Author Topic: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same  (Read 19495 times)

StuntPilot

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #30 on: October 19, 2012, 02:17:47 PM »
There is also a picture showing the Safety Wing extended - great for keeping safe as the darker days and nights roll in!

Danneaux

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #31 on: October 19, 2012, 05:25:31 PM »
My! You've surely done a fine job of it, Richard, and everything looks neat as a pin, tidy as can be. You've hit all the "rub spots" as well, and the reinforcing web in the tubing makes it looks like a "developed product". Your racks will never wear out, and will always look as new!

I'm sore tempted to go this route, but "need" (why? dunno...character flaw?) to find tubing that is all-black to fit the stealthy nature of my racks and bike. Something like that bit of black innertube you have in Picture Three. No reflection on the fine job you've done, but while we're at it, I wish someone would make zip-ties with lower-profile heads. I find myself wishing that every time I attach my computer, light, and charging cable runs. Anyone know of something like that? Stainless-steel bands are available to secure the synthetic rubber boots to automotive constant-velocity joints...the tap gies through a little hoop and folds back on itself, secure as can be. Now, it there were only a sleeved zip-tie, I'd be set.

The side-wing idea sure looks like the Safety Feature of the Year for making cars more aware of your width inthe absence of rear panniers. An older idea that still has much to recommend it. Hmm. Wondering if a 1W LED blinky might be attachable, perhaps with a bit of Araldite (JB Weld in my part of the world)?

All the best,

Dan. (...whose creative juices are flowing, having seen Richard's wonderful innovations and attachments)

Andybg

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #32 on: October 19, 2012, 05:49:24 PM »
I think you can get high pressure air hose (for compressors) in the required size and that generaly comes in black. It is a similar feel of rubber to bicycle tyres and is very hard wearing.

Definetly a job worth considering. Now just need to find some hose in silver for the new surly racks

Cheers

Andy

Danneaux

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #33 on: October 19, 2012, 07:02:06 PM »
Hi Andy!

Good idea about the air hose. I gave it try, but had to abandond it, as the rubber had so much "tack" it ended up making it very hard to seat and release the hooks..they just dragged on it or kinda bonded with it under pressure (!). Surprised me, I can tell you! I tried several samples, too. There is a sort of fuel-rated hose with a covering called "EDPM" that looked promising, but the cover soon abraded under the pressure of the glass-reinforced hooks. Those things are tough, and tough on stuff!

I think Richard is onto the right material...the stuff he is using (if it is like the samples I've felt over here) is kinda plasticky-rubbery rather than rubbery-rubbery.   Just wish it was black.  :D

Great ideas, though...keep 'em coming!

Al the best,

Dan. ("The Man In Black"...not just Batman or Johnny Cash, but also Dan on his Nomad)

StuntPilot

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #34 on: October 21, 2012, 10:32:55 AM »
Dan - the same tubing can be found without the white re-inforcement. It is the same plasticky-rubbery stuff as you say. I know it is not black but clear may be the closest you can get to preserving your 'Man in Black' status!

http://hotspecialoffers.co.uk/shop/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=14_6

I find that the panniers clip on quite easily, and remove easily with my tubing solution. Time will tell how the tubing performs in hot weather, if it expands or becomes more rubbery than plasticky. I have tried heating it with a hair-dryer, and it does not become too tacky.

'Blinky' glued to the Safety Wing also a great idea - Thanks!

richie thornger

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #35 on: October 23, 2012, 01:34:08 PM »
As I was renewing my insulating tape I thought I would treat the rack to a new piece of hose. I've now got JCB hydraulic hose in black. 10mm/16mm zip tied on. It's quite a snug fit so not sure if I'm going to stay with it. But I will report back with the findings. Looks good though:)

Update: Unfortunately looks are not everything. It's grown a bit, just like yours Dan. So off it comes.
Back to the the aquarium hose for me. Or I might even just go back to using the inserts on the bare rack!!!!
No doubt I'll find the perfect solution in the unlikeliest of places when I'm not looking for it.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2012, 09:28:08 AM by richie thornger »
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revelo

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #36 on: January 09, 2013, 06:45:47 AM »
Either you spend a lot of time touring or you don't. In the former case, you're not going to want to fuss around with gear that has to be babied, and that is what all this fiddling with protecting the racks sounds like. Treat them like consumables. I've toured 8000 km so far with my Thorn racks. The paint is abraded in many places on the rear racks where I use Ortlieb panniers.  I would estimate that  the Thorn racks will need to be replaced around 50,000km. That's maybe 7 years down the road. A new set of rear racks, at $200 at most including shippin, every 7 years works out to under $30/year or less than one night in a motel. I can surely spend one more night per year camping rather than in motels to pay for new racks.

No abrasion on the front racks, which use my home-made panniers and which only carrier water bladders. Au contraire, the front racks are abrading the home-made panniers slowly but surely, but these panniers can be easily replaced.

If you tour less than me, then rack abrasion will likely be slower. I tour in a dry climate, so that rust is not a problem, but I doubt things would be different in a wet climate, since the loss of steel to abrasion will almost certainly be greater than the rate of steel loss to rust.

Just make sure you don't buy a bike like the silkroad, which combines rear rack and frame.

Matt2matt2002

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #37 on: January 09, 2013, 07:37:28 AM »
Sorry to jump in on this one so late......

 By increasing the diameter size of the rack with the plastic tube, is there then a problem with fitting the hooks for the panniers? Guess there isn't or you guys wouldn't be going downn this path.
Are there several sizes of hooks supplied?

(The late) Matt
Never drink and drive. You may hit a bump  and spill your drink

il padrone

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #38 on: January 09, 2013, 07:58:50 AM »
I'm about to fit some clear aquarium tubing to my racks, ID - 10mm, OD - 13mm. The Tubus racks are 10mm dia. The hooks on my Ortliebs are 16mm (or more - some have spread a bit under heavy loads) and you use spacers to size them down for 10mm or 8mm rack bars. So, no, there is no problem  in fitting the hooks onto the rack.

Danneaux

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #39 on: January 09, 2013, 08:01:12 AM »
Hi Matt!

Yes, Ortlieb supplies their panniers with hooks and two sizes of inserts -- one for 8mm and the other for 10mm rack-tube diameters.

These adapter clips have been known to fall out with time and wear, becoming problematic. See: http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=3955.msg20055#msg20055

If one wraps a 10mm rack, then it is possible to fit the bags securely without the adapter clips and reduce wear on the rack and rack finish. it is possible to view this as a win-win.

The trick is to match the rack wrap to the size of the standard (unadapted) Ortlieb hooks so they neither rattle nor stick.

Quote
(The late) Matt
:o Man, I hope not! Writing from the Great Beyond, are you?  :D

All the best,

Dan. (...who is *really* late at about 8 hours behind most of you.  ;))

Matt2matt2002

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #40 on: January 09, 2013, 09:21:30 PM »
Hi Dan
I am not late as in past tense but just late in my second question relating to Ortlieb panniers.

Is it advisable to purchase spare clips (if they are made) for the panniers? And is there a left and right side to them?
I guess they will not weigh much and could be worth carrying in my spares box while on remote tours
Never drink and drive. You may hit a bump  and spill your drink

Danneaux

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #41 on: January 09, 2013, 09:33:18 PM »
Yes, Matt, it is a good idea to carry spare inserts for Ortlieb bags, and I do so myself. Loss is generally not a problem with new bags (unless the're not snapped in securely to start with), but can become problematic over time with the effects of wear, rough roads, and heavy loads. There's not a real good solution to the problem once it occurs...users have employed dental floss, glue, and various tapes to keep worn inserts in place, but it is not much fun to search for them when lost. Loss typically occurs when the bags are demounted in camp or at a lodging. This is one reason why some people pad the rack out to such a large diameter they can dispense with inserts and use just the outer hooks, which have no parts to lose.

I also do something else, which accomplishes the first task as well: I have each of my rear bags fitted with a spare pair of hooks and inserts on the rails. It makes unauthorized removal ("theft") of the bags a little more difficult, and provides a handy place to store the spares in case of crash damage or loss. Placing the spares on the more heavily-laden rear bags helps distribute the load through a total of 4 hooks/adapters per bag, rather than two, and the spares take up no space inside my bag. Added weight is negligible.

I also use two lower retention fins on each of my Ortlieb bags. The extra fin makes for a more secure, rattle-free fit and provides a ready spare in the event of breakage (lower retention fins have been known to break after some time, especially in cold weather).

With new bags, you'll be very unlikely to have a problem. With time, insert loss can become a problem for some. I figure I'm covered either way with the spare set of hooks/inserts, which of course fit any of my four bags. All the Ortlieb hooks, adapter inserts, and lower retention fins in the QL-2 mounting system are interchangeable and can fit any location (not side-specific).

Hope this helps.

Best,

Dan.

Matt2matt2002

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #42 on: March 09, 2013, 10:31:07 AM »
Still playing around with my tube covering.
Very happy with the result and the front ortlieb panniers fit snug on the racks.

It occured to me that the tubing could act as a secret store for a few notes.
The tubing is such a snug fit I have not used cable ties on the front - although I have on the rear.

It's easy to fold a few notes inside some paper and slip it under the tubing. Either tied down before the clips are applied or under the front tubing

Those who like to spread their cash about may like the idea?

Matt - who famuosly does not spread his cash around.
Never drink and drive. You may hit a bump  and spill your drink

onebikeoneworld

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #43 on: September 06, 2013, 12:27:06 PM »
I'd been using duct tape for a good while, and it had done very little other than make a sticky mess of my pannier racks so I've just gone with StuntPilot's method. Picked up the tubing while I was back in the UK, and applied it yesterday here in Colombia. I went with more coverage, as in my 45,000km the panniers have rubbed on other parts of my racks. Let's see how it stands up to long-term touring. It took a good few hours to do, and it's a little sloppily done, but here's hoping it works well. Thank you for the inspiration!

il padrone

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Re: Pannier hook abrasion...and preventing same
« Reply #44 on: September 06, 2013, 02:57:04 PM »
I've used the clear plastic tubing - 13mm OD, 10mm ID. Bought some of the reinforced 15mm/10mm tubing but it was too hard to cut, so the thinner tubing proved much easier to fit. Cable-tied in place and the bags sit very snuggly on it. It should be sufficiently abrasion resistant to last for many years.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2013, 02:58:38 PM by il padrone »