Thorn Cycles Forum

Community => Thorn General => Topic started by: JanieB on February 02, 2018, 09:47:50 am

Title: Warranty
Post by: JanieB on February 02, 2018, 09:47:50 am
Glorious day down here in Glasgow!

We have made up our minds and will be making our way over to Thorn in late May to get measured, and fitted and what not after which new bikes will be ordered. Exciting! So obviously the bikes won't be serviced by Thorn every time how does this influence the warranty of the bike and also that of the Rohloff hub?

Thank you to everyone who weighed in with their advice, it really helped a lot.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: geocycle on February 02, 2018, 11:43:28 am
I think the short answer is that it doesn't.  Just follow the rohloff oil change instructions.  I'm sure someone will point you to Thorn's T and C's

Just remember that a Late May order might mean you'll miss a big chunk of the summer riding after you take into consideration delivery times.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: aggs on February 02, 2018, 11:50:07 am
Servicing is very straight forward any LBS could do it if you are unwilling.

No gears to adjust or need tinkering with :) so that one less thing to worry about!

Roholff oil change is easy to do. I do mine annually from the date of buying the bike.
But may need more depending on mileage or sub merging in water!!     (SJS sell a kit for each oil change.)

Worth keeping a record and dates of oil changes for the Roholff warranty.

I am sure SJScycles will fill you on the details. 



Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: mickeg on February 02, 2018, 06:27:41 pm
Thorn does not like kickstands, so if you planned to install, discuss that with SJS first.

The oil change kit includes all parts you need, but I do not recall if it included a 3mm allen wrench or not.

The 250ml bottles of oil are more cost effective than a couple new oil change kits every year.  So once you have done one, if you plan to continue doing your own you might want to buy the bigger bottles.  But you will need a regular oil change kit to get some of the supplies that you use.  I put a new coating of loctite on my drain screw in the hub for each oil change I do, I do not replace the drain screw each time.  But buying a few spares would not be a bad idea.

If you are not very mechanical, ask them to show you how to adjust chain tension by adjusting the eccentric.

If you plan to do any far off trips on the bikes, ask them what spares and supplies you might want to also carry with you.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: julk on February 02, 2018, 09:56:49 pm
JB,
Welcome in advance to the Thorn fold.
It you get a rohloff bike with mudguards and a chainglider fitted then you are in for a very low maintenance machine.
The major work with mine, except for the annual oil change, is occasionally checking the tyres and pumping them up a bit.

If you need help or a look at a Rohloff Thorn a bit sooner then I am near Edinburgh, PM me if needed.
Julian.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: bobs on February 03, 2018, 08:43:22 am
Hi,

Kinetics in Maryhill is a very good bike shop and can do all your servicing.

Bob
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: JanieB on February 05, 2018, 02:01:21 pm
Thank you all once again for the feedback.

Yes due to exams and all that fun stuff, we won't be riding earlier than that, so late May it is. I am sure I can manage the oil changes, also work for a cycling charity, so more than one bike mechanic roaming the premises.

I have read bits and bobs about the chain glider, never seen one in real life, another something to investigate while we are there and the same with a kickstand, never owned a bike with one.

On quite another note, one of said mechanics pointed out the other day the repairing a puncture when riding a Rohloff hub is not a standard or easy procedure. I just nodded my head and decided to rather speak to the people here that actually own bikes and have repaired punctures. Is there anything we need to be aware of?

Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: Donerol on February 05, 2018, 02:49:46 pm
On any bike, fixing a rear wheel puncture is more fiddly than the front.  With the Rohloff hub you have to disconnect the changer cables first, before you can get the wheel out, but it is not difficult. You just need to remember to set either 1st or 14th before you disconnect - that way it is easy to reconnect them correctly when you've finished.

I have the internal mech, with the accordion cables - I believe the Ex box may be simpler. Even so, when I recently had to fix my first rear puncture I found it straightforward and if anything easier than on a derailleur system, where the mechs fold up and tangle, and there is yards of chain flopping everywhere!
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: julk on February 05, 2018, 04:27:27 pm
JB,
As Donerol says removing the rear wheel is a bit of work - but only if you need to change the inner tube.
Otherwise just work on the bit of inner tube needing attention by taking it out between rim and tyre.

If you take the rear wheel out and you have a chainglider then the rear section of the chainglider has to come off but the rest of it stays in place and covers the chain nicely and stops you spreading chain oil around.

Careful choice of tyre and a bit of luck and you may never have to do any of this  ;)
Julian.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: geocycle on February 05, 2018, 05:06:28 pm

On quite another note, one of said mechanics pointed out the other day the repairing a puncture when riding a Rohloff hub is not a standard or easy procedure. I just nodded my head and decided to rather speak to the people here that actually own bikes and have repaired punctures. Is there anything we need to be aware of?

I disagree.  Other than disconnecting the bayonet fixings on the rohloff cables it is very easy.  This is no more difficult than say loosening a QR on a v-brake as long as you keep them nice and slack. Without derailleurs to foul and yards of chain it is possibly a bit easier.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: mickeg on February 05, 2018, 06:18:04 pm
Not sure which Rohloff you would be getting, the EX box version or the internal cable version.

I have only experience with teh EX box version.  Very simple.  I always do it with the bike upside down, saddle and handlebars on the ground.  Put teh shifter in a gear that you will remember, usually 1 or 14.  Unscrew the thumbscrew to remove the EX box, and remove it.  It is still attached to the bike with the cables, so just let it hang loose.  Undo the quick release (same as dérailleur bikes).  If you have a rim brake, it is best to disconnect the brake cable so the brake pads to not hang up (same with dérailleur bikes).  Lift the wheel out of the frame and take the chain off of the wheel (just like with derailleur bikes).

Fix your flat. 

Do everything in reverse order.  When putting the wheel back in, there is a torque arrestor that has to be slide into the dropout, once you have done it once you will know what i mean, it takes 3 seconds to make sure it is done right.  But check to make sure your shifter is in the gear you put it in before re-attaching the EX box first in case you bumped your shifter while the wheel was out, this is a step I always forget to do.

If you have a wide tire, it is best to add air after the tire is in the frame so that it clears the brake pads easier with a deflated tire.

The internal gear version has slightly different procedures.

Some bikes that do not use the Rohloff dedicated dropouts could be much more complicated, so perhaps the mechanic had experience with a different brand of bike?  For example, many other brands would involve a chain tensioner or sliding dropouts or something else.  Thorns have dropouts designed for Rohloffs and that simplifies it.

I also ride several bikes with derailleurs, I find pulling out the rear wheel on the Rohloff bike to be about the same.

It is also possible that the mechanic was clueless but trying to sound knowledgeable.  I occasionally see that.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: Tiberius on February 05, 2018, 06:41:54 pm
On quite another note, one of said mechanics pointed out the other day the repairing a puncture when riding a Rohloff hub is not a standard or easy procedure.

That is simply not true.

As 'mickeg' says, it is dead easy to remove/replace the rear wheel on a frame that is Rohloff dedicated. My Surly is not a dedicated Rohloff frame so it is a touch more difficult to remove/replace the rear wheel...but it really isn't THAT much more difficult.

Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: Danneaux on February 05, 2018, 07:28:37 pm
I've found rear wheel changes are quick and easy as can be with either the internal shift-box (two cables to deal with) or the external shift-box (only a thumbscrew to undo and refasten). I've used both extensively and found them to be different but equal and equally easy in practice.

My method is to first shift into Gear 1 or 14, release the rear brake cable, then either undo the two gear cables (internal shifter) or undo the thumbscrew on the external shifter.

I then lay the bike on its left side (no risk of saddle scarring or the bike falling over), left pedal up, and reach under to undo the hub quick release. I then ease the wheel out of the dropouts and leave the chain still draped over the chainring.

I then repair the puncture as usual and put my (wide tire, so generally uninflated to clear the brakes) wheel back in the frame, hooking the chain over the sprocket with a stick or similar to keep hands clean as I slide the axle into the dropouts. A quick reach under to secure the quick-release and then tip the bike upright to tighten the thumbscrew onto the external shifter (or refasten the two loose cables on the internal shifter) and reinsert the noodle on the v-brake, reset the brake lever release and...done.

I just did this yesterday and was again amazed at how trouble-free it was compared to the same operation on one of my derailleur bikes. I've found the above procedure even faster and easier with panniers in place due to greater ground clearance with the bike on its side.

Best,

Dan.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: mickeg on February 05, 2018, 08:31:14 pm
Sideways, getting the wheel fully set into place is not a given.  If I used Dans method, when I got to the point where he was done and the bike upright, I would release the quick release, make sure that the wheel is fully set in the dropouts (with the bike upright, gravity does the work) and re-tighten.  Ten seconds at most.

Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: Danneaux on February 05, 2018, 09:07:26 pm
Yep. I do that too, though most times find it wasn't needed.

Best,

Dan.
Title: Rear wheel punctures
Post by: JanieB on February 06, 2018, 02:39:25 pm
Ok, so I do not think it will be an issue.

We will be getting 26" wheels and as for which Rohloff hub we are getting I am not sure. However, reading over the procedure as described by several users it actually sounds less of a flap than with a derailleur.  New skills broaden the mind!
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: Andre Jute on February 06, 2018, 11:47:48 pm
Thorn does not like kickstands, so if you planned to install, discuss that with SJS first.

The oil change kit includes all parts you need, but I do not recall if it included a 3mm allen wrench or not....


If you plan to do any far off trips on the bikes, ask them what spares and supplies you might want to also carry with you.

You need your own Allen key for the oil change operation; there isn't one in the kit. What else isn't in the kit is glue to fix the tube to the syringe.

The Rohloff manual is very comprehensive. It lists, at p124 of the English manual (which you can download on the net from the Rohloff site), all the tools the entire Rohloff system needs. Any multitool will usually have everything a Rohloff needs, excepting

***a 2mm Allen key
***a 2.5mm Allen key
***a really good quality (I order several of the German Witte brand at once so as to have spares) T20, repeat T20 (not T25!) Torx key and
*** if the Rohloff is fitted with the EXT external gear change clicker, an 8mm open spanner or socket to be driven with the multitool's 6mm Allen; the purpose of the 8mm open spanner or socket (with driver of some kind) is to change gear on the gearbox in case your cable breaks.

Someone was saying here the other day that he carries a small adjustable spanner for the duty the 8mm socket/spanner does but I don't much fancy working on a thousand pounds plus of Rohloff under adverse circumstances (in the dark and wet or snow beside a narrow road full of speeding lorries, say) with an adjustable spanner.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: John Saxby on February 06, 2018, 11:50:35 pm
Welcome, Janie, to the world of Thorns and Rohloffs.

I'll not re-cover the ground already mapped above, other than to say that changing a tube on my Raven-mit-Roholff is no problem.

One suggestion, which you may want to review with SJSC when you get your bikes:  I've replaced my quick-release skewers with Halowheel "slow-release" skewers, both fore and aft. I found that my rear QR tended to loosen, although the front remained snug. The Halowheel fixed the problem at the rear. (The Halowheels use a 5mm hex key.)

Good luck, and enjoy,

Cheers,  John
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: John Saxby on February 06, 2018, 11:59:40 pm
One other suggestion, Janie:  You do not need to get a kickstand for your bikes. Many of us use something called a "Clickstand", a separate segmented & shock-corded pole which fits under the top tube of your bike.  Here's the link: http://www.click-stand.com/ (http://www.click-stand.com/)

There are pros and cons and preferences, but I've found that this is a good solution to the propping-it-up problem, esp if you don't have walls, trees, for fences handy.

I mention this because it just popped up again in another thread below, "Stand reinforcement".
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: mickeg on February 07, 2018, 02:45:35 am
I repeat my suggestion, you should discuss spares and tools with SJS if you plan to go to far off places with the bikes.  That discussion should include pumps too.

...
One suggestion, which you may want to review with SJSC when you get your bikes:  I've replaced my quick-release skewers with Halowheel "slow-release" skewers, both fore and aft. I found that my rear QR tended to loosen, although the front remained snug. The Halowheel fixed the problem at the rear. (The Halowheels use a 5mm hex key.)
...

I never heard of slow release skewers.  Do you mean these?
https://halo-usa.com/products/hl9011

I have those, but in black.  I use the XL because the Thorn dropouts are pretty thick.  The front, I cut it down in length however, it was too long.

Around home I use the quick release, I am very fortunate to live in an area with minimal theft.  But on tours I use the Halo bolt on skewers because you need a wrench to separate an expensive wheel from the frame.  I assume most thieves are opportunists and do not carry around a 5mm wrench.  If I had one of the ones with a special key like a Pitlock, I am most certain I would lose it.  That is why I prefer the ones like the Halo that use any 5mm allen wrench.
Title: Re: Warranty
Post by: John Saxby on February 07, 2018, 11:26:51 am
Yep, those are the items, George. Very good products.

Quote
I never heard of slow release skewers.

I wish I could claim authorship of the phrase, but I can't: I liked the play on words, the contrast with "quick-release", but as I recall, I first heard it used by Robert Ewing, on crazyguy.