Author Topic: Danneaux's Sherpa  (Read 57553 times)

Danneaux

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #120 on: July 05, 2012, 05:15:35 am »
Hi All!  Back at the computer amidst the activities surrounding the mid-week holiday here. A lovely sunny day, so I did some yard work and walked 5 miles in the sunshine. I think...Summer may actually be coming to stay here in Oregon for awhile. It's been awfully cool, uneven, and rainy for the most part so far, with just enough nice days to serve as teasers of coming attractions. At the moment, our neighbors one street to the north have hired a live band (combined holiday and birthday celebration...the lead singer sounds uncannily like Shane MacGowan of The Pogues), fireworks and mortars are going off, and the smell of sulfur is in the air. A good time to take a break and check on Forum happenings...

Ians:
Welcome back! I'm so glad your trip was enjoyable, and I hope people treated you nicely. My own experiences here as a cycling traveler have been uneven compared to the universally warm welcome I received in Europe, and I always hope we're up to showing visitors the same level of gracious hospitality. If you met a few clinkers, give me their names, and I'll have a talk with them. ;) You're welcome back anytime!

I loved your visual and written "postcard" description. You mentioned...
Quote
Crossing desert in a car can be intimidating for us Brits, used to seeing habitation and rest areas every few miles.  But I loved it - I can see the appeal.
There really is something very special about it, and for me it harkens back to that spiritual thing, and the solitude is majestic. Though I may find myself, literally, a hundred miles or more from anyone or any services and out of cell-phone range and by myself...oddly enough, I have never felt Alone. I grew up exploring a world of rain forests and old-growth timber in the Coast Range, Calapooyas, and Cascade mountain ranges, and still pass through them on my way to the high central plateau and desert regions beyond. Though the desert at first appears stark compared to my familiar forests, the desert is anything but lifeless, and the vast expanses grow on a person. That, and the lack of any but natural noises. With night comes the vast inverted bowl of the sky, with stars from horizon to horizon and the night sounds of coyotes on the hunt.

The biggest difference for me is the complete lack of shade and natural shelter from sun and storms and the lack of potable water. So often, when I do find water in the Great Basin, it is unsafe to drink and it is a little hard to be thirsty and at a water source that can't be consumed. The mouth and body say "yes" and the brain says "no". There may be a sulphur smell or the water may be boiling (geothermal springs), but sometimes it is clear and cool and tempting and...according to my pH test strips...about the same as an alkaline battery. Scummy-slimy cow troughs are pretty welcome, and I put a lot of time into locating water before a trip. For the 2010 transit of Black Rock, I mapped 150 years' worth of hydrology and well-registration data as GPS waypoints and matched them with GoogleEarth, Bing, and TerraServer satellite images to find likely water sources. It worked. And, yes, you can actually smell water from some distance away in a dry environment. That day-rider you saw was on a pretty fine edge. It gets hot out there. Really torrid on pavement.

Rual:
Thanks for posting the link to your Flickr account and some truly outstanding photos. I've enjoyed your photos in the past, and always find something that makes them new again for a given context. What good fortune to ride with Josie Dew! 'Wish I'd known you then; you could have stopped by midway on your journey from New Mexico to Alaska and been most welcome. Let me know the next time you're nearby. Oh! And I've got to ask...was it a bottom bracket failure on Frame 0329 of that set? Everything so neatly arrayed on the rail, but it looks like the light is failing.

Dusk is falling and the skyrockets and fireworks are bursting in the sky, so I'd best pen off for now, take my little bike-chair outside, and see them in person.

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2012, 08:06:54 am by Danneaux »

jags

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #121 on: July 08, 2012, 12:43:26 am »
nice write up there dan theres a bit of a poet in ya.

Dan just going back over the story on your sherpa ,seems the shimmi problem is still there after everything you tried to fix it.
Dan i reckon you bough or was sold a FAULTY BIKE it happens ,you just don't know until you ride it .
yeah it has to be faulty no other reason for it. so i reckon you should get on to robin thorn and ask for a replacement frame and fork .
Has Thorn not got a replacement policy  for faulty goods, i would be interested to see or hear what thorn has to say about this.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 12:56:55 am by jags »

Danneaux

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #122 on: July 08, 2012, 04:19:37 am »
You're absolutely right, jags.

The bike shimmies with a touring load (another thread at http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4320.0 ) -- even at the lower weight referenced by Andy in the Summer 2011 brochure, when I bought the bike. The only way I can *just barely* damp it out is by going to 1.5" road slicks and a Tubus Logo Evo rack. It rides fine unladen or with only 25lbs/11kgs distributed evenly. It rides fine with all the weight at the front and either the rack-top load or the rear panniers. It shimmies with both when atop 2.0 Schwalbe Duremes in either rigid or folding varieties.  It simply will not tolerate a rear load and is terribly unpleasant and unstable when only a rear load is applied. The front seems unaffected by a load placed there and/or mid-frame. The ride and shimmy are unaffected by the steerer-mounted bottles or the frame-mounted bottles. If anything, the have a damping effect.

When I wrote Andy pre-purchase to ask if the Sherpa could carry as much as my Miyata 1000LT regularly managed, he replied that since the tubes on the Sherpa were significantly larger in diameter than on my current bike, it must be assumed that it will carry heavier loads. As it happens, I am having significant shimmy problems with Sherpa at the same 77lb/35kg load and less as described above. And no, it does not get better or worse with more weight; I still get shimmy. I've got test data for every combination and placement of my touring loads. I wouldn't have persisted so long except I wanted to be sure it wasn't something I was doing inadvertently or could correct myself. I have now concluded it is something wrong with my example.

I don't have the expedition-tourer I bought and paid for, so yes, something has to be done. I have sent Robin an email and am waiting to see what he has to say.

Meanwhile, last week I ordered a 59mm replacement fork at my expense to drop the trail into the neutral zone with 2.0 tires (as happens with the original 52mm fork when 1.5" road slicks are fitted), hoping that would allow me to use the 2.0 tires and also carry a full touring load at or above the loads Andy alluded to in the 2011 brochure for the bike. The last straw came this afternoon after I signed for the fork and opened it. In exchange for my £120.33 delivered (USD$186.40), I found SJSC had sent a *used* fork -- really, really used. Covered in metal chips and scarf, chipped through to the bare steel, all the bosses showing signs of having a rack and mudguards bolted on and paint off to the steel, the dropouts thoroughly embossed by a Q/R, and an old headset lower crown race installed. The thing had no protective packing in the box, so the paint is scuffed through the clear-coat on the sides and back of the fork crown and on the curve of the blades. When I looked at it a few moments ago indoors, I can both see and feel large bumps or kinks in both blades above the dropouts. It doesn't look safe for me or anyone else. More amazingly, it isn't a Mk 2 Sherpa replacement fork as I ordered. It has lawyer lips on the dropouts and a different Reynolds sticker (not 531). I would have thought it a Mk3 fork, except the latest brochure shows the Mk 3 is not made in a 59mm offset, and the crown clearances are the same as on my Mk 2 fork. I don't feel it is safe to fit and try, not with the bulges in the blades.

All this sits kind of hard, given Sherpa was unridable for 3 weeks after purchase and periodically thereafter, thanks to extremely poor assembly and packing by Thorn. I can't think of a single component or system on the bike that was unaffected by poor assembly. Robin promised to correct the problems, but now a year later, I get a used fork.

So, yeah, it seems my Sherpa is  a faulty example, and I'm hoping Robin will make good on it so I can finally have the bicycle I thought I was getting when I purchased it. It's already cost me the tour I arranged my yearly work schedule for, and now the weather is against me with really torrid conditions on my planned route. I'd hate to think it would cost me any chance to get away for any kind of tour this summer.

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 08:06:47 am by Danneaux »

6527richardm

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #123 on: July 08, 2012, 08:29:34 am »
Sorry to here of all your troubles with the bike.

It seems to me that after all the testing you have carried out the only conclusion that Thorn can conclude is that the bike is a faulty one.  Given the sales description it is clearly not fit for purpose.

Hopefully Robin will see that and offer a replacement as to the fork frankly that is just disgraceful and I fail to see how they could justify sending it out.

jags

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #124 on: July 08, 2012, 12:08:18 pm »
yes  even a gobshite like me can see the frame plus fork is fit for the bin.
i never had problems with my sherpa and i've never heard any other lads saying anythink bad about there's.
and looking at the way you put your sherpa together Pure  Perfection it can only be a Faulty  bike.
So come on Robin Thorn and get your act together and send this man a new sherpa pretty quick, time is running out for him.

Paul S

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #125 on: July 08, 2012, 04:47:50 pm »
Maybe its just little old me.

But I have always found it to be more beneficial to me to resolve differences of a contractual nature with others....direct......with the other.

AS opposed to on the web.

He says, headding for the exit.

Paul.
Peddle Power = Will Power...... & the right gears.

jags

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #126 on: July 08, 2012, 05:32:33 pm »
Well he hasn't had much luck so far ???

but lets hope  Thorn do the right thing.

Danneaux

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #127 on: July 12, 2012, 07:40:05 pm »
Man!

My little touring world is burning up. That portion which isn't affected by the Black Plague (seriously!).

Right now, much of the area I so dearly love to tour in Central and Southeastern Oregon is ablaze with wildfires. The areas are so vast and so sparsely populated, much of the efforts are being spent mainly on containment. Right now, the two fires in that area are at about 800 sq mi/2,100 sq km. The fires were lightning-sparked, and there really isn't water to extinguish them. The juniper and sagebrush are very oil-rich, and just go up like matches. Eugene, where I live (West Side of the state, southern end of the Willamette Valley) was inundated by smoke from the fires yesterday. Last night's sunset was spectacular as a result. There's lightning-sparked wildfires burning just this side of the Cascades summit, as well. A big storm hit there over the weekend, with winds of 70+mph/ 113kph and hailstones the size of golf balls. For stories and some photos on the Eastern wildfires, see:

http://www.kpic.com/news/local/Huge-wildfires-rage-in-desolate-corner-of-SE-Oregon-162101455.html
http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2012/07/fires_threaten_frenchglen_sout.html
http://www.ktvz.com/news/Firefighters-battle-on-Frenchglen-threat-reduced/-/413192/15479370/-/jg9g2ez/-/index.html

Then, there's the Plague. Really. Every few years, it seems someone on Central Oregon's high plateau contracts it from infected fleas. The latest victim is a weldor from Prineville, who tried to help his cat, who choked on a mouse. He's been in hospital for a month, and it didn't look like he'd live. This morning's paper brought news that his prospects for survival have improved, but doctors have now amputated his plague-blackened finger tips and toes, and he will have to learn how to use his hands again and to walk. He won't be working as a weldor again.

News stories about him here:
http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/06/15/the-black-death-returns-oregon-man-in-critical-condition-with-the-plague/
http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2012/07/oregon_plague_victim_paul_gayl.html

Yikes.

Keeps one on their toes when planning a tour.

Best,

Dan.

jags

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #128 on: July 12, 2012, 08:10:33 pm »
jeez Dan the fires are bad enough but man oh man the black death as well  :(
i'm staying in ireland. ;)

Danneaux

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #129 on: July 12, 2012, 09:03:06 pm »
Quote
i'm staying in ireland.
Oh...its just the Black Death, jags! There's the wildfires to see, the endless wastes of trackless desert, the wild animals to gnaw your bones, golf ball-sized hail, and 113kph winds to drop branches on you as you ride there.

Come! We'll show you a wonderful time!  :D

(and we really would, too!)

Best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2012, 09:55:26 pm by Danneaux »

jags

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #130 on: July 12, 2012, 10:57:54 pm »
SAy Dan any good news on your sherpa ,your tour must be very close by now will the sherpa take the beating over all that rough stuff.
i don't want to do any stirring the pot here but i sure hope  Thorn is doing something to fix that bike for you.
anyway hope you will let us know how the final chapter ends.

Danneaux

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #131 on: July 13, 2012, 01:35:58 am »
Hi jags,

I am working with Robin and Andy toward a solution. They have dispatched a new fork and a rear rack. Hopefully, those will bring the results we're looking for. Just awaiting delivery.

All the best,

Dan.

jags

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #132 on: July 13, 2012, 11:53:42 am »
good stuff Dan sure hope they work out for you.guess we wont know for a while. ::)

il padrone

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #133 on: July 13, 2012, 11:56:41 am »
This morning's paper brought news that his prospects for survival have improved, but doctors have now amputated his plague-blackened finger tips and toes, and he will have to learn how to use his hands again and to walk.....

.....Keeps one on their toes when planning a tour.
Oh, touche Danneaux, touche  :D



And I thought we had the market for crazy bushfires cornered here in SE Australia.

Danneaux

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Re: Danneaux's Sherpa
« Reply #134 on: September 01, 2012, 07:36:14 am »
Hi All!

A very happy update and concludion to this thread: My problematic Sherpa is a problem no more, thanks to Thorn's superb warranty response. I am convinced no company on earth could have done a better job in addressing the problem I experienced with shimmy -- a problem I have never heard affect any other Thorn product besides this one example.

I have detailed Thorn's wonderful response elsewhere as a preface to the description of the problem in the thread appearing here:
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4320.0

I will repeat the summary of their response here so all readers and owners can be reassured this is a company that stands behind their products to an extraordinary degree, with care and attention far beyond what one might expect from any other bicycle manufacturer:
------------------------------------
My Sherpa developed a severe shimmy problem under heavy load. Despite applying my best efforts and calling on the collective wisdom of the Forum, the problem persisted. as soon as they became awareI had a problem, Robin Thorn, his designer and "test pilot" Andy Blance, shipping supervisor Cath Colenso, and the entire Thorn staff became involved in addressing the problem and made every possible effort to help and assist me. They communicated with me nearly every business day by email, and at their expense shipped a Thorn EXP rack and a replacement front fork in a different offset in an attempt to resolve the problem with this one single rogue Sherpa.

When it became evident the problem could not be addressed, they offered to replace my bike with a Nomad Mk2, since the Sherpa Mk2 was no longer available and the Sherpa Mk3 has a lower load rating insufficient for my expeditionary needs. My experiences with the extraordinary Nomad Mk2 are detailed here:
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4523.0

My acceptance of their offer did not mean the end of their help and assistance. They volunteered to test the new bike to be absolutely certain it would meet my requirements. Andy loaded the bike with my maximum expected load and set off to do just that, as Robin followed in the company van and Cath caught it all on video, available for viewing here: http://www.facebook.com/Touringbikes

I have now shipped the Sherpa back to Thorn for a complete analysis of the problem. They have provided simply outstanding customer service, and we can all rest easier knowing that Thorn stand behind their warranty and have gone far beyond the efforts of any other bike-maker I can imagine. My sincere thanks and gratitude to Thorn the company, to Robin Thorn himself, to Andy, to Cath, and to the entire staff for an outstanding job. I can't begin to describe the incredible care and detail with which the new bike was assembled, packed, and shipped; it is simply perfect, and performs as one would expect -- like a Thorn.
------------------------------------
When and if the cause of my Sherpa's shimmy can be found, I will append it to the end of this thread. It is entirely possible the exact cause may be unkown if it is due to an internal flaw in the tubing or a hidden issue, such as a problem in heat-treatment.

Because I no longer own Sherpa, I will probably not be adding much new material to this thread. I will, however, be happy to answer any questions about my Sherpa Mk2 when it was mine. It really was a fine and outstanding bicycle in its own right, and I loved it dearly. Sadly, my single example developed problems that made it unusable and Thorn did wonderfully by me as I am sure they would by any owner. I can heartily recommend you purchase their products in full confidence they will and do stand behind their warranty.

I hope you'll join me in my new adventures with the Nomad. I can already tell you it is much like Sherpa in all the positive ways; the bikes definitely share the same DNA, and the Nomad is like the Sherpa but "more" -- a good all-rounder, but also more robust and heavy-duty as befits a true Expedition Tourer with enormous cargo capacity. At the same time, it maintains lively and accurate low-speed steering with or without a load, and is entirely pleasant to ride in either state, though biased toward loaded touring. The Nomad's frame is a bit heavier, of course (a difference of no importance when carrying a full touring load) but the light steering belies the weight and once up to speed, it is easy to maintain progress at the same rate as on Sherpa. I believe the Nomad Mk2 relies more on tires to provide comfort and suspension, and it does well on both counts, providing a smooth and confident ride regardless of terrain. I am running the same tires and rims (albeit in 32-hole rather than 36 as on Sherpa) and have the identical position/fit on the new bike, so some direct comparisons and contrasts can be made between the bikes and the gearing (derailleur vs. Rohloff). Those will come to light in the "Danneaux's Nomad" thread, available here:
http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=4523.0

All the best,

Dan.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2012, 07:54:49 pm by Danneaux »