and a slightly longer range. And Alfine may just be fine. Of course Thorn does offer a Rohloff on expedition tourers due to their excellent breakdown service.
I would personally not get suspension unless it's a must, eg a lot of muddy and rocky roads too poor for the cyclocross brigade, as I don't like the feel of it.
Alu VS Steel is a very very old "no no" debate on cycle forums. It's impossible to decide unless you compare the exact two bikes one in alu, one in steel. But you can't as generally forks are steel on tourers, or suspension. Alu cannot be fixed without specialist tools, hence Thorn offers steel only. Koga offers a frame replacement service on their Traveller expedition tourers to make up for this.
I like the feel of steel, how it eats up road buzz and has a lively feel. But again the XTC is a high quality frame, and I've never ridden a high quality all alu bike and some people don't like steel at all, as for them the frames flex too much. Koga frame is excellent quality but don't know...aestethics wise the thinner steel tubing is what I prefer.
The extra chainguard etc. are nice. But again, some people love "no frills" bikes and some people like extra.
Verdict
I would ride an XTC with an Alfine hubgears are good no oiling, regular cleaning, chain stretch and no ARGH ORANGE SPROCKETS during salting season in winter... And an Axa lock is good thing too.
The rest well, I rather stuff my trousers in my sock and have clip-ons instead of extra weight. I did notice that 4KG extra/suspension is slowing down acceleration and it's not great on hills either.
As for you, well...what do you want to do? A Sherpa is fine all round tourer or maybe you want to get a Thorn built with Alfine (see the workshop sales) as you like hub gears...or hate cleaning
What is your back/neck like, do you like a bit of speed or want more comfort?
Do you need to carry 20KG or 60?
Questions question...after you decided on the rides you do, if the bike feels right for you then go for it, else there's the money back/test rides at Thorn
