Author Topic: Wire Suggestion  (Read 823 times)

Thomas777

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Wire Suggestion
« on: December 27, 2016, 04:21:05 PM »
As I venture into dynohubs I have a question about the type of wire to use. I plan to go with a SP hub and B&M lights front and rear. As for connectors-Dean, so the wire question is still unsolved.
Your advice would be great!

Danneaux

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2016, 04:33:19 PM »
What fun! Really! :D I always enjoy planning my wire runs on the bikes, trying my best to balance electrical and mechanical functionality with aesthetics. It can make for some challenging choices.

I usually go with B&M dual-conductor ("zip" wire) simply because it is of generally good quality with a reasonably durable sheath of even thickness. It is also small, so it can be routed easily.

That said, it (like most similar wire) can be subject to compression by cable ties if one is too enthusiastic in tightening them.

For that reason, coaxial cable may be ultimately linger-lived, as it has the "hot" lead in the center, with the ground return lead in the form or a woven sheath beneath the top layer of insulation. Of course, on an alternator it makes no difference which lead is connected where, but it doesn't hurt to adhere to convention. The trick with coax is to strip it properly for a good result at the connector. The center lead will always be longer, because the outer weave must be separated, then twisted and tinned with a soldering iron to make a durable connection point. The result is the two leads are usually separated by about 15mm or so, but this can work nicely for spanning the distance between connection points on a dynohub. Just be sure to shield the outer lead with heat-shrink tubing, then sleeve a larger diameter piece over the whole coax so the weave doesn't separate.

While arguably more durable, the coax is larger in diameter, which can be problematic on installations where it is desirable to route the wiring inside the frame, fork and chainstays.

In the end, either lead type -- two-conductor strip wire or coax-- will do the job. Looking forward to photos of your final installation.

As a data point, my Dean's connectors have remained clean and secure at the point of connection and completely failure free after nearly five years' use, so encouraging in terms of durability and reliability.

All best luck,

Dan.

Thomas777

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2016, 06:10:19 PM »
Dan,
Thanks for your response. I don't think I will go with the coaxial but rather the zip type. I looked at the Dean site but I am a bit confused about the item #.
BTW, I am going to be building (3) dynohub wheels. 2 for our touring bikes and 1 for my Randonneuring bike. I plan to order from Start Bike as I also need tires. I did not see B&M wire on their site. Could you recommend a source?

Danneaux

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2016, 10:12:38 PM »
Hi Thomas!

Since you're also in 'Merka, the most likely source to get B&M 2-conductor zip wire is Peter White. I last ordered from him this summer, and the wire came through okay.

My last order (it arrived last Saturday) was part of a larger order from an overseas vendor and B&M dealer.
Quote
I looked at the Dean site but I am a bit confused about the item #
<nods> Yes, Deans seems to have revised their product lineup. At first, it appeared the connectors I prefer had gone away, but a check just now shows them back again. Here's some links:|
My Sherpa Gallery page where I first mentioned them, with photos:
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=3896.msg17113#msg17113
Dean's landing page for *micro plugs*:
http://wsdeans.com/products/plugs/micro_plug.html
Once there, click on the pale link that says, "Click here for more information" ( http://wsdeans.com/products/plugs/changes.html ) and a window pops up showing the variety of micro connectors and their SKUs/stock numbers.

The one you want is still: #1225, Micro 2NB, USD$1.55/each mating pair.

I like this model especially because it has a ledge on one side of each connector. This not only makes it easier to disconnect them without pulling on the wires (as required with some of their connectors), it sort of indexes them by feel so you can maintain polarity if you need to get them apart at night. Not important for AC dyno connections, but Real Important for polarized DC connections as sometimes found on taillights (I use these connectors just before my head and taillights and between the rear mudguard/fender and the frame, so I can remove parts as needed for maintenance without having to rewire the lights). The flat back still allows you to bond one connector half directly to a mudguard with beta-cyanoacrylate, making for a very tidy installation.

They're available through Deans or a variety of sources, such as:
(In the town where I live and buy mine)
https://eugenetoyandhobby.com/shop/1225-micro-plug-2nb-by-deans-1225/?gclid=CIf2i7CjldECFZCJfgody_YHxw
...or...
https://www.amainhobbies.com/deans-micro-plug-2nb-black-nonpolarized-connector-reversible-wsd1225/p3593?gclid=CILFj7iildECFYJpfgod5ogAPA
https://www.rcplanet.com/Deans_Micro_2Npb_Blk_Non_Polar_p/wsd1225.htm?gclid=CN-Mw4SjldECFUiTfgodul8DVw
http://www.advantagehobby.com/32472/WSD1225/1225-Micro-Plug-2NB/?gclid=COGGso-jldECFQ9EfgodzwQKNQ
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/391381278942?lpid=82&chn=ps&ul_noapp=true
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCGP1&P=FR&gclid=CMze5KikldECFQuAfgod_H4BxQ
http://www.hobbypeople.net/deans-2-pin-connecter-pair.html?gclid=CJuV076kldECFQmDfgod4nwDZw

Hope this helps, Thomas.

Best,

Dan.

RonS

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2016, 11:49:05 PM »
Look under Accessories > Small Parts to find the B&M wire at that large overseas vendor that also sells tires.

mickeg

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2016, 08:16:14 PM »
I think I am using 22 gauge or maybe 20 gauge wire, two insulated wires that I twist into a spiral.  I prefer these over the lighter duty wire in case I snag it because I do not want a broken wire.

My SP PV8 hub uses the same connector as Shimano hubs.  Since I wanted to be able to run the wheel with the SP hub on three different forks, I bought extra Shimano dynohub connectors and zip tied the wiring to the fork blade on each fork that the wheel might go on.

In the photo, the wire is yellow like the frame so it is a bit hard to see the wires.  I bought some 2.8mm spade connectors on Ebay (shipped from China, very slow) to use to on the wiring.  I am running battery taillight, so only needed the wiring from the front hub to the light.  Old photo, I use a different light now.

tt2cycletours

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2017, 09:18:44 PM »
Hi everyone,

I have just been browsing the site for wire suggestions.  Having baulked at 14 for 10 metres from SJSC, UK.

1.  Does anyone know the conductive properties required of bike dynamo cables?

2. Any thoughts on this option (I know I will have to buy a real, but could sell it on ebay so I don't waste money):

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/coaxial-cable/6655833/

Above is 3.6mm ext. dia.  which is larger than necessary but is all RS have in black, unless I go much smaller. 


3. Related, but dated, blog on coaxial cable for bike dynamo setups:

http://oceanaircycles.com/2013/10/05/coaxial-lighting-wire/

I really don't like the tatty look of the two-strand cables with the ugly white stripe, and have appreciated seeing how other people have done their cabling - brilliant.  I did try getting some nylon pneumatic pipes for sheathing cables but couldn't get the cable through!!

I am currently fitting lighting to my new KHS Flite 747 - due to tight hamstring issues after long rides I have switched to xl cranks but that is another thread.  I hope to post pictures and that might prompt some discussion.

mickeg

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2017, 10:18:38 PM »
I do not see a need for coax cable.  I just use a twisted pair of wires.  I bought a long wire, spent a couple minutes twisting two pieces into a pair.  Zip tied it to the fork.  If you wire a taillight, that gets much more complicated. 

I use SP hubs on two bikes, that hub is not grounded.  Two wires are needed to the light.

In a post above there is the photo of the yellow fork on my Nomad.

To this post, I attached a photo of the wire on my Sherpa.  You can see the twisted pair of black wires zip tied to the back of my fork blade.  Then you can see some clear plastic that covers some wire connectors near the fork crown, and a very sloppy looking wiring job to my headlamp.  I was intentionally sloppy on the headlamp wiring because the lamp was installed for a two week long trip, then the lamp was removed.  Thus, wanted to do it quickly.  On this bike I do not normally have a dynohub installed, but I did for this trip, thus the temporary light installation.  But, the wires that are zip tied to the fork blade are intended to be permanently installed because I will install the dynohub wheel on that bike when I use it on future tours.

I only run wire from my hub to my lamp.  I do not use a taillight that is wired, instead use a battery taillight.  I have also used a USB charger for tours, but that wire is temporary.

I wired up another fork a few days go, I used a wire that in USA is referred to as 18 gauge which I think is too thick but that was the closest wire that the hardware store had to the diameter that I wanted.   The use of a wire that is too thick is not any disadvantage, and it has the advantage of being less likely to break.  But, too thick a wire can be harder to install in the Shimano or SP connector that attaches to a hub.

If you are trying to crimp the 2.8mm connectors to the wire, you might want to buy a wire that you think is strong enough that you won't break the wire or accidentally pull it out of the connectors.


tt2cycletours

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #8 on: April 14, 2017, 04:58:15 PM »
Thanks for the quick reply. My aspiration is to the wires out of sight as much as possible.  I like the new discreet LED rear lights, and might see if the one designed for a seatpost might just get around a seat tube, just below the clamp.  Could be a very neat way to get a light on a audax bike where I don't intend to have the rack on permanently. 

pavel

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #9 on: May 09, 2017, 10:24:38 PM »
I really dislike wires loose all over the place, twist-tied. I too was thinking of re-running the wires without any extra wire on the inside of the stays, so that it's as invisible as possible, but am stumped as to how to do it best.  Too bad we aren't yet in the age of wireless dyno-hub lighting.

Danneaux

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Re: Wire Suggestion
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2017, 07:47:48 AM »
 Too bad we aren't yet in the age of wireless dyno-hub lighting.

Oh, but we are very close, Pavel! Check out the SON SL system...the contacts for the dynohub are integrated into (and isolated from) the dropouts and the wiring runs are hidden inside the fork blades. The dynohub connects automatically when the wheel is secured in the dropouts:
http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/schmidt-sl.
https://www.nabendynamo.de/produkte/sl_steckerlos_en.html

Of course, it requires a fork dedicated to the system, so currently (sorry!) found on a limited range of bikes. It has now been in use for awhile and seems to work well.

Best,

Dan.