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General Technical / Re: Silicone oil
« Last post by geocycle on February 26, 2021, 06:40:13 PM »
As a student I used silicone oil for making microscope slides. We used to embed the materials in it and then sandwich it beneath a coverslip. We then used paraffin wax to seal it. Completely irrelevant but it triggered a memory!
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Thorn General / Re: Mercury disc brake question
« Last post by pinkbunnyok96 on February 26, 2021, 05:26:23 PM »
have had a mercury for a few years now with shimano xt disc never found lever length a prob but I am on the short side going hydrolic good move never had to service them new pads once every couple of years regardless of miles
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Thorn General / Re: No Frame Number on my eXp
« Last post by martinf on February 26, 2021, 01:45:16 PM »
But when it comes to train travel, there's little if any advantage, usually you can either get a bike on, or you can't, the exceptions to this are the size of a Brompton.

Agree. Most of the time I can get a full-size bike on French trains. The TGV trains require removal of wheels and bagging, which is a faff. AFAIK the only possibility on Eurostar is a bagged folder. My Brompton was OK on this.

The advantage of something that packs as small as a Brompton is when the transport is crowded and it isn't possible to squeeze a full-size bike on, some examples of this :

- for commuting when the first train was cancelled and everyone took the second one. All the full size bikes were left behind.
- TGV in peak holiday season, where I removed the saddle and the QR left pedal to squeeze the Brompton into the space between a seat and the central partition.
- a ferry replacement when they had to use a smaller boat to replace the usual one that had mechanical problems. All bikes were banned, but I managed to take our two bagged Bromptons.

Before Covid I regularly took the Brompton on urban buses, always in a bag to avoid any awkward questions. I now also always use a bag for hotels, as I was once told off by the owner when I took an uncovered Brompton into a hotel room. But there has always been a solution in the hotels I have used when touring with a full size bike.
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Thorn General / Re: Mercury disc brake question
« Last post by PH on February 26, 2021, 11:01:20 AM »
I must confess I would have preferred v-Brakes all round as I like v-Brakes, they just work, and I have several sets spare in the garage.
That would also have been my preference, partly to avoid the cost of having the hub converted, but also because I've never had any issue with V brakes.  Though now I've got used to the idea, I'd probably chose it again.   
Well done on finding a frame in stock, good luck with the build, look forward to the comparison with the RST.
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Thorn General / Re: Mercury disc brake question
« Last post by phopwood on February 26, 2021, 09:28:27 AM »
Thanks all for your replies, very useful information. 

I must confess I would have preferred v-Brakes all round as I like v-Brakes, they just work, and I have several sets spare in the garage.  I did also think about V's on the front and disc on the back.  But I prefer same on front and back which leads me to discs all round. 

I brought a bike in 2003 with shimano deore hydraulic disc brakes; they still work well today, and have never failed, so I am not worried by Hydraulics.

The Klamper are as you say a thing of beauty but a little out of my price range for this build.

I have ordered the frame and forks, I have a few other things to get including getting my Rohloff converted for disc brakes, while all this is happening I will decide on brakes, cable or hydraulic, long or short levers.  Who would ever have thought brakes could be so complex.







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General Technical / Re: Silicone oil
« Last post by PH on February 26, 2021, 08:00:26 AM »
Paul, I haven't tried silicone oil for anything on my bike, and won't unless someone knowledgeable declares it beneficial.
I must admit, I'm a sucker for the Greatest Oil ever, I never seem to learn, I keep falling for the promises of perfect lubrication, with minimum maintenance and perfectly clean.  I've promised myself to not buy any more till all the half bottles are used up, but I may have said that before...
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General Technical / Re: Silicone oil
« Last post by Andre Jute on February 26, 2021, 02:17:34 AM »
Thanks, gentlemen. John, I think that it is rather that silicone oil is used as the binder in sealants and grouts and suchlike, and the whole is named "Silicone" for the most expensive ingredient rather than the downmarket "Cheap Chalk Seamfiller" which would be more true. Paul, I haven't tried silicone oil for anything on my bike, and won't unless someone knowledgable declares it beneficial. I used to use copper grease in assembly, or cleaner teflon if there were no moving parts, and recently Phil has served me and my bike loyally. I still have mostly full tubes of all, so I'm not actually forced to experiment.
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Thorn General / Re: No Frame Number on my eXp
« Last post by PH on February 25, 2021, 11:55:01 PM »
As we've wandered off topic - I have an Airnimal Joey folder as a travel bike. I've done a few European coach tours with it over the last couple of years, a cheap way to get around if you can stand the hours on a coach, Derby>Santander for less than 40! If folds small enough for the boot of the the cheapest hire car, or to get unobtrusively taken into a hotel room... and it isn't just for pootling around on,  I used it for a fairly tough tour in the Spanish Picos and it didn't lose much to a full sized bike. But when it comes to train travel, there's little if any advantage, usually you can either get a bike on, or you can't, the exceptions to this are the size of a Brompton.
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General Technical / Re: Silicone oil
« Last post by PH on February 25, 2021, 11:41:08 PM »
The usual argument for not using silicone on a chain are that it has poor adherence and washes off easily.  But I've never tried it and if it works for you it works for you...
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Thorn General / Re: Mercury disc brake question
« Last post by PH on February 25, 2021, 11:07:57 PM »
There's quite a few questions there Peter, I'll try and separate them out/
I could go Spyre road calipers and change the levers to Tiagra flat lever?
Peter
First one, yes.  The Spyre and Spyke are the same brakes with different cable actuation.  Shimano changed the cable pull on all their road groups a few years ago and ideally you'd need to find out if the Spyre is optimised for the original or newer and buy the correct levers, though the difference will be in feel rather than braking ability.
Quote
If I go the hydraulic route, most of the levers on Hydraulic brakes are very short and look too short to use with a rohloff shifter.
There's a few longer levers, I have two types. Shimano Deore T6000 (Deore comes in two flavours, M for MTB and T for Trekking) which is identical to the M6000 other than the longer levers. I don't think these have ever been commonly available in the UK, I bought from Germany, though that's no longer as easy.  I wanted a long lever so it better matched the V brake lever on the other side. Shimano's lower groups. primarily aimed at hybrid type bikes, also have longer levers.  I have a pair of these (BL something, the lettering has worn off)  they came on a Kona hybrid and will be going back on another build shortly.  In all respects, I haven't noticed any difference between these and the Deore.
Levers and Rohloff shifter - Not on my Mercury, but on another bike I have the M6000, there's no conflict.  I've been out this evening on that bike,  having read your post, I paid some attention to it - my hand it partly resting on the shifter as I brake, that might have been an issue with the triangular one, it isn't with the current design.
EDIT - This is with the twistshift specific Ergon GP grips.  I've recently notices some people using full length grips with a Rohloff shifter, I'm not sure of the thinking behind that.

OK, that's the factual stuff, would you like some opinion  ;)
I have had three cable disc brakes,  Avid BB7, TRP Spyke, Paul Components Klamper.  They all work fine, they all stop you as you'd expect. 
The Spyre is the only one where both pads are moved by the lever.  The advantages, if any, are too small for me to notice.  The disadvantage is that the mechanism had to be made small enough to fit between the rotor and spokes and as a consequence the components suffer more from wear and corrosion.  After two winters of faultless performance mine started playing up, the adjustment that is fiddley to start with wouldn't stay set.  I tried various remedies, before giving them a complete strip down and rebuild - that wasn't an experience I have any intention of repeating.
BB7's are a bit agricultural, to look at and in use, but they work fine.  They do feel a bit rough after a while, but are easy to strip, clean and grease.  I'm not keen on the pad retention, where they slot in without any retaining screw/pin.  I've never had, or heard of, a problem, but I like the reassurance of a physical retainer.
The Klamper is a thing of beauty, as it should be considering the price, works like a BB7, just better.  Smoother, nicer feel at the lever, easy to adjust, looks easy to strip (I haven't had to do so yet) There's a vid somewhere explaining why they chose to just have one moving pad.
All three recommend adjusting for wear by moving the pads in rather than shortening the cable.  If you do just take up the slack with the cable, the TRP will be less effected than the other two. 
Hydraulics - I've only used the three models already mentioned.  I chose Shimano because I prefer the idea of mineral oil rather than DOT.  I swapped the Spyke on the rear of the Merc for the Deore T.  I find the difference between cable and hydraulic discs to be greater than the difference between cable disc and rim brakes (Of any flavour) It isn't that I've ever had a brake that wouldn't stop me, it's just the ease of doing so and the control that gives you.  Plus, by their nature they're self adjusting, and when they do need maintenance it's simple (Though something else to learn) I know, - can't be fixed at the side of the road, but then neither can a lot of my bike. I wouldn't choose them for an exotic expedition, but otherwise I'd need a convincing reason not to use them (Like on my folder)

Last point - the way I use my Mercury, I chose the 853 V brake fork, I've never doubted that was the right choice.  When I bought a bigger tyred tougher bike, the right choice was a disc fork.
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