Thorn Cycles Forum
Technical => Transmission => Topic started by: ourclarioncall on April 03, 2021, 10:46:40 pm
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It’s everyone’s favourite topic . Again. lol
Okay, apologies , I’m sure I have already asked these questions before but haven’t a clue where they are. Did a keyword search but couldn’t find my old participation.
I’m considering a nomad 2 or 3 with chain . I printed off Thorns 72 pages of info and going step by step through it (again ), but with a bit more focus on finalising spec decisions
I want a chainglider , but from what I’ve read , getting all the bits such as sprocket /chainring to work together is challenging
Is there a tried and tested combo that we could say , well we know this works so you could get that
Or am I needing to compile a list of specs that other users have which work for them , but some parts may be dated or unavailable?
Cheers
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You said you want a belt drive and a Chainglider, but Chaingliders cannot be installed on belts. Nor would there be any reason to – belts do not need to be kept clean from grit attracted to oil like chains do.
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Worldtourer
Oops, sorry, meant chain not belt
Will go edit it
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...Or am I needing to compile a list of specs that other users have which work for them , but some parts may be dated or unavailable?
It sounds to me like you're nearing the point when it would be a good idea to give SJS Cycles a call and ask their advice on configuration and accessories. No one knows better as they design, build, and service their bikes so they've seen it all, addressed every parts conflict and know what works the best and longest over all models sold. Though busy (especially now they are dealing with the demands of the virus and supply-chain problems), they're known for giving a good steer on which direction to go when outfitting their bikes for a specific purpose -- they know for a certainty which works with what. :)
Their recent brochures were structured around "recipes" -- bikes pre-configured in a variety of ways. I don't see that approach in the current brochures but if you go here...
https://www.thorncycles.co.uk/bikes
...and scroll down to the section devoted to the Nomad Mk3, you'll see five different configurations. I'd suggest picking one closest to your needs as a baseline, then giving SJS Cycles a ring to ask specifics and advice on belt drive, gearing, and wheel security options and what the cost might be if you deviate from the configurations shown. While there are proven, tried and true configurations, everyone's needs are different and they can help you identify and address those differences as you home in on a purchase.
Sometimes, people will buy one of these "spec bikes" and ride it for awhile to better assess their own needs going forward, then change or add components as their needs are defined.
Thorn's MegaBrochure/Touring Bike Bible does a good job of walking the reader and prospective buyer through the current choices and options available in frame fitting by preference and size, wheel/tire size, handlebar type, brakes, forks, saddles, and so on. Typically, if you wish to have Thorn build your bike with parts not listed in this MegaBrochure, then you can purchase them separately/additionally from SJS Cycles' available inventory, have them installed at time of build, and the original spec parts will be bagged with the bike. Alternatively, you can source your own parts from any vendor and install/swap them yourself after you receive your bike or have your local bike shop do so for you. Some members prefer to purchase only a Thorn frame and swap parts from a bike they already own or build it up using parts they purchase from SJS Cycles or elsewhere. If you go this route, keep in mind Thorn's superb warranty is only included on complete bikes built and sold by them.
This is the approach I took in 2011 with my Sherpa and in 2012 with my Nomad Mk2 and I also dove deep into the Forum archives using the search engine. As a result, I was very happy with the spec of each of my bikes on delivery and beyond.
Best,
Dan.
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Ah, found where I had asked similar question
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=14028.0
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Thanks Dan
Yes, after an email to sjs about belt drive and Rohloff warranty he was keen for me to give him a call, so I said I would over the next 7 days.
Just printed off the Thorn bible etc tonight to help me nail stuff down on paper instead of it being scattered around my brain , forum posts and screenshots of important info.
On builds 5a and b - Nomad mk3 26”, it says .......
Waiting for a batch of 26” rim brake forks
Oh no, does this mean I won’t be able to get a 26” wheel nomad ?
From what I picked up I think the last batch was rejected or something and I think that was quite a while ago. Unless it’s just that the brochure has not been updated or maybe Covid had put everything on hold and they are still waiting . Hmm
I guess I’ll find out soon enough when I call
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...Oh no, does this mean I won’t be able to get a 26” wheel nomad ?
The Covid-19 pandemic has disrupted bicycle supply chains worldwide, causing delays. A lot of bike shops as well as makers are temporarily short of essential stocks. It is possible you may have to wait to get your specific spec until a delayed shipment arrives.
It may be possible to reserve your choice in advance with a deposit. Robin can advise if this is still possible.
Best,
Dan.
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Ah okay 👍
I am slightly tempted by 650b , but they only come with disc brakes . Il chew it over. The other option is a nomad 2 frame and fork , but it’s 620L or 620M, which I suspect might just be a touch on the big side. Il have to check my measurements again
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I'd second Dan's advice about contacting Thorn/SJS for advice. I took over a year to work out what I wanted when buying my first Thorn (2010-2011). I thought I wanted a Nomad, but after communication with Andy Blance at Thorn he convinced me to get a Raven Tour instead as he thought it would suit my current and intended use better. I haven't regretted that.
Andy also strongly advised flat bars with bar-ends rather than drops. I was less sure about this, so I bought the flat handlebar he advised and fitted it to my old mountain bike and rode this for more than 1000 kms before deciding I wanted drops anyway. I finally ended up with shallow drops, which suit me well at the moment, and could quite easily go to flat bars or (more likely) "sit up and beg" style bars if I need to as I get older.
The consensus at SJS was fairly strongly against Chaingliders. I was also quite sceptical about a chaincase that just rides on the chain, so I bought one to fit on my old utility bike and tried it. I did some timed test rides over a roughly 25 km circuit before and after fitting, which convinced me that in my normal riding conditions there was negligible extra friction.
For the gearing I was already convinced I wanted a Rohloff hub gear rather than derailleurs, having used Sturmey-Archer S5/2 five speed hubs for most of my utility riding since the late 1970's.
For the choice of transmission I considered 4 possibilities:
- shaft drive. Not possible on a Thorn, but can be found. Advantage : no chain or belt to clean. Major disadvantage : significantly less efficient. Not a problem on a BMW motorbike with a big engine, but important with the limited power from my legs. I have ridden a shaft-drive bicycle for a short distance.
- belt drive. At the time, I couldn't see much advantage in a belt drive, in 2010 they were less common than now and there were still a few teething problems. And having brothers who used Mercedes vans with timing chains instead of belts I am convinced that a protected chain is at least as good as a belt as far as longevity is concerned. I don't think there is much difference in efficiency between the two systems if they are correctly set up. And a chain is much cheaper and easier to replace on tour if necessary.
- unprotected chain drive. What I had been using for over 40 years. Cheap, simple to replace, easy to find on tour (at least in Europe), but with the major disadvantage that the chain/chainring/sprockets/derailleurs pick up muck if used in wet or dirty conditions. Eliminating the derailleurs and multiple sprockets/chainrings by fitting a hub gear improves things significantly as the chain is higher and picks up less muck, so slightly less need to clean, and cleaning is much easier with only 1 chainring and sprocket and no little derailleur pulleys. There is probably a slight efficiency drop with a hub gear as compared to a clean, unworn derailleur system, but not enough to put me off. My experience over decades of running a hub gear utility bike and a 15-speed derailleur touring bike meant that I considered the hub gear bike to be actually more efficient if maintenance time and riding time are combined.
- chain drive with chaincase. Having ridden Dutch style hire bikes I wanted a chaincase, at least for my utility bike. But all the ones I had seen or tried had issues, they rubbed on part of the transmission and made a noise, were quite bulky, difficult to fit and dismantle (for example to change a worn tyre. Punctures can usually be repaired without removing the rear wheel). So I never got round to fitting one until reading the Chainglider posts by Andre Jute on this forum. After my tests on the utility bike, I decided that I would specify chain drive and Chainglider for my first Thorn, with the option of chucking the Chainglider away and reverting to unprotected chain drive if it didn't work out for me in touring conditions. A Chainglider is relatively cheap compared to a belt drive. In my experience it doesn't completely stop muck or water from getting at the chain, but it seems to me to be a pretty good compromise, reducing the need for chain maintenance and significantly extending the longevity of transmission parts, at least in my riding circumstances. Compared to other chain enclosures, with a little practice it is quick and easy to remove, for example to change a worn tyre.
Since 2010, there have been improvements in belt drive. But it is still more expensive (initially) than chain drive, and, in my opinion, less easy to set up and maintain if something does go wrong.
And with the rise in popularity of electric bikes, there have also been improvments in unprotected chain drive, the KMC wide sprocket/chainring and chain combination is guaranteed for a minimum of 10,000 kms. I would have been tempted by this if it had been available 10 years ago.
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I've pedalled 2000 miles since putting a chainglider on my Mercury last October - details here http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=13973.0 . The two challenges were (i) finding a suitable chainring (Thorn's standard aluminium ring is too thick) and (ii) the need to cut a bit out of the rear section to provide clearance on the chainstay. My local roads get pretty filthy during the winter months and the chainglider has helped to protect the chain. However, as noted above, it doesn't keep out all muck - I think the main entry point is the loose fit around the rear sprocket. The other attraction of the chainglider is elimination of the risk of getting oily muck on the trousers. I've used a hacksaw to cut a couple of marks on the chainglider where the two parts fit together so I know the right setting for refitting after removal.
As for disc brakes: After getting my first bike with disc brakes I quickly realised that I valued the reliable stopping with no obvious disadvantages. Thorn make the point about needing stronger forks but offer the option of disc on rear and V brake on front (visible on some of the bikes at https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/new-used-cycles-frames ).
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Let me suggest something to you. I can't help but think that you're making a mistake by going at this process piecemeal, asking about this component and that component; that is why the Thorn bikes have suggested setups -- and, this is very important, they are tailored to your purpose with the bike and your desired/required posture on the bike. This is a design outlook commonly associated with Andy Blance, in my not so humble opinion the best bike designer working in Britain in the last twenty or more years, recently retired -- but the bikes Thorn sells are his designs and specifications, which start from fitting the bike properly to the cyclist. Without a proper fit, you're buying a lot of pain very expensively. You've come by planning or luck to a designer and vendor with a brilliant understanding of the gestalt of a proper bicycle, and you're subverting it by considering the pieces before the whole, which risks undermining the advantage you've gained by coming to the right place and people.
You've decided you want a touring bike, and it has to perform some other named functions; you presumably know your local bicycling topology; you know how you want sit on the bike or how your back will allow you to sit. Thorn has so many variants of their bikes that you can fine-tune your choice of bike to your desired posture a.k.a. the perfect fit. But you won't do that if you're concerned about your image on the bike. Generally speaking, I'd say that in the Thorn price range, you're best served by an attitude that says, "When you can understand a bike like my Thorn, I'll care about what you think of how I appear."
I share your preference for long wheelbases. My favourite bike for the last dozen years is a 29er over two metres long on which I make remarkable speed downhill on tiny country lanes because I've set it up for a safe margin of understeer; the local peloton frighten themselves poopless trying to keep up with a greybeard on a prewar priest's bike. I sit as upright as is possible without putting my spine in direct line with the bumps coming up the frame.
I'd suggest that you listen seriously to Robin Thorn's suggestion, and then ask him if a longer wheelbase can be adapted to the same posture on the bike. (I did it with a very wide Brooks saddle and North Road bars bringing the grips back to me without me leaning forward to reach the grips.) But you'd better be sure you're willing to pay some price for leaving behind the certainty of all that experience by actual tourers that go into the Thorn bikes.
In fact, while I'm trying to help you achieve your purpose as stated here, if it were me in your enviable position, I wouldn't try to outguess Andy Blance and Robin Thorn. I'd take the suggested bike and outfitting after ascertaining that the 100 days free trial still operates, ride the bike for 99 days, and then, if still enamoured of a longer wheelbase, give it back and buy the longer wheelbase instead, and start experimenting with handlebars, stems and saddles -- and with the much greater knowledge gained in the process -- in order to maintain the posture proven successful with the "correct" maximally fitted SWB bike on the new longer wheelbase by bringing the handlebar grips closer to me after adjusting the seat to put my feet on the pedals and knees over them to be the same as on the shorter wheelbase. It can be done -- my bikes are all set up to within a millimetre in three dimensions -- but it takes enough time to be a hobby in its own right and it can get pricey enough to give Dan the shivers, though I don't care as I think that entire cycling concept of getting every last inch of wear out of every component belongs to an age when a bicycle was a poor man's essential transport rather than a comfortable man's lifestyle accoutrement (good bikes are today obscenely expensive!). I have no hesitation in saying that experimenting for the dozen years before I got my perfect bike with other bikes of various wheelbases persuaded me that the extra cost of developing the long wheelbase bike to the singular zero-compromise perfect fit has been proven well worth it. But my best guess is that after a 100 days they'll have to pry the perfect-fitting bike from your cold dead fingers because you won't want to take the chance that anything else won't fit as well.
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To return to the specifics of this particular thread, the Hebie Chainglider, once you know what transmission range you want the Rohloff to cover in its 14 gears (we generally work in gear inches here, e.g. 19-90 gear inches), you can determine which of the standard gear sets Thorn offers on their semi-custom bikes will suit both you and a Chainglider and choose that. In general, you want to choose the largest (most teeth) combination of sprocket and chainring that makes the right ratio, because larger chainrings and sprockets help chains to last longer, and last longer themselves. Note however that you can fit a Chainglider later -- no tools are required and it is extremely simple to snap on--, so don't waste time arguing the case with Mr Thorn, who clearly doesn't trust the thing (or perhaps its makers, who gave a member of this forum embarrassingly poor advice), despite the good experience a good number of his customers have had with it.
Good luck with your bike to be!
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I am convinced that a protected chain is at least as good as a belt as far as longevity is concerned.
I just don’t see how this is possible. Chains don't wear out because of contamination on the chain, the thing that a Chainglider protects against. They wear out because they stretch over time, and they start to wear down the chainring and cog.
A belt drive will give you a good 30,000 km of life, a statistic that has been proven now by numerous RTW and Alaska–Ushuaia expeditions. Even if you somehow managed to get that enormous distance out of a chain, surely you would then need to replace the chainring and cog by the end. With a Gates belt drive, on the other hand, you just pop the belt off your existing chainring and cog and just put a new belt on them (with the way things are now – earlier Gates systems required more frequent cog replacement).
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Quote from: martinf on Today at 12:33:51 AM
I am convinced that a protected chain is at least as good as a belt as far as longevity is concerned.
I just don’t see how this is possible. Chains don't wear out because of contamination on the chain, the thing that a Chainglider protects against. They wear out because they stretch over time, and they start to wear down the chainring and cog.
Chains don't really stretch (like a rubber band); they elongate through wear of all their components, primarily the rollers and the pins they ride on. The tolerances increase as a result of wear coming from two sources:
1) friction from lack of lubrication (not just a dry chain but from oil failing to protect due to rain water washout)
...and...
2) contamination (dirt mixes with oil and makes a very efficient grinding paste).
A chain elongated through wear changes pitch; it is this pitch mismatch that wears down the chainring and cog.
If a chain is protected from environmental factors and can retain its lubrication, wear is greatly reduced. This is why timing chains can last so long on internal combustion engines, often handily exceeding that of timing belts. When I owned and operated my automobile repair shop in another life, it was common for chains to far outlast belts. Woe betide the sorry soul who exceeded the belt replacement interval on an engine with interference design. The eventual day when valves shook hands with pistons was never a good one.
Best,
Dan.
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Dan, what you say may be true in theory, but do we have much real-world support for it? Can you link to any accounts where a tourer has cycled 30,000 km on a single Chainglider-protected chain and, at the end, did not have to replace the cog and chainring as well?
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Although the belt might not wear out for 30,000km, you'll need to carry a spare belt in case of accidental damage(eg something gets caught in the teeth and makes a cut). Should that accident happen, then you'll be wanting a new spare. They aren't so easy to find (SJS only has some sizes in stock https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/chains/108t-1188mm-gates-carbon-drive-cdx-centertrack-belt-black/ ). With a chain it's only necessary to carry a couple of spare missing links although it's unusual for chains to break rather than wear out. For the cost of a belt you can buy several chains, a couple of spare sprockets and a spare chainring.
Another disadvantage of belts is, should you want to change the gearing, then there's the cost of the new belt in addition to the new chainwheel or sprocket. I've been there.
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Let me echo Martinf's comments, with the adjustment that I have a Raven, bought in 2014.
My spec is a 17 x 36 sprocket and ring combination, with a Chainglider. I used Surly stainless steel rings at the front until 2019. These are sturdy, and thin enough to work with the 'glider. In my experience, however, their quality is uneven -- I've found them to create a pronounced tight spot in the chain, for example.
I now use an alloy ring sold by Rivendell Bike Works -- Origin8 makes the rings for RBW. These rings create no discernible tight spot -- first time I've ever seen this in a lifetime of riding chain-driven two-wheelers.
Lastly, an anecdote to confirm Martin's observation that a chain is much cheaper and easier to replace on tour if necessary.
This is just one anecdote, but it's real, and I suggest is an important signal:
A friend-of-friend bought an expensive custom touring bike c/w Rohloff a couple of years ago, and rode it across Canada from Vancouver to Halifax. The ride took rather longer than planned: crossing the Rockies, she realized that her bike was way overgeared. (Her prep had been done in Ontario, where we have hills-a-plenty, but no mountains.) She reached Jasper, in Central Alberta, and decided before riding south on the Icefields Parkway, that she wanted to lower her gearing. Ummmm, problem was that she was using a Gates belt. Replacing belt and sprocket took two-weeks-plus.
By comparison, a cycling acquaintance following the same route in 2017 faced exactly the same problem in the same place. Key difference was that his wife's bike was Rohloff-equipped, but with a chain and a Surly ring. He contacted me, and I suggested he get in touch with a bike shop in Vancouver, and ask them to courier a 36T ring to jasper. It arrived overnight, and by noon he and his wife were riding south on the parkway, a delay of 3 hours. (As compensation, her load was lighter by the weight of one chain link.)
Cheers, John
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I am convinced that a protected chain is at least as good as a belt as far as longevity is concerned.
I just don’t see how this is possible. Chains don't wear out because of contamination on the chain, the thing that a Chainglider protects against.
Mine do.
My record for wearing out a chain (to past the recommended 1% wear) is 541 kms, on a derailleur bike used for loaded touring in bad weather on sandy tracks. My best on a derailleur bike used for loaded touring is 7,762 kms, I don't remember the weather, but I am certain it wasn't on sandy tracks.
There are tests using various lubricants and various simulated conditions such as clean and dry, dusty and dry, wet. The ones I have seen show that wear increases a lot in wet, dirty conditions, which reflects my own experience.
In my experience a Chainglider does help in wet, dirty conditions, but I haven't had enough experience in dry dusty conditions to say whether it helps there.
In clean, dry conditions it probably makes no difference, but I rarely have clean, dry conditions for very long on my rides.
One exception, my old derailleur gear tourer. I now only use this for local day rides in good weather, and as the tyres are narrow (28 mm) I keep to reasonably good roads and cycle paths.
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Dan, what you say may be true in theory, but do we have much real-world support for it? Can you link to any accounts where a tourer has cycled 30,000 km on a single Chainglider-protected chain and, at the end, did not have to replace the cog and chainring as well?
This is a good question to which I can say, "I don't know". ;)
I do remember Stuart (Stutho), highly esteemed Forum Admin before me, was not given to exaggeration and was a careful record-keeper. His mileage for an uncovered chain in all sorts of Welsh weather was remarkably high...
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=4308.msg20147#msg20147
...with projections for even more possible witnh careful selection of components...
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=2239.msg10746#msg10746
10,000+ miles' chain life on one side of a sprocket and chainring with projections of 20,000mi per chain for an optimized derivetrain is remarkable for an open system. I wonder if the greater figure might indeed be possible...?
Best,
Dan.
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MartinF
Yeah, I’m the type of guy that has to analyse everything to death 10 times over and it probably drives people nuts 😁
But in my defence, when I finally make decision , I’m always happy and feel like I made the right choice.
There so many parts on a bike and so many options. Which means more time needed to scrutinise
My suspicion is that for what I will probably do with the bike , a Raven would maybe suit me better and I like them , but i also like the nomad and the heavy duty and even overbuilt ness of it . I’m about 16 stone and could get heavier (hope not!) so a big tank of a big that can go anywhere I might want appeals to me. Obviously the Ravens are no more which means I’m looking at a used bike.
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Andre
Totally agree with you on the fitting of the bike being priority 😊
Communication is a bit of a minefield sometimes via the written word
Often I poke fun at myself and throw in a little honest transparency by “thinking out loud”
I will let y’all into a little secret , I would rather buy a nomad mk2 than a mk3 because I want black paint 😆😆😆 (***running to hide under the bed***)
But I would not compromise on the fitting
So it will be a silver mk3 if I can’t get a mk2 in my perfect size/setup
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Dan, what you say may be true in theory, but do we have much real-world support for it? Can you link to any accounts where a tourer has cycled 30,000 km on a single Chainglider-protected chain and, at the end, did not have to replace the cog and chainring as well?
This is a good question to which I can say, "I don't know". ;)
I do remember Stuart (Stutho), highly esteemed Forum Admin before me, was not given to exaggeration and was a careful record-keeper. His mileage for an uncovered chain in all sorts of Welsh weather was remarkably high...
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=4308.msg20147#msg20147
...with projections for even more possible witnh careful selection of components...
http://thorncyclesforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=2239.msg10746#msg10746
10,000+ miles' chain life on one side of a sprocket and chainring with projections of 20,000mi per chain for an optimized derivetrain is remarkable for an open system. I wonder if the greater figure might indeed be possible...?
Best,
Dan.
Dan, those links were really useful to digest. Thanks for sharing them.
My own chainglider was fitted to a 5000km old chain that had been ridden open on a reversed sprocket at time of fitting. The chain had got incredibly messy while open- due to my daily commute taking me through forested paths in all manner of weather situations. I was having to clean my chain of oily crud regularly (once or twice a week sometimes) until I switched to waxing the chain @ around 3000km into its life which ran far cleaner and allowed me 4-6 weeks (up to 1000km) between rewaxing. With the chainglider fitted around 5000km into chain's life I got just over 1000km with wax, but as wax 'falls off' as chain is used, I reverted to oil under the chainglider since around 6000km into chain's life. I removed my winter spikes at the weekend and fitted my regular tyres back on, and saw that the oiled chain is still pretty clean despite approx 2500 km since oiling it and despite winter cycling conditions. It didn't really need new oil, but as I had the chainglider open, I cleaned and reoiled just to stop the OCD mini Steve in my head nagging me later. But I am convinced the chainglider extends chain life by keeping most water and crud away from your running gear. And the wife is happy that my trousers stay cleaner too, which in itself is worth more than the cost of a new chain.
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My suspicion is that for what I will probably do with the bike , a Raven would maybe suit me better and I like them , but i also like the nomad and the heavy duty and even overbuilt ness of it . I’m about 16 stone and could get heavier (hope not!) so a big tank of a big that can go anywhere I might want appeals to me. Obviously the Ravens are no more which means I’m looking at a used bike.
You are not wrong to consider your own weight when choosing the right bike. I don't know how it is done in the UK, but in Germany new bike info generally shows the total authorized weight INCLUDING rider, baggage and bicycle to help you select the right bike for you. It is not just about your height and inside leg measurement- but a frame that can carry you and your luggage.
I once bought a 'discounter' bike that otherwise had reasonable looking components on it- and with a 14 days no quibble return. Bike details was total weight including rider of 100kg. I think I was around 100kg (approx 16 stone) at time of purchase- and quickly discovered that the bike was not nice to ride. The chain skipped under duress and the frame didn't feel that solid. Bike was returned. If I had kept bike, I just wouldn't have cycled as it was not a nice experience.
I then went to a real bike shop with knowledgeable staff and spent double the price on a similar looking bike- but made to carry up to 115kg. I probably should have gone a tad higher on the rating as with me+bike+bike bag I'd have been topping 120-125kg. But 20 years later, I still have that bike frame and forks in use and they still perform fine. Most of the components have worn out during that time and been replaced though. I am in no doubt that components will wear quicker with a heavier rider too as they will get more stress applied as you ride.
Although above mentioned bike is still great, and works fine, my Rohloff journey began 2 years ago when I was 49, 5'9 tall and my weight had crept up to 19 stone and suffered a stroke cause by a thrombosis. I've been a keen cyclist since my mid 20s, but had dropped from around 5000-8000km a year down to less than 100km- always putting off starting a fitness/weight loss program 'until tomorrow'. Those extra kg didn't appear overnight, but gradually as my lifestyle became more sedentary but my appetite for food had not changed since I cut down on cycling so frequently. Simple maths. If calories in exceed calories out, your weight will climb. As will your health risks.
I wasn't fit enough to cycle after my stroke. In fact I was 6 months off work. Post convalescence, my GP encouraged me to walk every day, rain or shine. I was so proud to wear the soles out on my trainers. I set a target to walk 10,000 steps/day. Then I upped my game to 16,000 every day- on average, but often way higher. I started to ride my (old) bike about 18 months ago and set myself a target that if I could get 1000 miles on my bike before my birthday, then I would reward myself with a Rohloff hubbed bike for my 50th birthday to encourage me with something new and shiny to keep my cycling. I got my birthday present 2 months early and I have made myself ride that bike every day (and I've enjoyed it too) rain or shine since then.
Back to bikes and total approved weight. The Rohloff hub is the perfect hub for tandems. And these are often with total approved weight of 200kg+. So a heavier person riding such a bike is not a problem for the hub. Chains/sprockets might wear a little quicker than a lighter person would manage- but the hubs are very reliable and highly suited to such demands.
Don't just invest in your bike purchase. You've asked a lot of questions about various aspects of getting yourself this new bike. Keep that enthusiasm once you pull the trigger and purchase- and start to ride your bike regularly. Make sure your bike is suitably sized even if not custom made (e.g. 2nd hand) for carrying you today and for the future.
16 months after purchasing my non-Thorn Rohloff hubbed bike, I've ridden almost 9000km. The cycling combined with a healthier lifestyle means my weight has dropped by around 5 stones since my stroke. But having a bike that is enjoyable and comfortable to ride because it is designed to carry someone of your stature will encourage you to use it, and perhaps help you maintain or even lose weight in the process, rather than letting it creep up over the years as it did with me- until almost too late.
In my opinion, better to take your time and find the right bike for you, and make it your 'forever bike' than to just purchase and then regret down the line that you did not do your due diligence before parting with a not-unsubstantial amount of money for this steed if something was not quite how you wanted it. And if you do go 2nd hand (which I think you have mentioned in a couple of threads) decide on what factors you will compromise on if not exactly the specification you want. I really wanted disc brakes, but have learned to really love the HS11/HS33 Magura rim brakes that came on my bike that I know longer pine for discs.
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Steve
Great read, good to hear you recovered and doing well. Thanks for sharing
Yeah, long term health is definitely on my priority list. I’m 41 now and go through phases of eating well and exercising then falling off the wagon as it were. No matter what weight loss regime I try I find it hard to get it off and keep it off. Even with strict discipline . I could eat the same thing every day if I knew it would give me results. I think lack of sleep really effects weight loss/recovery /muscle gain. Hormones and s ask that jazz. I do a lot of fasting over the years, so that is a quick and easy way to lose some pounds as a side benefit . Hopefully once the kids are a bit older in the next few years il be able to get into a proper routine and get the body fat percentage down and the muscle mass up 😊
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Steve
Great read, good to hear you recovered and doing well. Thanks for sharing
Yeah, long term health is definitely on my priority list. I’m 41 now and go through phases of eating well and exercising then falling off the wagon as it were. No matter what weight loss regime I try I find it hard to get it off and keep it off. Even with strict discipline . I could eat the same thing every day if I knew it would give me results. I think lack of sleep really effects weight loss/recovery /muscle gain. Hormones and s ask that jazz. I do a lot of fasting over the years, so that is a quick and easy way to lose some pounds as a side benefit . Hopefully once the kids are a bit older in the next few years il be able to get into a proper routine and get the body fat percentage down and the muscle mass up 😊
Everyone is different. I was never a sweet tooth, but rather fond of carbs. On rehab they advised NEVER to cut out food groups or to leave yourself feeling hungry- but to balance your plate better with less carbs and more greens as a lifestyle change. By eating all food groups you shouldn't get the cravings that help you fall off the wagon. And by filling your stomach with a healthier balance of foods you don't feel empty after a meal.
A real eye opener for me was the "Lose It" app. Even with the free version (which I use) you can set your current weight age and your weight goal (e.g. lose 1lb every 14 days). It then tracks your steps and you can enter other sports manually (on free version) or link to smart functions on paid to track that. The app gives a recommended calorie intake for each day and tracking is as easy as scanning the bar code of what you are eating. If it is not in the database you can photo the nutritional info and it self populates and uploads for other users to use. If it is without a barcode, you can enter the portion size (e.g. 100g pasta or 200g homemade cake).
This helps you see where the hidden calories are. For me it was bread and pasta. And once I opened a packet of tortillas or Pringles, I would not stop until finished.
Other than regular sport (on yer bike!) the only big lifestyle changes I have made (and my family have been forced to it by default) is that we have reduced carbs in our main meals by around 25% less and replaced that with more fresh and/or froze veg. And where I used to eat sandwiches for lunch, I now take a large (approx 600g) home made salad mix each day to work and have a simple 90% balsamic vinegar to 10% oil dressing over some herbs and spices with it- having almost had a coronary seeing how creamy salad dressings/mayo often make a healthy salad more calorific than a kebab or burger meal!
Pizza night for the family used to be two 30cm pizzas. Now we have one 30cm pizza and a side salad with simple dressing as per my lunch. Sunday dinner just has an extra side veg next to a smaller pile of roast potatoes. I just eat bread at weekends now. As for tortillas or Pringles, I simply stopped buying them. I always have a fresh fruit bowl for snacking, and it is amazing to find that I was never actually hungry for those salty snacks- but just munched too regularly out of habit and from their addictive nature.
It is a lifestyle change that works for me. I have had no big cravings as I still eat all my favourite foods- albeit with an abundance of fill-me-up healthier sides. And I have learned to love salad lunches (the only big change) Mon-Fri which do fill me up- but which were more of a challenge to get away from the cheese and marmite sandwiches I've eaten daily since I was a child. But to keep the pounds off, you need to make it a permanent change (at best with your family joining the regime) which crash or fad diets rarely do. By making healthy eating the new norm, you should be able to shed some pounds and keep them off.
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Everyone is different. I was never a sweet tooth, but rather fond of carbs. On rehab they advised NEVER to cut out food groups or to leave yourself feeling hungry- but to balance your plate better with less carbs and more greens as a lifestyle change. By eating all food groups you shouldn't get the cravings that help you fall off the wagon. And by filling your stomach with a healthier balance of foods you don't feel empty after a meal.
We've venturing off topic but I find raw vegetables such as carrots an excellent way of placating a stomach by giving it something to work on for a while and keep quiet. Plus there's no loss of nutrients such as occurs with cooking.